A most difficult thread- helping a friend, Bill Hedin
 

Hey Folks
I am not sure where to start this so let me just dive right in. It was brought to my attention yesterday evening that Bill Hedin (Hi Bill) has been buying and selling cards on ebay during this time of tragedy in his life. While I of course have no issue with that there are members whose monies I have collected, for a memorial fund, to help Bill in his time of need. That being said it is up to each donor to have a peaceful feeling in their generous endeavor. I spoke with Bill this morning concerning the ebay activity and he told me he shares his account with 2 other relatives. I can't say what is the right or wrong thing to do in a time of tragedy, but it is my responsibility to let the board know what I know so each person can be comfortable with their decisions. Bill told me most of the buying and selling on his account was done by the relatives though a few things were for himself too. If anyone would prefer not to donate, who already has, they can email me at leonl@flash.net and I will do a refund for them. If a check is coming I will be glad to return it too. Please email me about any thoughts you have or for the polite refunds and ALL will stay confidential.

Leon and I have been talking pretty much all day, and since I initiated the drive to raise money for Bill, I feel it necessary to add a little something. I fully understand the concept of donating to a cause without any strings attached. But I did have a small string attached to mine: I wanted Bill to use the money to help pay for his wife's funeral expenses. I can't say that isn't where the money will go, but I distinctly remember seeing a post that Bill made stating he may have to sell his entire collection to pay for it. So when I found out this morning that he has been buying cards on a daily basis, I had a little bit of a knot in the pit of my stomach.

One can buy baseball cards even in a difficult time, there is no ethical line being crossed. But I didn't feel good when I heard this news. I think I will still give Bill the money I put into the fund for him. I do believe at least most of it will go where it was intended. But I know I would not have given it to him to buy baseball cards. That was not in the spirit of why I decided to help him out in the first place. I'm sure others will have different opinions, but that is mine.

Most people have to continue their lives after a tragedy such as this. That Bill continues to run his business of buying and selling cards does not strike me as the least bit improper.

I have spoken with Leon as well and know he is trying to do the right thing here. What concerned him was the large number of recent purchases, as can be seen in the following link (the last two pages, 3 and 4, are during the past week or so). And the issue is not whether Bill should continue to buy cards, but to put it bluntly, whether Bill was being truthful when he stated on the Board that he would have to sell his collection to pay for his wife's funeral expenses.

http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...pleted=1&all=1

timing
 

It is very sad to read this on the day before the funeral of his life partner. It is not the aggravation bill needs to deal with, especially with his own health issues.. I am not requesting my money back, however anyone is free to do as they please, and no judgement being made or suggested here. I would suggest that a time limit be placed (like today) as it would be a shame to see this held up.
Bill and his family are in my thoughts.

I gave mony hoping it will help him be able to continue without too much financial burden, and in hopes he can continue with some normality. After I have delt with so much death in the last five years, I have no problem contributing to such a cause.

If the community paying for Becky's funeral allows bill to continue buying some cards on eBay, I don't have a problem with that as my initial reason for the donation was in hopes for him to continue normalcy, without having to worry too much about funeral costs, of course, what I gave wouldn't have done that alone, it was the boards generosity that did such.

I think the Board's generosity is what people should remember about this particular episode. What Bill does with the money is, frankly, up to him -- and hopefully he will use it to further the interests of his family in this time of need.

While this will mean absolutely nothing to most everybody on here, I am posting now to publically ask you (Leon) to delete my account from net54. Why? Because this thread makes me sick to my stomach. Vile. Why didn't I message you (Leon) in private to make this request? Frankly, because I would encourage other people to do the very same thing. My single withdrawal request might mean nothing, but maybe if enough people leave you won't be able to charge as much when you charge your advertisers for the right to send me unsolicited advertising emails.

Alan

My heart goes out to Bill and his family.

Edited to clarify the opinion I have stated: Just because I have been asked, I wanted to clarify my opinion, as stated. Bill Hedin should be free to distract himself in whatever manner he wishes during this terrible time in his life. I wish Bill Hedin and his family nothing but the best. My heart goes out to him in his time of need. If there were more people like Bill Hedin around here, I wouldn't have asked to leave the board in the first place. My request still stands. Thank you.

Alan,
Your misgivings are so misguided I will just not comment. I wish the best for you and yours. If you leave you will never have to worry about the board anymore. As far as deleting your account, It won't happen as it would screw up too many threads. Happy collecting.

