Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2126829)

Really? All 100 million (or however many) white people have privilege and power? Really???? I can introduce you to some poor people in my community (with white skin color) who expose that to be a blatant lie.

Generally speaking, an intelligent black person has privilege and power over a white idiot. A normal black person has power and privilege over a white dwarf. Young, healthy, active people have privilege and power over old, sick people. And so on.

I've seen far, far too many successful people with darker skin and far, far too many failures with lighter skin to buy into your racist nonsense.

Looking at someone, seeing only their race, and from that tidbit of information declaring them privileged and powerful is outright stupid. And that is what this group think mentality is doing - making idiots out of otherwise intelligent people.

You cannot take a hundred million people and ascribe ANY attribute to each and every one of them. It is absurd, and quite obviously racist.

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2126829)

Really? All 100 million (or however many) white people have privilege and power? Really???? I can introduce you to some poor people in my community (with white skin color) who expose that to be a blatant lie.

Generally speaking, an intelligent black person has privilege and power over a white idiot. A normal black person has power and privilege over a white dwarf. Young, healthy, active people have privilege and power over old, sick people. And so on.

I've seen far, far too many successful people with darker skin and far, far too many failures with lighter skin to buy into your racist nonsense.

Looking at someone, seeing only their race, and from that tidbit of information declaring them privileged and powerful is outright stupid. And that is what this group think mentality is doing - making idiots out of otherwise intelligent people.

You cannot take a hundred million people and ascribe ANY attribute to each and every one of them. It is absurd, and quite obviously racist.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2126836)

There are countless white people living in poverty. They will be glad to hear, no doubt, how they are the beneficiaries of structural racism against blacks. Is that the same structural racism that gave this country a (deservedly) popular two term Black president? Oh wait, he, and every other successful Black person don't count, because they go against the theory.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2126836)

There are countless white people living in poverty. They will be glad to hear, no doubt, how they are the beneficiaries of structural racism against blacks. Is that the same structural racism that gave this country a (deservedly) popular two term Black president? Oh wait, he, and every other successful Black person don't count, because they go against the theory.

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 2126838)

What about the 620,000 white soldiers that gave their life in the Civil War that black slaves might be free?

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2126845)

Pekin is a town in Illinois.

A pekin duck is a white duck imported from China and is a recognized breed by that name.

Pekin High School athletic teams formerly identified as the Pekin Ducks. I don't know if there mascot looked like Donald (Duck not Trump).

Apparently the Chinese community became offended because people were eating Peking duck in Chinese restaurants.

As a result of this kerfuffle, the Pekin High School teams abandoned the Duck are now referred to as the Pekin Dragons.

Doesn't that make your hair stand on end. This could have been the start of a World War, but in central Illinois news travels slowly, not too many people really cared.

i still like the Cleveland Eeries, even tho the season is over before Halloween night.

Originally Posted by carlsonjok (Post 2126796)

That was a joke, champ, and I figured most people had enough neurons bouncing around inside their melon to catch the implication. Obviously, I was wrong. So, even though it doesn't really belong in this section, I'll try to explain. There are two premises here, but I will only address the one that is actually relevant (IMO) to the name change from Indians to Guardians. Also, these are my general observations. It isn't meant to be one size fits all. I am sure many of you do not fit neatly into the narrative:

1. Cancel culture is just the latest biennial moral panic conjured up by political operatives who needed something new to gin up outrage now that the previous panics have lost their impact.
2. The name change in Cleveland has nothing to do with "cancel culture." It is an artifact of the usual inter-generational changes that cause the olds to get their backs up and the youngs to roll their eyes at grumpy old Papaw.C

I was born in 1965 and I am part of the first Gen X cohort. I spent the first part of my professional career working with Baby Boomers and the second part with Millennials and (now) Gen Z. It's my observation that the younger generations are more comfortable with differences along ethnic, cultural, faith, and sexual orientation lines. With this comfort level comes a desire to use language that acknowledges the difference without resorting to potentially offensive tropes. It is nothing more than matter of being considerate of other people. And, I think we can all agree that being considerate is a good thing.

This isn't to say that Boomers (and my generation) are inherently racist. But we were able to move through our formative years without being confronted with the increasingly multi-cultural nature of America. Having one minority family in your neighborhood or, in my case, your graduating class doesn't mean that you are the living embodiment of MLK Jr "I have a dream" speech. It does mean that you grew up in an environment where you didn't need to think about how to deal with such issues. It also means being more intentional now in how we deal with those issues.

