My 3 1969 Mets

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...cfccbcd0_c.jpg

Some more ...

Very cool. I graduated high school in Spokane.

Well...Looks like we know who bought the 2nd listing. Our seller's feedback took a little hit and I haven't even left mine yet. This guy had the same exact experience.

<a href="http://imgbox.com/MdS0Jtpm" target="_blank"><img src="https://images2.imgbox.com/61/21/MdS0Jtpm_o.png" alt="image host"/></a>

What a shocker! :eek:

Why can't ebay permanently ban these idiots? They need to take a lesson from PSA's Message Board Administrator. Quick trigger finger, and poof, they should be forever gone. At least eBay is pretty good about getting you refunded (albeit after the fact).

Random question...Do you use an image hosting site to upload pics here (if so which one) or do you use that little image icon here on Net54? I've been using imgbox for a few years and now it doesn't seem to work. And I can never get a picture to appear using the icon. What's the trick?

I just use the paperclip icon and grab the pictures from my phone, tablet or desktop computer. Easy peasy.

You've got to be kidding me. All these years here and I never knew you could do that. I'm embarrassed to say how much easier that is than what I've been doing. Geeez.

This is only a test

Attachment 385896

Yup...Works. ;)

Thanks Rob

Hey Rob- that's a nice and funky looking Ram's pennant. The tassels look like they have the same texture as this one (I'll get a closer pic of them later). And I've see a smaller red version of this Oilers pennant on your website (I think). Same hard to find series?

Nice Oilers Pennant, and an exceedingly tough series to find. I think I only have the Steelers version from that group.

Neat Rams Pennant Rob! Looks like maybe a mid-size or quarter-size pennant? In any case, it's very cool (and rare). Looks like it was based off of this obscure Decal Artwork that you see on rare occasion (see pics...)

And no, I have never seen any of those other teams' mascots depicted on a pennant!

Yes...These pennants are super rare, especially in full size. You're more likely to find the 12" version which the Rams is. And I don't own it. I've never seen it come up for sale. I just found the picture in one of my many internet searches and save it for motivation. ;) I don't know if I'd buy the mini but would love to find a full size one.

The only full size that I've seen are the Oilers and Steelers.

Some of the minis I've seen...

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I like the look of these. Funky in the right kind of way. Do you have a pic of the 49ers?

I had to pay up for the Oilers pennant.

Just found this one...

Attachment 385964

Thanks for finding that, Rob. I've posted a pic of the unique (to me) tassels on the Oilers pennant. I noticed that the super cool and rare Astros pennant I just picked up from Mark also has a similar design and the same type of tassels (see pic). Almost certainly from the same maker. I'm guessing that other baseball pennants with these tassels and the same style (large city name, team name under "mascot") are also very rare.

Looks like the mini’s have those “corrugated” tassels, as well.

The mysteries continue....

Baseball Rob- any chance you have an SF Giants pennant with these tassels?

Cool Mets pennants guys thanks for sharing. The unique one I posted above and a handful of others are all available in the auction we are running right now.

Nope.

Eagles
 

Here is my Eagles pennant from the above series. It is a mini - 12 inches or so.
I haven‘t ever come across the full sized Eagles one.

Attachment 386110

Damn these are cool. The hunt continues...

Vintage Pennant Series Origins / Age?
 

This may have been covered previously but I'm looking for more info / examples from this series of pennants. Thanks to Greg for providing pics.

Are they definitely the same series? It' odd one has city name and the other team name.

Of course, after saying this I notice on the NFL 12" pennants above they all have city name, except the 49ers which has team name.

One other last second observation on the NFL pennants. The AFL teams have city name and the three NFL samples (Steelers, 49ers, Eagles) have team name.

To me, the Reds and Angels look the same because of the single line of stitching on the spine.

No question the same series ...

Yup. Here's another...

Nice one Mark. Any thoughts on the age / origin of these and have you seen others besides the 3 shown so far?

pennantdynasty has Falcons, Bengals and Jets decals in his store...

Great questions, Chris...

I really like this series, but know very little about it. Pretty safe to say it's from the early 1960s, based on the materials, style, logos and designs. The fact that there's an LA Angels example pinpoints the series to the 1961 - 64. They are well made, with thick quality felt. The logos and artwork are also top-notch.