These are obviously difficult and delicate circumstances. But in light of what Bill said about his financial situation and the funds that were raised in response, $1200 of purchases in the past week justifies Leon raising the issue in my opinion.

Bill's quote today from the memorial thread seems pretty clear. I for one was happy and am happy to have donated. Having lost family members, I know that the funeral costs are astronomical and I also know that we often look to find comfort where we can in times of loss. If it is in card collecting, that's one of the nice things about our hobby. I appreciate that everyone will have their own opinion, but wanted to get mine out there. Best wishes to all.

Steve


Quote:

"Thank you, my friends
Dear Friends,
I want to thank all of you for your thoughts, prayers and donations in my time of need. You have all touched my heart and I will never forget this.

My God, all that money will certainly help with the funeral bills and I'm truly so very happy that you wonderful friends really made a difference.

The wake and funeral are coming up: wake is Wednesday night, 5-8 and the funeral is Thursday at 10 AM. The link is in the Bill Hedin thread. I can email it to you, or you can google Rebecca Hedin Framingham, MA obituary. It's on Legacy web site forever, too.

I've been surrounded by family and friends and that has kept me busy. I've been working on ebay with some family members who are buying cards for their collections as well as helping me pick up some cards to re-sell down the road. This keeps me busy and helps me in many ways.

Cards, afterall, have always been there for us through the good times and the bad times.

Thanks again for everyones help and prayers. I never expected any financial help, but your generosity is truly appreciated and I can't thank you all enough.

Here's to better times!

Regards,
Bill Hedin"

Unquote

Looks like Bill is occupying his time with eBay. Different people deal with grief in different ways. Not the way I would handle it, but I'm not Bill. I get the impression Bill is going into his comfort zone and if the board can help him in his time of need, more power to them. I also would have donated but I have my own health issues. That doesn't mean that I won't buy an occasional card. I do however watch more closely what I spend $$$ on these days.

Kmac

I believe that in a time of tragedy one most continue on with normalicy. If the normal thing they do is buy and sell baseball cards, then they must continue to buy and sell baseball cards as that is the only way they can really get over the terrible tragedy that occured. Saying this however, if the purchases get to excessive, I would worry not that the money he is spending is coming from donations, but more so that he is trying to suffocate his pain by spending money excessively. You see this alot when a terrible tragedy occurs, people try to suffocate the feelings of grief and pain by spending money or overreating. This is not healthy and the person that is doing this needs support more than ever. I'm not saying that this is what is happenning in Bill's case, and I sincerely hope the best for him and his family.

I don't know Bill personally, but he seems respected on this site. I also know how hard it is to lose somebody you care about, now I have never lost a wife because I am only 16, but I have lost great grandparents, some that I was very close too. My best wishes to you and your family Bill. Stay strong and retain normalicy. If I had the money to I would donate, but sadly I lost all of my money do to careless spending (Something I need to get better at, as learning how to save money is extremely important in your success.) Once I regain some of the money I lost, I will be happy to donate if the option is still available, but I don't know how long it will take for me to regain my losses and for that I am sorry.

Once again best wishes,
Cameron W.C.P.

Happy to have donated...
 

I am happy to have donated... Bill is dealing with an overwhelming situation... I am sure his wife was his top priority in life and memorabilia his second... given his great lost I can understand his gravitation toward cards...

If the $25 that I donated goes to 52 Topps high numbers, than so be it...

Bill Sorry to hear of your loss. I never have really come over to these boards, and really don't post on the PSA boards anymore. I know a lot of people left there to come here.

Anyway I wanted to reach out to you as I had my wife pass away last October 24th. I offer my deepest sympathy, thoughts, and prayers to you and to your family.

I got beat up a bit about cards, but that was my escape, maybe it's yours to.

I'll learn how to message I guess, or feel free to message me when you want to. I can be just an ear or we can talk cards or whatever.

God Bless,

Mike Kelley

Wow. You act like Leon started this thread for nefarious reasons-when it was Barry and Leon who started the project to help Bill in the first place. I read it as if Leon was just looking out for the board members, as he always does.
Thank you Leon for making tough calls-I'm sure this wasn't an easy thread to start-but you always look out for the board.

I still want my donation to go to Bill, and still send my deepest sympathies.

