Greg,

I know the seller you are talking about. He's just on the other side of Michigan about 2 1/2 hours away from me. I have him saved as seller so I always know what he has out there. He's the type of guy who wins an auction then as soon as he gets it relists it for about 30% more then what he paid.

Yeah he has sone nice pennants, albeit priced very high. The Tigers-in-the-infield pennant was beautiful with only a detached tassel issue, it was relisted a week after initial sale with a glue fix. That wasn’t cool. At least he discloses it now.

Stephen, since you’re a Tigers collector, what are your favorites? Do you have pics?

Greg, looks like it was sold for $175, $15 below the BIN. I'm always surprised when sellers accept a lower price so quickly since offers are valid for 24 hours. Why not wait a bit and see if you get full price? I wonder if when making the offer the buyer says the bid will be rescinded if not accepted quickly.

Rick

Both of those Tigers are sweet. On this one, I noticed none of the six pictures show the tip. :cool:

Yeah, the seller says in the description that a 11/2" piece is missing, and I assume that must be the tip, which isn't pictured. Since they don't accept returns, it would probably be difficult to get your money back if dissatisfied under the eBay Money Back Guarantee since the listing mentions the flaw. I know there are complaints about "round white table guy" and his lack of pictures, but at least he accepts returns.

Rick

Here’s the ‘52 Tigers in another color. Tigers did pennants right

Rick, interesting. Yes, bidders can pull offers at any time. I think in this case the $175 was a fair price and he may have figured that a bird in the hand …

Yeah... I would ask before buying. But he did mention a piece of the top tassel was gone, so I'm guessing he'd have mentioned a problem with the tip if there was one.

The 1.5" piece he's talking about is the top tassel. There's wayward punctuation in the description that makes it a little confusing.

And it's never difficult to get your money back on ebay if you choose "not as described". It's 100% guaranteed.

yeah, that guy;)

Here's the tip, for anyone who's considering bidding. Not horrible, but probably 3/8" to 1/2 inch missing.

It's kind of cool in green felt. Hope this is helpful.

Greg,

Here are a few pics of some of my favorite Tiger pennants I have. I agree, the Tigers did pennants right.

Those are some beauties. Is the 1934 American League Champs more of a silk than felt? :confused:

Yes its silk. It rolls up and slides into a metal tube that turns it into a cane. There are two versions of this pennant. The one I have has Cochrane's name spelled correctly. The only bad thing about it is trying to display it since it wont fit in a normal sleeve. I just have it hanging from the wall in a corner of my office for now.

These are fantastic. I especially like the ‘46. Super duper tough pennant.

That’s beautiful. I’ll bet not even Mark Steinberg has one. :p

Mark prob has both versions, lol

I have the "correct spelling" Cane Pennant, but not the other, haha.

As for the 1946 with names surrounding the Tiger's Head... I had a gorgeous golden one with white graphics. But traded it in a deal that brought me a scarce Reds Pennant. It was one of the toughest trades I've ever made, as I knew I'd probably never encounter that pennant again (let alone see a pennant representing any team with that rich golden felt).

Greg is spot on about its scarcity, and congrats to Stephen for having that beauty. The fellow I traded with does frequent this forum, but rarely posts here. Perhaps he can throw up a photo of it, as it really is a sight to behold.

What was I thinking!?!? :face_palm:

Those Tigers pennants are fantastic. They look so nice all together.

Fballguy and I were talking the other day about how cameras on iphones (and probably other phones as well) are making it difficult to tell when pennants are stained or faded. If I really want my pennants to look bright, I can take a photo inside my house, in the later afternoon, with the lights off and the iphone magically makes the pennant look bright and great.

But it has been an issue for buying pennants, especially white pennants. Both of the pennants below are harder to find than you might think, especially in decent shapte. Both looked white in auction photos. Both were yellowish when they arrived. Luckily Oxyclean works very well on these. I have them pictured next to a pennant that I accidentally left in oxyclean overnight. That pennant did get very white, and the black graphics were unharmed, but the orange was damaged. So, I was not able to get these new ones "overnight white", but they do look much better now. I don't think that sellers were intentionally trying to make these look spectacular when they sold (neither was expensive at all). The phones just automatically make them look better in many situations.

Nice improvement! I think we just invented a new color for Benjamin Moore..."Overnight White". Great for Laundry Rooms and Doctor's Offices.