The Cleveland Indians were under no serious threat of going out of business by retaining the Indians name. However, we all also know that baseball is facing a demographic cliff with a rapidly aging fan base that is not being replaced by younger people. As younger generations become more accepting of differences, it is not surprising that various institutions (be they corporate or public sector) change to reflect the zeitgeist. It isn't a matter of caving to the "woke crowd." It is a matter of following the money and creating brand loyalty. Let's just face up to the hard truth: the only industries that consider our market demographic highly desirable are reverse mortgages and catheters-by-mail. So, if you really must be upset about this, you would do better to criticize Cleveland's ownership from engaging in such a obvious, cynical marketing ploy.

And, since every thread needs a card

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Z_rIE7Q4Z...600/somali.jpg

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2126805)

What's the saying, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

Originally Posted by BobC (Post 2126853)

Something like that. There's really no black or white anymore, everything is shades of grey.



You can fool some of the people all of the time....

And all of the people some of the time....

But you can't fool Mom! :)

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 2126834)

Thank you! I started to respond to that nonsense, but then just hit delete.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2126805)

What's the saying, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2126809)

There is nothing anyone could possibly say to defend slavery, but from my study the rift between North and South was more complex than slavery.

Originally Posted by Kidnapped18 (Post 2126859)

From a conference earlier this month

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2126856)

This is your briefest post ever.:);):D

Originally Posted by BobC (Post 2126863)

Absolutely agree. Truth is, there has been slavery going back thousands of years in the human race, and that involved people of all colors and nationalities. But today you don't really hear anyone still complaining about the Egyptians, Romans, Vikings, or any other dominant groups that had slavery as a given and accepted part of their culture in the past.

Originally Posted by sdimag (Post 2126852)

I think your neurons are overactive,champ! I don’t think my prior reply to you was an attack on you.

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2126867)

Or the slavery that still exists today in parts of Africa:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slaver...mporary_Africa

The continent of Africa is one of the regions most rife with contemporary slavery. Slavery in Africa has a long history, within Africa since before historical records, but intensifying with the trans-Saharan and Indian Ocean slave trade and again with the trans-Atlantic slave trade; the demand for slaves created an entire series of kingdoms (such as the Ashanti Empire) which existed in a state of perpetual warfare in order to generate the prisoners of war necessary for the lucrative export of slaves. These patterns have persisted into the colonial period during the late 19th and early 20th century. Although the colonial authorities attempted to suppress slavery from about 1900, this had very limited success, and after decolonization, slavery continues in many parts of Africa despite being technically illegal.

Originally Posted by BobC (Post 2126871)

Am aware of that, and it is surprising that doesn't get a much larger audience or vocal protest in the world today, at least not as much as there still seems to be for similar issues from 160 years ago.

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2125897)

This brings up a good point. Were Paul Brown and/or Jim Brown offended by the name "Browns?"

Originally Posted by 68Hawk (Post 2126874)

Don't think you or many here get it.

Originally Posted by BobC (Post 2126865)

No it isn't!!!

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2126774)

From the perspective of Great Britain, the Founding Fathers were traitors.

Originally Posted by BCauley (Post 2126880)

Well that’s very apparent since Indians are in India and Native Americans are labeled as Indians because some chucklehead got his navigation all wrong.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2126845)

i still like the Cleveland Eeries, even tho the season is over before Halloween night.

Originally Posted by carlsonjok (Post 2126870)

I am trained in gorilla warfare and I'm the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target.

Originally Posted by BobC (Post 2126888)

Maybe what the Cleveland BBC could have done was to check with people from India then to see if they had an issue with their nationality being used as the name for a professional sports team, and if not, just dump any association with the Chief Wahoo mascot or anything related to native Americans and simply declare from now on the Cleveland Indians moniker had nothing to do with native Americans anymore. As someone else pointed out, not all ethnic or other groups have an objection to the use of their name like that. At least I've never heard of anyone complaing about the Fighting Irish, Celtics, or the Vikings, among others.

Originally Posted by MooseDog (Post 2126891)

Maybe it's active spellcheck at work but if you were indeed top of your class I would assume that you'd spell guerilla correctly...

Originally Posted by BCauley (Post 2126748)

You must be thinking of the “normal tourist visit” in January 6th that “cancel culture” doesn’t talk about.

The people the bases are named after rebelled against the US. That's what they DID. Why should that be celebrated? Do you celebrate the people who stormed the Capitol on January 6th?

You still haven't answered any of my questions though. Specifically, and now I can't see my comment so it's not word for word, wht should they name a base after them? What did they do to accomplish such an honor since they rebelled against the country? Additionally, should those on the 6th of January be celebrated as well?