And thanks again for the great job you do here Leon. :)

Sincerely, Clayton

I'm pretty much of the same opinion as most of the later posts. I also am one to use collecting as an "escape". Even the smallest purchases can brighten up a day, or even a week, when nothing else seems to be going right.

Now as far as the allocation of the money. In the ultimate scheme of things, what's the difference what the money "directly" goes towards, as long as the Funereal expenses are paid, without being too much of a financial burden on Bill. Wasn't that the point of the donations? The money is either directly, or indirectly, still helping pay for those expenses..

My sincerest condolences for your loss, Bill. Good luck, and keep your head up..

+1

I'm not really sure what to think here?! I don't know Bill at all...other than what I've seen of him on this site. But I do know...that we have discussions on this board all of the time revolving around needs...vs wants in life...and I think all of us would agree that if there was a need in our lives...our card collecting funds would have to be diverted to address those needs...no question about it!!!!

And I also understand that we all seek comfort in times of despair/suffering?!

But I donated $$$$ under the impression that Bill was in financial dire straits and this $$$$ would go towards paying for necessary arrangements.

If I knew my donation was going to go towards buying bb cards...there is no question...I would not have donated!

It seems Bills oldest daughter the good doctor could probably have helped?

After reading Bill's story I was heartbroken...now...I feel kinda used!

Sorry...but this is how I feel!

I fully understand why this thread was started as Leon is just looking out for the board members but I have to say I am saddened by this thread as well.

While I have been unable to contribute and hope to do so in the very near future I am saddened that this would even come up at this sad time in our friends life. He has just lost the love of his life and we are questioning his purchases on Ebay? let me tell you if my wife passed I would look to comfort myself and if this buying and selling a few cards on line so some money can be made, then who is anyone else to tell me what I can or cannot do. How many of us have taken to online resources at a very tough time in our lives and did something irrational such as make a purchase that we probably shouldnt have.

I guess my feelings are that if a giver freely gives money to a to a man in a time like this to help lesson his burden, the giver will be blessed for it regardless of how the receiver uses the money. I say if you gave money, accept your blessings and let Bill deal with this in his own way. It is on him how he uses the blessing that have came to him in this time of need. Unless we have been in the situation he is currently deal with, we have no idea how we would act as well

Andrew White

Wow! Did I read the total amount donated correctly in the other thread? around 5k? Although I, myself, wasn't able to contribute(due to my own current financial mess), I must say that your guys' generosity makes me proud to be a member of this board...

Now before too many people get bent up about some purchases, we have no idea what the total amount of these expenses were/are. Or how much help Bill may have needed. It was basically a blind donation, with no set goal. I think that was the point, to help Bill as much as possible with these expenses and beyond. Were y'all expecting change if the total cost was exceeded?

Keep in mind that I don't think that there's a right or wrong way to view the situation. I won't judge anyone who disagrees. This is just my take..

Even if other people feel like Peter Ullman, I doubt many are going to say it, but I think his point of view is legitimate and well-stated and with due regard for the obvious sensitivities of the situation. As previously stated, the issue is not Bill's baseball card purchases. Nobody is judging him for that, or should. The issue, and there is no way to say this delicately, is whether the premise behind Leon's and Barry's very thoughtful fundraising -- Bill's statement that he would have to sell his collection to finance his wife's funeral -- was true. Nobody except Bill knows, but Leon was certainly right to inform people that the slew of ebay purchases at least raised a question. Many people might have contributed even if they had not thought it was a matter of dire need, but I suspect that others would not have.

Peter, that's fair, but it's good advice to not give based on condition. If I were worried about intentions, then I'd not do it. Giving without condition is sincere, IMO, and to look at it from another perspective, some of us might think that raising certain questions will taint the gift we gave, without condition, to help someone in a difficult time.

-Matt

My take
 

I don't know Bill at all and for that reason did not donate. I feel that my Net54 friends are both friends and strangers. I have no doubt that most of you would be friends were we to meet, but I would not expect anyone here to donate funds on my behalf were I in a similar situation. However if I should pass, I would hope that all of you would be willing to pay fair market value for my collection. My wife would appreciate that.

Having made that statement, my condolences sincerely are extended to Bill and his family.

Matt I understand that point of view, but at the same time, there are countless good causes and people have to prioritize their giving. I assume that for many, need and use of funds does play a role in making those decisions.

You guys sure pick your moments. Shame on you.