While we're on the subject of more modern pennants...What term are we using for the material that these 1970s-90s pennants are made of?

I prefer "polyester" or "guillotine blade" because you can decapitate someone with one of those pennants if you're not careful.

I think you're onto something Mark. You can definitely lose an eye if you're not careful. Guillotine blades or maybe..."Snake Plisskens"?

Nice pennant, but I'd definitely be looking for some kind of adjustment if I got that with that much tip missing without mention or depiction among all those photos.

Amazing collection!

Completely agree. He needed to include the tip in the provided pics, or (at a minimum) mention it in the description.

New arrival today. That makes 9 ASG Pennants. This was was auctioned already in the frame just to make my life a little easier :)

Apart from a tack hole near the tip, the condition is pretty nice.

Very nice! This is, to the best of my knowledge, the oldest of the Trench stadium/scroll ASG pennants. In ‘57 they depicted Busch Stadium but no scroll. And I think they have one older with a scroll of starters but not ballpark. They had a good run from ‘58 through … ? 1963?

There are other non-Trench ASG scroll pennants of course but these are the nicest.

To continue on ASG pennants … I don’t know of any Trenches for the ‘60 game at Yankee stadium nor 1964 at Shea. My hypothesis is that a local NY non-trench company made these. 1965 was ASCO (Minneapolis) and 1961 in Boston was Keezer. (None of these are mine.)

Latest pickup and cleaning project. Was able to snag this one off ebay the other day and gave it a few rounds of retro clean. The first round was only 5 minuets in the solution. Second round was 10 minuets and the final round was 15 minuets. I played it safe and only used 3-4 tablespoons of retro to 1 gallon of warm water. I kept a close eye on the lettering and tiger the entire time to make sure it didn't start to crack or flake off. As you can see by the picture of the water after the first soak the pennant was really dirty. Overall I'm happy with the results and will quit while I'm ahead. On a side note this is one of my favorite designs the Tigers did using this style tiger. I have several other pennants that use this same tiger.

Nice work Stephen. That's a gutsy move. Don't think I've tried cleaning anything that old. Good to know the water and/or RC doesn't harm the graphics.

Seeing that pic of the water gives me an idea. To enter the fraternity of hunters, one drinks the blood of their first kill. To enter the fraternity of pennant collectors, should we have to drink pennant water? Or maybe just draw a cross with it on the newbie's forehead? Thoughts?

Haven't posted a new pick up here in a long time. I watched this thing cycle through ebay a few times and was just floored by the lack of interest. Finally, it got to the point that I couldn't not buy it. $48.26 with tax and shipping for a 100 year old Ivy League pennant? 35" Long. This thing should be selling for hundreds not tens. I don't understand it. You'd think pennants would appeal to Ivy Leaguers of all people...but not so much.

Wow, what a beauty! And yes, where are the Yalies who should die to have this hanging in their law office? I picked this one up for $20, the only one going for it, and I had to wonder where all the other Amherst football players were. Ever seen another of these, Rob?

I love that style. I have not seen an Amherst version before. I have a few...Boston College, Holy Cross, Boston Latin. I'm starting to feel it might have been a Massachusetts maker? There is a Fordham out there too.

What a deal for $20.

An Amherst nodder just sold in the last nodderexchange auction for $3791 :eek:

It was basically just just any other college nodder but with an “Amherst” decal.

Incredible! Was it a football player? I couldn't find it on the site, but they don't have pictures of the auction listings anyway. That's mind-boggling.

Run of the mill 1970s Double Bar Saints pennant but in it's original packaging.

Drumroll for the maker...

Drumroll continues...
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"APSCO"

What is APSCO? Did ASCO become APSCO? Google APSCO now and you get hydraulic valve actuators.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/30485127452...mis&media=COPY

#28 on this page (scroll down). No picture. Yes, just your basic 1960’s football nodder.

http://www.nodderexchange.com/

“Ideal for decorating Bar Mitzvah occasions.” :p

I think we covered APSCO a few hundred pages ago on this thread ... maybe.

So these guys are actually still in business, today; still located in Brooklyn; and, still in the screen printing business (among other things). See: https://www.apscoenterprises.com/

Their company opened in 1979, per their site. Doesn't look like they make pennants--if they do, they don't seem to have any lucrative licenses from any of the big leagues to use their marks.