"Cancel culture" is the people who stormed the Capitol on January 6th right? To void an election in service to one person who doesn't care about them one way or the other? Just want to make sure I understand what "cancel culture" is on here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by paulmolive (Post 2126899)

Wokeism Demolition Night at "Progressive" Field please

Originally Posted by carlsonjok (Post 2126796)

That was a joke, champ, and I figured most people had enough neurons bouncing around inside their melon to catch the implication. Obviously, I was wrong. So, even though it doesn't really belong in this section, I'll try to explain. There are two premises here, but I will only address the one that is actually relevant (IMO) to the name change from Indians to Guardians. Also, these are my general observations. It isn't meant to be one size fits all. I am sure many of you do not fit neatly into the narrative:

1. Cancel culture is just the latest biennial moral panic conjured up by political operatives who needed something new to gin up outrage now that the previous panics have lost their impact.
2. The name change in Cleveland has nothing to do with "cancel culture." It is an artifact of the usual inter-generational changes that cause the olds to get their backs up and the youngs to roll their eyes at grumpy old Papaw.C

I was born in 1965 and I am part of the first Gen X cohort. I spent the first part of my professional career working with Baby Boomers and the second part with Millennials and (now) Gen Z. It's my observation that the younger generations are more comfortable with differences along ethnic, cultural, faith, and sexual orientation lines. With this comfort level comes a desire to use language that acknowledges the difference without resorting to potentially offensive tropes. It is nothing more than matter of being considerate of other people. And, I think we can all agree that being considerate is a good thing.

This isn't to say that Boomers (and my generation) are inherently racist. But we were able to move through our formative years without being confronted with the increasingly multi-cultural nature of America. Having one minority family in your neighborhood or, in my case, your graduating class doesn't mean that you are the living embodiment of MLK Jr "I have a dream" speech. It does mean that you grew up in an environment where you didn't need to think about how to deal with such issues. It also means being more intentional now in how we deal with those issues.

The Cleveland Indians were under no serious threat of going out of business by retaining the Indians name. However, we all also know that baseball is facing a demographic cliff with a rapidly aging fan base that is not being replaced by younger people. As younger generations become more accepting of differences, it is not surprising that various institutions (be they corporate or public sector) change to reflect the zeitgeist. It isn't a matter of caving to the "woke crowd." It is a matter of following the money and creating brand loyalty. Let's just face up to the hard truth: the only industries that consider our market demographic highly desirable are reverse mortgages and catheters-by-mail. So, if you really must be upset about this, you would do better to criticize Cleveland's ownership from engaging in such a obvious, cynical marketing ploy.

And, since every thread needs a card

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Z_rIE7Q4Z...600/somali.jpg

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2126829)

Really? All 100 million (or however many) white people have privilege and power? Really???? I can introduce you to some poor people in my community (with white skin color) who expose that to be a blatant lie.

Generally speaking, an intelligent black person has privilege and power over a white idiot. A normal black person has power and privilege over a white dwarf. Young, healthy, active people have privilege and power over old, sick people. And so on.

I've seen far, far too many successful people with darker skin and far, far too many failures with lighter skin to buy into your racist nonsense.

Looking at someone, seeing only their race, and from that tidbit of information declaring them privileged and powerful is outright stupid. And that is what this group think mentality is doing - making idiots out of otherwise intelligent people.

You cannot take a hundred million people and ascribe ANY attribute to each and every one of them. It is absurd, and quite obviously racist.

Originally Posted by gawaintheknight (Post 2126928)

I just want to be clear that I'm not trying to accuse anyone of anything, I'm just trying to provide an explanation. This has sort of become a political thread, since the question of the extent of racism in America has always been a political one, but I am trying to be civil and I think it's an important discussion to have.

Ted Clayton

Originally Posted by carlsonjok (Post 2126933)

Ted, the example I come back to is an NBER study on the affect that ethnic names has on job interview callbacks, when controlled for other issues.

Are Emily and Greg More Employable than Lakisha and Jamal? A Field Experiment on Labor Market Discrimination

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2126864)

Power and privilege accrues to the educated. Isn't that interesting.......

Maybe all those woke college kids, regardless of race, should self-flagellate, instead of accusing people based on the color of their skin.

Originally Posted by Bugsy (Post 2125857)

I guess there were IP issues with the name Spiders.

Originally Posted by carlsonjok (Post 2126870)

I didn't think it was an attack either. I just figured you didn't understand the point I was making and I took the opportunity to develop the idea in a bit more detail.



I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I'm the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the f--- out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my f---ing words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, f---er. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life.

Originally Posted by gawaintheknight (Post 2126934)

Does it mean that, overall, white people have an advantage that Black people don't because wealth in this country is tied to race? Yes. It's systemic, not based on intentionally racist actions by individuals.

Ted Clayton

Originally Posted by Leon (Post 2126949)

So before you are reprimanded for this, WTF? Do you really think you can threaten someone's life on this forum and not have any repercussions?

Originally Posted by Tabe (Post 2126887)

Which is probably why there's no statues of George Washington in London.

"Treason doth never prosper, what's the reason? For if it prosper, none dare call it Treason."

When you win, it's not treason :)