David McDonald

My 2 cents
 

I don't know Bill, but have met Barry and respect his opinion greatly, as well as respecting Leon's as well. I donated without "advertising" it with a post (I guess I did now) largely because of Barry's words and Leon's support.

My understanding was Bill was in serious financial straits (so serious he was expected to sell his entire collection) and the money raised was going to directly help to pay for funeral expenses. Hearing he is spending over a thousand dollars on cards rubs me very much the wrong ~ no matter what the argument.

Part of this is exacerbated for me as I "gave" him some cards some time ago without charging him as he was in what I was led to be in a truly life-threatening battle, which may well have been the case.

I will not ask for my money back, but feel his judgment in this instance is really quite poor and unfortunately may negatively affect this type of giving and support for someone in the future that may be in an even greater position of need.

My feelings on this parallel Andrew's and David's. Well said gentleman.

When I first saw the thread about Bill,s situation and the fact that he was going to have to sell his collection due to his financial situation I felt touched and considered making a donation. I ultimately decided not to donate as I don,t know Bill personally and would prefer to make a donation to someone with a personal connection. Now after seeing that Bill has been spending about a thousand dollars a week on cards I feel a lot different. The argument here is that Bill should spend the money on cards to keep some normalcy in his life even if the money was donated under the pretense that he desperately needed money to pay for his wife,s funeral expenses as he was going to have to sell his collection to cover his extreme financial hardship. Bill my prayers are with you and your family in this tough time but even though I didn,t donate a part of me is upset since I feel that others were cheated.
I don,t want to sound callous in the tough times Bill is having but I feel that this whole situation has some severe credibility issues. I hope I am wrong and again my prayers are with Bill and his Family.
CN

Thank you Leon for updating us on this. I can certainly see both sides on this issue and everyone brought out good points... as for me...I just go with my heart and trust that the funds are used in good faith for its intended purpose during this time of sadness.

Ricky Y

+1

As I am sure many of the members are aware, there is an ethicists in The New York Times magazine, I am seriously considering sending this dilemma in(obviosuly names witheld) and getting his opinon. I'd like to know beforehand if anyone feels this is something that should be done.

Jake

Who the Hell are we to judge. I'd be a freakin' basket case in his shoes.

If Bill wants to use some of the $ to purchase cards, gold or sprockets as a nest egg for the kids, I'm all for that. My donation wasn't exclusively for his beloved's burial. But any ancillary family purchases Bill deems necessary, without restriction.

Heck, many of us have made sports "investments" under the premise they could be liquidated as an emergency fund, college expenses etc. It's not any different than throwing it into a passbook account.

There is no rehearsal for this thing. I implore you guys to please let this now single father grieve as he sees fit. Thanks

Billy Hedin
 

I have known Bill since the early 1980's and I feel for his loss so much---I know Billy has health problems over the years and he is such a good person. He doesnt deserve this latest barrage. He is a honest man with high intergrity. With the loss of a wife, how does one cope. So if he is on Ebay, it may allow him to forget a little. Also he stated, he has family using ebay and who knows what they are buying. I donated to Billy and would do so again. Please let us allow Bill to grieve with this terrible loss. Let us all move on. thank you, Don Hontz

+1

I dont know Bill at all. Would I have donated if I knew what I know now? Mmmm probably not. BUT, if buying cards with the money helps soothes his pain then I am fine with it. I have lost more in Vegas in 15 min.

+1. Well said.

Jake- I was thinking of doing the same thing. Their current ethicist is Chuck Klosterman. The original one was Randy Cohen, who I liked the best. But you can go ahead and send in a query if you'd like.

As Leon and I expected, the responses here run the full gamut from complete acceptance to considerable disappointment. I just want to clarify that I agree if Bill gets a sense of normalcy and satisfaction by buying baseball cards, he should do so even under these somewhat unusual circumstances. My only call here is whether or not he is buying them on my dime. I am very willing to help him defray the cost of the funeral. However, I really don't want to buy him some baseball cards. That is something he is free to do with his own funds, but the situation here is a little murky. That is my only equivocation.

I'm Torn
 

I have never met Bill, but based on his posts on the board I got the impression (rightly or wrongly) that his financial situation was not as good as mine. That is not to say I am rolling in dough, but, as my wife often reminds me when I complain about our family finances, we are better off than many.

With that in mind, I made a "decent" donation to the memorial fund. Without a self-aggrandizing post. As others have also said, there were no strings attached, but the mental image I had was that the donations - all of them - would go to something, if not directly to the funeral expenses, more meaningful than baseball cards.