I have about 5-6 pictures of pennants in their APSCO packaging, identical to this one. Still not sure why they were branded, "PENNANT POST." (What does that even mean?) All MLB and NFL pennants from the late 1970s/early 1980s, including cheap reproductions of classic Trench designs from the 1950s. When I interviewed Mr. Storm (longtime Trench owner/president) I asked him about APSCO; and I think he indicated they were a Trench "distributor." I don't recall him being dead certain of this; but, we've got strong evidence that the two and single bar helmet pennant series were all made by Trench, so I'm inclined to believe him.

Here's a Steelers double bar helmet pennant in original APSCO packaging; with a JC Penny price tag still attached. APSCO must've specialized in department stores, so that may explain why Trench (a wholesale manufacturer that sold directly to stadium concessionaires) needed the help of a middle man to help tap into that type of retail market; and, why their pennants required a sealed packaging--something you'd never see at the ballpark.

Attachment 563784

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Thanks, Rob. How do you know without a pic? Or is the description--baggy shirt, toes up--that of a standard 60s football nodder? Can you shoot me or direct me to a pic of that style? On another "oddball" front, has anybody ever catalogued kewpie dolls like the one pictured alongside my Amherst pennant? Although the accompanying pins were more or less separate--hung around their necks or pinned to the body--their colors mark them as distinctive to the entity represented by the pins. In other words, the colors of mine are the Amherst purple and white, perhaps faded a bit, and I think the other kewpies I've seen are also particular to the colleges or pro teams of the pins. Not as nice or as collectible as bobbin heads, to be sure, but still vintage and seriously collectible, I would think. Just wondering if anybody has ever paid any real attention to them that you know of?

Fantastic!

Too funny!

Shoot John Brey an email. He can probably provide you a pic.

I have a bunch of those “kewpie dolls.” Some are done in Giants colors; others were not. Some have “Giants” stenciled on the chest, others don’t. They’re pretty fragile, in that the celluloid can be easily crushed.

Did your kewpies come with pins?

Rob, you should start a thread called "Hey Kewpie Guys"...

You might even get responses into the double-digits. :rolleyes:

Seriously though, they are pretty cool, and really undervalued. I guess very few people collect them. Seems like a small percentage have survived with their heads un-cracked/un-chipped. I gave up on finding a clean intact Reds Kewpie a while back.

It's me that did the hijacking, Mark, sorry about that. But while I have you here...do you think they all came with pins originally? And I agree completely about the lack of love they get.

Hey Hank...

Any thread this long is gonna get hijacked a time or two (I have done it many times here myself). The Kewpies definitely came with and without pins attached on the back. In fact, I believe the ones without the pins are more prevalent.

All of this talk now has me psyched about looking for a nice Reds version!

Here's one without the Pin, Hank...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/17532240438...3ABFBM7NaaruFh

Although probably just a generic doll, to which someone added the Reds Pin. Not a true Reds Doll, unfortunately.

Why would you be so sure about that, unless you think the doll and pin are of different eras altogether? My doll came with the pin hanging from the neck in a similar fashion, but the pin was upside down so I took it off and pinned it right-side-up. I got mine at a National from pennant and pin dealer Rick Haskins, who had a bunch of similar college dolls/pins and maybe some pro teams, too. Do we know who made these dolls, and I wonder if there are any depicted in manufacturer catalogs? Why don't you start a kewpie thread looking for your Cincy example?

Greg has got to be pulling his hair out... :p

Here's my last word on "kewpie dolls" (at least in this thread).... I think the ones you would want are the ones that came with the pins. There were definitely dolls and pins put together later. My "best' dolls have a crude SF on the cap, "Giants" stenciled on the chest and are of the proper black and orange color scheme. I think the "right" ones (as shown in this picture from a 1964 merchandise mailer) have a doubled up ribbon, held in place by the pinback's pin, which is looped through an elastic band around the doll's neck.

P.S. sure wish I had a dozen of those "correct signature" Mays nodders, at a buck and a half apiece.

Hank…

They were sold both generic and with the team insignia on the cap and the breast. The one I linked above is on eBay, and is not mine. It may well have originally come that way from the vendor. We will probably never know.

I do not own a Reds one. I used to have one with a wishbone “C” on the cap and also stenciled on his chest. I did not pursue the one on eBay because it’s a generic doll that could’ve been used for any team that wears a red uniform (Reds, Cardinals, Phillies, Red Sox, etc.). I personally would opt for one with the Reds’ team insignia on the uniform and hat.

