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-   -   Hey, pennant guys (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=183684)

Domer05 04-03-2022 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagesportscollector (Post 2211525)
Hey pennant guys - :) - has anyone seen this leather emblem on an early Chicago Penn Co pennant before? Although not related to Cornell or any sport, I found it to be quite unique and interesting, with the cigarette and dog.

Wondering if there are any other examples of it. It's on a large 34" pennant, c.1915. Could it have been a custom order for a fraternity or social society? I am wondering how this was ordered back then. Maybe the group sent the artwork and then the emblem was created? or Possibly they just asked for a design to be created for them? Curious on any theories.

Thanks!
Joe

Joe, I've never seen this artwork elsewhere on a pennant.

Around the turn of the century wholesale manufacturers would distribute a catalogue, and inside there'd be dozens of different pennant styles and corresponding style numbers. You just told them what school name you wanted the product to read; and, you picked from 3-4 fonts. By the mid-1910s, most makers had a library of sorts containing generic artwork the customer could select from, e.g., football running back, baseball pitcher, lacrosse player. In some cases, these catalogues even included felt color samples the customer could pick from.

By the 1950s, colleges adopted mascots, and pennant makers began offering their customers an even greater library of generic artwork featuring bears, tigers, you name it.

Many makers boasted about their "art departments," and even accepted crude schematics of what you wanted their artist to make. It's possible your artwork was the product of such a request. But, the bull dog kind of looks mascot-like, so I'm wondering if this wasn't just some off the shelf artwork from Chipenco's library someone at Cornell's bookstore thought looked cute?

Note that this artwork was not screen printed, like many of Chipenco's competitors of the day had begun doing. I suspect Chipenco had not yet developed a patent or license to use this new production method by the mid-1910s, when this was made. They weren't alone. To get around this problem, Chipenco had to use burnt leather appliques or else utilize the relief/letterpress method (rubber stamp on white felt) to make detailed university seals or illustrations.

By the way, Joe's website (www.iyellcornell.com) is worth visiting if you haven't yet done so. There's even a section dedicated to (Cornell) pennants!

thetahat 04-04-2022 04:33 AM

1 Attachment(s)
The “burnt leather” logos are super cool, like this one (not mine) which I consider the “holy grail”.

ooo-ribay 04-04-2022 06:05 AM

Joe said his pennant is “not related to Cornell.”

I’m confused. :confused:

vintagesportscollector 04-04-2022 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay (Post 2211785)
Joe said his pennant is “not related to Cornell.”

I’m confused. :confused:

Sorry Rob, I meant the Emblem of an old man and a dog is not related to Cornell - that is the mystery. Typically I would see a football or baseball player, or other sport, or if after 1915, the Cornell bear mascot. This is so unique and unrelated, hence wondering where it came from.

vintagesportscollector 04-04-2022 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Domer05 (Post 2211741)
Joe, I've never seen this artwork elsewhere on a pennant....

Many makers boasted about their "art departments," and even accepted crude schematics of what you wanted their artist to make. It's possible your artwork was the product of such a request. But, the bull dog kind of looks mascot-like, so I'm wondering if this wasn't just some off the shelf artwork from Chipenco's library someone at Cornell's bookstore thought looked cute?....

Thanks Domer. Extremely helpful information and food for thought. Whether this was off the shelf artwork, or a custom art department creation, is the fun mystery. I have a lot of catalogues and store interior images and photographs of the various local bookstores and shops and retailers, showing what they offered at the time. I have also collected a lot of dorm room photos from the period. I haven't found any examples like this.

I see your point about the bull-dog kind of looking mascot like, and had a similar thought - however, what seems to stand out more is the old hipster looking dude with the blunt.:rolleyes: If it was off the shelf, it seems pretty obscure and seldom requested. Looking through many class books from the time, one can see that Clubs, Societies and various Smoker and social events were a prominent part of campus life. Lots of great student images of smoking and dogs, and various 'stunts'. I am also wondering if this was a one time order for a Society.

Fballguy 04-04-2022 10:20 AM

If I'm reading this correctly, everyone better get used to "loosely rolled" pennants.

April, 2022 will see a nonstandard fee attributed to parcels that must be sorted manually when packaging exceeds sorting requirements. Packages with a length exceeding 22″ will have a $4.00 surcharge, packages with length exceeding 30″ will have $15.00 surcharge, and packages over 2 cubic feet will have a $15.00 surcharge.

ooo-ribay 04-04-2022 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fballguy (Post 2211854)
If I'm reading this correctly, everyone better get used to "loosely rolled" pennants.

April, 2022 will see a nonstandard fee attributed to parcels that must be sorted manually when packaging exceeds sorting requirements. Packages with a length exceeding 22″ will have a $4.00 surcharge, packages with length exceeding 30″ will have $15.00 surcharge, and packages over 2 cubic feet will have a $15.00 surcharge.

I'm beginning to hate the Post Office. I wasted an hour and a half of my life, last Friday, trying to submit an online claim. Every time I got to "submit" I got a message "Error 413 - Entity too large" I finally gave up and am waiting on a claim form through the mail.

UKCardGuy 04-04-2022 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fballguy (Post 2211854)
If I'm reading this correctly, everyone better get used to "loosely rolled" pennants.

April, 2022 will see a nonstandard fee attributed to parcels that must be sorted manually when packaging exceeds sorting requirements. Packages with a length exceeding 22″ will have a $4.00 surcharge, packages with length exceeding 30″ will have $15.00 surcharge, and packages over 2 cubic feet will have a $15.00 surcharge.

The thread's been quiet for ages and boom in 24 hours it's busier than Time Square. :)

Love the 49ers pennant Marc. Personally, I think the tassels that you've added make a big difference.

I might be the only one, but I like getting "loosely rolled" pennants. Especially when they're done properly. One auction house that I've used a few times, uses a thick cardboard tube to roll the pennants around and then wraps the rolled pennant(s) in plastic film. It arrives safe and sound every time, is much easier to ship and doesn't get beaten to hell by USPS or Fedex.

Fballguy 04-04-2022 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay (Post 2211906)
I'm beginning to hate the Post Office. I wasted an hour and a half of my life, last Friday, trying to submit an online claim. Every time I got to "submit" I got a message "Error 413 - Entity too large" I finally gave up and am waiting on a claim form through the mail.

The worst and most unprofessional customer service on the planet.

perezfan 04-04-2022 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UKCardGuy (Post 2211910)
The thread's been quiet for ages and boom in 24 hours it's busier than Time Square. :)

Love the 49ers pennant Marc. Personally, I think the tassels that you've added make a big difference.

I might be the only one, but I like getting "loosely rolled" pennants. Especially when they're done properly. One auction house that I've used a few times, uses a thick cardboard tube to roll the pennants around and then wraps the rolled pennant(s) in plastic film. It arrives safe and sound every time, is much easier to ship and doesn't get beaten to hell by USPS or Fedex.

I've warmed up to the rolled pennant packages as well... except when it's rolled too tightly and the painted graphics crack.

There can be problems with flat boxed pennants, too. Most sellers fail to use a plastic sleeve, which presents potential problems...

1. I received one last week with a hole punched all the way through the flat box. Pennant was ruined.
2. Pennant can move inside the box, causing the last 3" of the tip to look like an accordion.
3. Sellers get lax, and let the tip or tassels get caught up in the tape on either end. I've experienced a few lost/destroyed tips and tassels as a result.

So "loosely rolled" is fine with me if they do it the right way.


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