I completely agree that people grieve in different ways. It's often why people laugh without control at a funeral. So, I can completely understand buying "a couple" of baseball cards in the week after your wife passes away, but I'm having a difficult time wrapping my head around spending $1200 on them.

Whatever. My donation was made with the best intention. And I'm not in any position to judge how it is used. You need to pay the piper, however, sooner or later.

Bill never came on the boards and directly asked for money. People just gave it based on his assertion that he might have to sell his card collection to pay for the funeral.

Barry I am not sure how one can isolate money once given. Even if it is not going to the same account it is going to the same person. So as long as your part of the 5K Bill is getting does not go into the same account he uses to pay for cards, you are cool?

somebody has to say it
 

NO MONEY SHOULD BE FORWARDED TO BILLY :mad:

Let me explain why folks,,,,

As someone who is a) close to Billy as his relatives and b) has a wife who underwent lymphoma treatments the last 10 months= I have some perspective that may help out Leon/Barry in how best to handle the situation ( and future similar situations),,,,,,, its one mans opinion as both a best friend and a guy whose life is shaped by trust, honesty, and integrity,,, I live it, breathe it, and expect it of others,,, Billy included,,,

It would be best if those in need forward the associated bills to those administering the financial aid == and had the bills paid off thru the fund those aid people coordinate,,,,, having the funds handled by an outside person who administers the aid takes the headaches away,,,,, and alleviates any chances of abuse by anyone from that persons family or relatives,,,,

This way no issues == and all involved can concentrate on whats most important-- in Billys case its handling the grief of day to day life,,,,, and in the boards case its helping a board member out and making sure no headaches at all for anyone involved,,,,

Leon/Barry can handle it how they see fit,,,,

I certainly would not mail him a large check and I've known him since childhood,,, ,,, I'd want him to send me the bills and I'd make sure they get handled thru the funds collected,,,,,

I'm sure Barry would sleep a whole lot better knowing his money actually went where it should go to,,, and I'm sure he's not the only one thinking that way,,,,

Lets all just concentrate on making sure whats been collected goes to its intended purpose,,,, I know thats what I want to see,,,,, and I am sure Leon & Barry will agree with that perspective,,,,


Jeff

I'm somewhat cool Greg, but I wish that I didn't hear about it this morning. I would like to see my entire donation go towards the funeral expenses. I know I can't control what he does with the money but it is still my hope. It's like when someone sells a baseball card reluctantly only under the condition that the new owner will keep it in his collection and promises never to sell it. Of course you can't enforce that, and the new owner can do whatever he wants with it. But you still hope that you made the right decision and the recipient will honor it. That's all I can expect.

And now for something completely different...

Jeff- that's an interesting idea. I don't know if Leon is willing to do that but it does ensure where the money will go.

I think Greg's point is that the issue isn't where he puts these specific funds, it's whether he truly needed them in the first place. And I don't pretend to know, but it's a legitimate question given the ebay buying.

That seems like an awful lot to ask a vintage baseball card message board... seems like more of a job for the family?

I believe many donated with the understanding that Bill would have to sell his collection to finance a proper funeral for his beloved wife and none of us wanted that to happen.

* Of those that donated, I believe some would NOT have continued to donate (or donated as much) if it was known there would be a surplus over the amount needed to finance the funeral.

* Of those that donated, I believe some would still have donated (perhaps still as much as they did) if it was known there would be a surplus over the amount needed to finance the funeral, allowing Bill to spend the additional money on whatever he chose.

Include me in the former. I wanted Bill to not have to worry about his wifes funeral expenses. I would've donated less if I had known there would be a surplus but I still would've donated. I don't care what he spent the extra on, as that is up to him. I have no idea how I'd react if my wife unexpectedly passed away. I place no blame on Bill. I thank Leon & Barry for their efforts.

My sincere condolences to Bill, may he find comfort during this hard time.

Hi Barry,

I am sure the entire 5K is going to go towards funeral expenses. Bill is not going to stiff those businesses he owes the money to but the money raised has allowed him to use the money he apparently has on hand to buy cards. So did Bill truly need the money? Something we may never know. I certainly do not blame him for wanting to escape into the world of cards at a time when he is dealing with such a great loss. Certainly a gray area.