That’s just me and possibly my OCD I’m afraid. There is no better seller than Rick Haskins, so if he said yours is legit, I’m sure it is. Bottom line is that they came both ways.

Hope these Kewpies are enjoying their 15 minutes of fame on this thread!

How bout this guy?

No kidding! Whose mailer is that? And that's exactly how my Amherst kewpie was when I bought it from Rick, so that seems to be the "standard" issue of origin. No doubt secondary dealers later made their own configurations with a team or college pin to enhance the value of kewpies on their own without one, but it might also be the case that virtually all these dolls came with pins and ribbons originally and had the right color scheme to represent the team or college named on the pin. They are so rare I guess nobody will ever bother to try to catalogue them, but I find them almost as appealing as the nodders, perhaps even more so due to that very rarity.

Wow, now we're talking!

I agree 100% about Rick, he's as good as it gets in the hobby: always with great stuff at reasonable prices, and pleasant as he could be. I doubt, however, that he made any claims about his collection of kewpies, but just presented them for sale. It wasn't hard for me to see that the Amherst kewpie had colors close enough to that colleges purple and white scheme, though, and with the pin secured around the neck like the others he had, if memory serves correctly, it wasn't hard for me to surmise that the entire assemblage was made to represent Amherst and not something cobbled together later. I don't remember what I paid, but I do seem to recall that it wasn't much at all, maybe $25 or such. Now I wish, of course, that I'd bought all he had, maybe ten in all.

Thanks! I wonder if that's a record price for a standard size nodder?

Yes, perhaps a regional manufacturer. Do your others have the same image, for which this magazine cover might have been the inspiration?

Should've known Chris would break out an even more unique version (and in perfect condition, no less). It even has a little pennant, bringing this thread back on-topic!

Looks like the little pennant is pinned to his shoulder and hip, with the material unquestionably matching his uniform. That's a variation I've personally never seen. Very cool, Chris... thanks for posting!

Thanks, Mark. Hadn't thought about that little fella in a while and like you said, he's bringing the car back on the road with his pennant sash;)

Yep...All are exactly like yours and this.

That's so cool. Wonder who could have made them, and if there are other examples of a local or regional manufacturer who used the same image for a multitude of products?

Giving the thread a bump … was happy to acquire this, I have it in black but the condition of this one made it tough to resist. One of three different (known) versions with the Lou Boudreau head shot.

Awesome pickup Greg...

Love the vibrant colors against the jet black background. The diminutive Boudreau headshot in this version is such a cool addition.

Very stylish pennant Greg. Congrats.

Thanks Mark and Chris. Both of you being Reds collectors, here’s a question … I don’t know of any Reds scroll pennants by Trench from this era. Am I correct? I only know of the white ‘61s.

Also my bad, the one I just got is blue, picture below the black one I already had in slightly lesser condition. Identical except for the color of Lou’s cap (which may have simply faded on the top one).

Nothing is coming to mind but my memory ain't what it used to be either...

I also think 1961 is the only Reds Scroll pennant Trench made. Would love to be wrong!

Great collection.

I know the question wasn't addressed to me but....

This one is from 61 and it's a scroll (not my pennant btw). I know it doesn't have tassels but could it be Trench? I don't think I've seen the 1961 white version you're thinking of Greg.

Those colors kind of scream WGN, don’t they? :confused:

Gary thanks for showing this … it was an open question, one I thought the Reds fans would more likely know. I guess this is a WGN, like Rob suggests, to me they look a lot like Ad Flags after the early 50s so I can’t tell for sure. Definitely not Trench.

The 1948-1959 era Trench scroll pennants, IMO, is peak pennant beauty. They started getting weird in 1960.

This is definitely by WGN. The Day-Glo color palette, the multi-colored scroll lettering, and the bat-skewered baseball are all typical of WGN's designs offered beginning in the late 1950s and continuing on through 1970.

There's an otherwise identical variant of this pennant that's dated, "1961." There's also a newer, similar looking one by WGN commemorating "The Big Red Machine" Reds that must've been one of the last MLB pennants ever made by them at the decade's end.

Thanks for clarifying. And because a picture is worth 1,000 words...here's the dated variant of the WGN pennant and the 1972 Big Red Machine edition.

I think everything started getting weird in the 1960s :D

We were talking recently about Tigers pennants, I thought I’d post my very favorite. Not my most valuable Tigers but definitely the most aesthetically appealing IMO. In case you didn’t know, I love Trench.