I guess the big question is why did they run the zig-zag stitching vertically down the middle of the spine? Pennants were routinely sold on a stick back in the day, so why would they block that capability? I don't think we will ever know... probably not much to it, other than it was a quicker and easier way to attach the spine.

As for other teams... I am sure I've seen others like this, but my aging brain can't seem to garner any specifics. A few may even be pictured earlier in this thread, but who here has the time/patience to go back and find it? :o

Would be cool to uncover a Colt .45s pennant like this, as the era is perfect.

Throwing it back to Marc and "Baseball Rob"... Are you guys aware of a Giants Pennant with this zig-zag stitching? I know there are others out there!

It is interesting to me that both of these tough pennant series we have been talking about (zigzag spine, ribbed tassels) apear to be from the 1960s, but that baseball Rob (who knows all things Giants pennants) hasn't seen SF Giants versions. Seems like they should show up every so often.

You'd think so... right?

As rare as the Honus Wagner, but lots more affordable. And a better chance it's unaltered, no less!

Thanks, Mark and I agree they are sharp looking pennants. I was lucky enough to pick up the Reds version up recently and noticed the stitching on the spine is more inline with a typical pennant but they also used multiple colors...

Mark...Are you sure your Red Sox is the same series as the two Chris posted pictures of? That yours says "Red Sox" underneath makes me think not. Here's a Colts that lines up pretty good with Chris's though with no zig zag. What do you think?

Attachment 386394

And here's a Hoston Colts for Marc B. to search for. This is the 12 incher but there's got to be a full size somewhere, right?

Attachment 386400

This Colts pennant actually seems to be an earlier version of the Astros with Astronaut pennant that is one of the "ribbed tassels" pennants. I have a somewhat beat up version of this pennant. It has ribbed material on the spine, but not the tassels.

I’m getting confused by this discussion. :D

Also, bummed that I have nothing to add. :p

Rob, now you know how I always feel in these discussions. 🤪

Rick

3000

Ok it’s a bit confusing with two different “type pennants” being discussed. First we have the ribbed spine/tassel series. The red Colt .45s pennant belongs to this series, and is the immediate precursor to the Astros’ Astronaut pennant.

Then we have the zigzag spine series. I am positive that the Batting Sock pennant is part of this series. The felt has the same texture and thickness. And the zigzag stitching is identical to the Reds and Angels examples. In addition, look how similar the city name font looks on the Reds and Red Sox examples. Hope this serves to clarify.

Now Baseball Rob... your job (should you choose to accept it) is to go out and find both Giants examples. The Mission Impossible reference seemed appropriate!

Won this in Huggins and Scott’s auction the other day. Wondering if you guys had thoughts on what it is? I found an old thread on here regarding what seems like a similar DeMar pennant but I can’t see the photos for some reason.

Contacted the guy who wrote the book on pennants and he doesn’t know what it is. Anyways, any thoughts would be appreciated.

I'm confused too..So Mark, are you saying both Colt's images I posted are from the same set..One full and one mini? Both the ribbed spine/tassels series?

And I think Chris is saying is that his Reds isn't zig zagged. Or is he referring to something else?

Who's on first?

Let's call the whole thing off!

;)

The full size Colts pennant is from the ribbed tassels/spine maker.

The design of the smaller Colts pennant sure seems to match the Astronaut and Oilers pennants I posted earlier (from the ribbed series).

So, yes, it appears that they may be from the same maker. A maker who did not make very many pennants, because all of these appear to be rare.

The large Colt 45s is unquestionably a Keezer, and I agree that it was the precursor to the astronaut Astros. Observe the font of HOUSTON. It’s possible that the zig zag pennants are also Keezer - they are similar in many ways - just don’t know for sure. I have a zigzag White Sox that I’ll post when I return home.

The mini-pennant talk reminded me that I have this Giants pennant. It seems to fit with the style of the mini Colts pennant. It is about 12 inches. I have never seen a full-length version and have only seen the mini version once.

Cool pennant, congratulations! We did discuss this very pennant and manufacturer over on pages 40-41 of this thread. The picture of that pennant is still up, in fact. It's identical to yours, to include the maker's mark by DeMar Mfg. Co. of Buffalo, NY.