Greg

No, no it's not. To Greg's earlier comment, he didn't ask for money or assistance. He's grieving and posted here within hours of his wife's passing that he wasn't sure how he was going to cope and that his collection may have to be sacrificed. He didn't say that as a fact. Do you honestly think he's been thinking clearly in the last week? Disclaimer: I don't know him and I didn't donate.

I think the idea of setting up a memorial fund was a noble one and wholly well intended. But it was volunteered by Leon and Barry (as far as we know). If you need to know how your donation (to any cause) will be used, then you need to do your homework and keep specific focus on your donations and go through recognized organizations. Donating via an internet message board might not be your thing.

If you have a problem with any of this, then your issue is with Barry and Leon, not Bill. The fact that you can track his ebay purchases is moot - he never asked for a dime. But coming on here and questioning his motives before his wife is in the ground is despicable. Barry, I hope you do send this to an ethicist because I think you're in for an eye opener.

Bill said on one of his earlier posts that he did not know if he would be able to afford the funeral expenses. That's what gave me the idea to call Leon and suggest we start a fund to help him. If the whole 5K goes to that end I will feel very good about this whole thing. I do think Bill needed the money and that his plea was genuine. It just surprised me this morning to find out he had all this extra money to buy baseball cards. If it were me I would take a hiatus from the hobby until all my other bills were paid. But that's me, and I recognize others might do it differently.

Greg S.- you very well may be right.

I may not post here much but I read the boards several times a day. Last week I was so proud of these boards and today I feel ashamed of these boards.

If you gave, you gave it to the man to use the money as he sees fit. As I said before, take your blessings for the giving that you did and let Bill deal with whatever comes his way regarding the handling of the money. For God sake, the man just lost his wife. Leave him alone to grieve in peace.

Andrew White

I couldn't agree more. The fact that this thread was started for public consumption, and some of the comments within it are both incredibly saddening. Donation sent.

I don't know what is more bizarre: discussing these issues publicly while the man prepares to bury his wife or waxing philosophical about sending in this conundrum to the "The Ethicist" column at the New York Times.

Jim...totally agree! Its surreal.

+1

+1

Everyone has an opinion....and that's ok.
 

Our Net 54 seems to have many thoughts on this difficult situation, and I personally look at that as ok. I think we ALL agree that Bill and his family are going through a difficult and even tragic time. The willingness by this community to help out a fellow member should be commended by all here!!

Now to the dilema of how Bill is handling/will handle his future financial situation: It is really up to him in my opinion. I may not agree with it, but I haven't ever been in his situation before, so I can't say what I would truly do. I felt this way years ago when I had a good friend who lost his wife to breast cancer at 26. Our first child is named after her. Anyway, he went out and bought himself the BMW that he had always wanted only days after she died. Many of our friends criticized him for doing this. I didn't. I don't think I would have done that, but I'm not the one who struggled through her battle and was there for her last breath, so I never felt I could judge him on whether what he did was right or wrong.

I think that Leon bringing this sticky situation up was a good idea. It was the right and honest thing to do to let people know about their donations and giving and how they felt Bill is handling it. As for me, I sold a Schmidt rookie on the the board in order to send a donation, and even given the situiation of Bills's spending, I would do it again. Here's why: I believe in giving to the least of my brother as it says in the Bible. In this situation, I gave to someone in need, just as I would give to a begger on the streets. Now if the begger goes out and spends the money I gave him on Meth, then he will be judged and have to deal with our Lord. In my opinion it's not up to me to judge the begger if they don't do what is right with my kind and thoughtful donation. I have only to be concerned with myself being judged someday, like I believe all of us will be. As for Bill or anyone I wish to donate to, what they do with my gesture is up to them. Whether they do the right thing or not, I know I have offered up my donation to our Lord.

Now, if you don't agree with my opinion..... that's ok.

Take Care Everyone,
Tim Kindler

.

Tim Kindler,

Nice thought but, in my opinion, you would be an enabler. In your hypothetic situation, you gave money to a begger and don't seem to have a problem with that begger buying meth with it. A better solution for the begger and the world would be if you gave that money instead to a clinic which helps meth addicts get clean.

I haven't read every post in this thread but as far as Mr. Hedlin goes, maybe a better solution would be to find out where some of his bills are or who he or his wife owes and donate money to that. Then, people who donated money wont feel so bad because the money they gave actually went to pay for what it was thought to be going for. After that, if Mr. Hedlin wants to spend some of his other money on cards then so be it.

David

I for one do not know Bill and have only been made aware of his situation through posting boards. I glanced through this thread a bit and at the link to Bill's eBay activity. I did notice that there is quite a bit of selling activity on his account. Is it possible that Bill buys and sells on eBay as a source of income for Bill? I feel that not everybody is in a financial situation that would allow them to reduce their income during a time such as Bill is having.
I have just sent Leon a few bucks to help Bill out. I feel for Bill and wish him and his family the best possible.

Wow,

You do realize that Bill hasn't received a penny, and that he never asked for anything. He made a fleeting comment, then a random act of kindness happened collectively by this community, only to be tarnished by a few people who "donated" with the hidden condition that he not be caught buying any more cards, all of this happened within 48 hours. Yuck.

This discussion is bizarre, "The Ethicist" thing is incredibly insane.

My only comment at this point is to say that I didn't "want" to post this thread, I felt I had to. Everyone deserves to have all of the information to use or not use. Anything less would have been a mistake on my part. I did discuss this with no less than half a dozen people before posting. I spent at least 12 hours thinking about what to do. The decision came anything but lightly or quickly. I hope Bill gets through these tough times and my thoughts are with him and his loved ones.

That is not, in my opinion, fair. What a few guys said is that they donated on the assumption -- based on Bill's own words -- that Bill would have to sell his collection to pay for the expenses.

Not Sure???
 

Matt,
Not sure if you were talking about me, but I don't think my thoughts were ugly?? IF you weren't, no problem, but if you were, it is still alright. Like I said differing opinions are good.

ctownboy,
I get where you are coming from. It is the thought I have for example where our schools like in Chicago stay open even during a strike to feed the children when this enables the parents to not be responsible and take care of their own. I guess my hypotheical situation didn't come out the way I had intended it to. You are correct in saying that if I knew the guy would buy meth, giving him the money would enable his addiction...totally agree. What I meant by my situation is that I would give freely from my heart certainly hoping it would be used for the right reasons, but that if it wasn't then at least I did my part to try to help someone in need.
Take Care,
Tim Kindler

Like an earlier poster said, It is not really the right thing to do, discussing this in Bill's time of mourning, so I'm not going to continue this anymore. I've said my opinion and will get back to looking at cards.

Take care Bill and everyone who has helped him out.

Not you, at all, Tim.

Peter, ok. I'm still shocked.

And I realize my comment was over the top.

This board is a huge asset to the hobby, a large majority of which involves helping other collectors. So when an issue such as this appears, it will not go unnoticed. It seems like many people who donated do not personally know Mr Hedin but donated anyway. And based on the circumstances here, I think its a little odd, at least given the facts it is. The man loves cards, which are a distraction, something to look forward to, and is really going that route in this extremely difficult time. We know how it is. I cannot imagine facing what Mr Hedin is.

I've noticed a few things here on the board 1. Leon does a great job, 2. Barry Sloate has to really be peeved to say something about being peeved; level headed,

Whether rational or not, It would make sense to assume that Barry and/or Leon feel responsible for what may have been unusual. It had to be addressed.

Mr Hedin, I'm very sorry for your loss. I will be refunding you for the low dollar 33 Goudey tomorrow morning as my contribution, and by the way, I mailed it today. I hope it gives you an ounce of peace. Would have already refunded but didn't make the connection immediately. Best Regards

Good to see Kawika

Leon -

You and Barry did exactly what you needed to do. Once the additional information came to light, you were in a no win situation so you politely put it out there for everybody to make there own decision. Maybe the only thing you might have done different would have been to not allow any posts since it should be each individual's private decision after they digested that information.

What you two started was very kind.

Nuf said.

Rob M.

I absolutely discussed locking the thread to start with, with Barry and/or one of the others. In the modus operandi of the board, "not locking it" was chosen. It wasn't a no-brainer though. I don't think there was a perfect solution here. It was more the"lesser of evils".

A few years ago a family helped me and my family out big time, for over a year. Even though I loved them for it, I hated to see them out in public for fear of them making judgements about how I was spending my time and money (they were pretty awesome and probably didn't make judgements, but I was worried about it). One time I ran into them on the ski slope and I felt like a fool for being there even though it was a holiday and I was getting paid for an off day and a friend paid for my rental and ticket. I didn't want them to think I was squandering their generosity and skipping work to ski, but I also thought it would be super weird if I explained it to them when they didn't ask for an explanation. It was an unavoidably awkward situation. Sometimes a limited portion of the information distorts the reality, and there is no good way of sorting it out to everyone's satisfaction. And the only thing you are left with is trusting in everyone to be cool about it and that character over time will prove the good.

People donate to help someone out. Did you check his grocery bill too to see if he bought donuts or a tub of ice cream instead of just the essentials?

I clicked on the link, expecting to see some 500 or 600 dollar bids. I saw a bunch of 10 dollar purchases. He didn't buy a lamborghini.

Would you feel better if you saw his picture in the local paper standing in the soup and bread line at the salvation army?

He never asked for the money, now everyone wants power of attorney over his finances? Forget Romney's tax returns, where is Bill's?

I know someone struggling very badly during this recession. He still takes his little kids out to the movies ocassionally. I don't think if anyone helped that poor bastard they are going to get their panties twisted because the kids went to see ice age 3 when they could have been using the money strictly for Tide and Colgate.

Here's the catch. When people heard he might have to sell his collection to finance the funeral, they sent in money generously. Now he doesn't have to sell his cards for the funeral. THAT"S THE POINT. IT WORKED! CONGRATULATIONS, YOU DID IT! Now that he doesn't have to mortgage the farm, which was the whole point after all, now you bitch?

That guy can't win, he didnt ask for the money, so don't blame him at all.
Maybe someone came to him and offered to pay for the whole funeral. He's suppose to tell everybody now? It's not anyone's business.

When someone sends you something in the mail you didn't ask for, you get to keep it. The whole idea of asking for donations to help someone out is that you send in a little bit and the strength of numbers makes the donations pile up into a substantial amount.

Then if you feel slighted after the fact, you are only out the little bit, and who cares? You need your 50 bucks back so bad, go rummage through the sympathy cards at the funeral and find it.

He didn't ask for any of this. Leave the guy alone.

My final post here is I send Bill my deepest sympathies in this very difficult time. I know a lot of people don't like this thread, and as Leon said, he agonized over this decision for most of yesterday. He and I spoke many times and ultimately felt it was best to provide this information and then let everyone make their own decision. I'm still glad I was able to help Bill, and most others feel that way too. Hopefully this discussion will soon come to an end.

Billy Hedin
 

You know this is a great board for info--help on questions you have on cards,etc. buying and selling---I was telling my wife the other day, how nice it is that net 54 is helping Billy---she thought it was just wonderful.--But the last few days, what this forum is putting Billy through is beyound belief. Billy doesnt deserve this type of talk especially with the loss of his wife and what he is going trough the last few weeks. I can only imagine what he is thinking if he is reading these boards. Sorry Billy that you have to bear this and I wish for you the best. God bless you and you are in our prayers. Don

Don, I was telling my wife about all of the support that the board members were giving to Bill and she too thought that it was wonderful. Now, it pains me to think that Bill is going to have to read through this thread. I have never met Bill and made a small donation based on the fact that every post that I have seen from him has painted a picture of a kind, caring person as well as the fact that being married and the father of three, I would be devastated if God forbid anything happened to my wife. I am not a particularly religious person, but Matthew 7.1 seems fitting: Judge Not Lest You Be Judged.

Bill, my sincerest condolences in your time of loss. Steve W.

If I can pay 50% of my income to federal, state, and local taxes knowing that some of it will be going toward "entitlements" to certain people I don't respect -- and keep my mouth shut about it all the while -- somehow I suspect the same can be done regarding a few bucks to help a friend in need. Maybe it's time to lock the thread and move on?

agreed...the timing of this thread is/was unfortunate...and in retrospect I'm sorry I opened my mouth.

Pls shut thread!

CalvinDog said it perfectly!

Shortly after my grandmothers death I had one of the biggest card purchases I ever had, I made a good deal of money on it and as shallow as it sounds... The money helped cope... I had cried by her bed for hours when she couldn't even communicate back... I have to agree with the responses that you need to keep some bit of normalcy or you will never get on with your life - I don't know Bill and I am impartial to this matter, the only information I have is what I have read in this thread. Please excuse me if there is something I am missing. Buying cards doesn't mean you do not regret or care for your loved one.

Sean

Agree 100%
Isn't today the day of the funeral?
Lets have all the Bill Hedin "stockholders" give him some peace & quiet!