That "reverse direction" style was offered by several manufacturers in the 1910s and 1920s, which is when I'd date your pennant to have been made.

But is it a Pittsburgh Pirates baseball pennant, I think your question is? I think the consensus was: probably not. I've seen more than a dozen pennants from that era by DeMar, and nearly all were travel/souvenir pennants. No professional sports teams. One or two pennants that could have been collegiate pennants, e.g., a blue and gold sewn letter "MICHIGAN" pennant. But that's it.

The challenge with pennants from the early 20th century is that travel/souvenir pennants were far, far more common than professional baseball pennants, which were actually quite rare. I think the consensus of people on this thread is: it's a travel/souvenir pennant until you can produce a photo of somebody in the ballpark waving said pennant.

But hey, it's a cool pennant either way. Hang it in a room full of Pirates stuff, like your Honus Wagner T206 baseball cards, and it will look even better! ;)

Not really a pennant collector, but I have these ads saved:


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Very interesting. It proves your DETROIT is a baseball pennant. There had been some differing opinions on those.

Wow, very interesting ads. That's exactly the kind of evidence you need to make your case.

Any idea when those ads were run??

Now we'll have to find the other six AL city/team pennants.

The ads are from 1913.

Here is another ad for all eight pennants (Detroit Free Press - Mar 13, 1913):

Attachment 386622

While sorting through some boxes I had packed away, I came across an auction catalog from Mastro in 1998. Most of the items in this auction were memorabilia although it also had great cards including an ungraded T206 Wagner (which they admitted had some restoration). Among the items, were several vintage pennants which are pictured below. I have no idea how much any of these went for as I do not have the final price list. By any chance does anyone have the prices for this auction? It took place July 16-17, 1998.

I remember that auction. I do not have the prices realized, but am positive that the Oversized pennants sold for lots less back in 1998, while the more common ones sold for a bit more than they do now. This auction took place right before eBay took off...

I believe that eBay really changed the market for these things when they came into prominence. The Oversized teens pennants dried up completely, as you rarely see them on eBay anymore. Thus the severe price escalation. And the others from the 1950s-60s were proven to be more common than perhaps initially believed. Many/most of those prices have held stagnant, or have even dropped a bit in price.

I remember well when Lelands featured that Brooklyn Bum pennant (shown in the Mastro Catalogue). It was around that same time, and went for $750 plus the BP. Today, you’d do well to get $175 for it. Just some ramblings from a washed out “pennant guy”.

Thanks Mark. Your “ramblings” are always helpful.

White Sox pennant with the zigzag stitch

Nice and then there were 4!

Mark,
That “1931” A’s pennant looks like your 1936 Yankees pennant. I have not seen that A’s pennant before.

Regarding the 1931 Athletics pennant in the catalog ... This series has always interested me. Have seen a 1919 White Sox and I own a 1920 Dodgers. Clearly the same company that made these. Would love more info ...

Yes... it’s an intriguing series that seems to have spanned many years and covered many pennant-winning teams. I’ve also seen a Senators version (had to be from 1925, I suppose).

The only 1919 White Sox I’ve ever seen was in the original Halper/Sotheby’s auction. I believe it sold for more than $40K, but I will double-check when I’m back home.

I’m still a sore loser on the Yankees. I have seen others too. I’ve seen a 1920 Cleveland and obviously the newer ones like the Browns and Cardinals from late 30’s and early 40’s. I have owned and sold a few of the different Cardinals versions. I didn’t think the White Sox one went that high, but I remember it well and was wowed when I saw it. I don’t believe I ever heard where it went or referenced since that auction.

1920 Dodgers.

I think there might be a Giants one as well.

This guys fakes are getting more realistic looking.

Hi! I found this on eBay and thought you might like it! Check it out now! Special New York Yankees pennant 'UNCLE SAM' banner full size excellent Unique* https://ebay.us/V0tYGe

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1958 Braves Pennant help please
 

Disregard. I just had the brilliant idea of checking the Bay. Answered my own question. Its a common one as I thought. Thanks. Adam

No wooden mini-bat...? No tuft of white hair...?

THIS GUY'S AN AMATEUR :p

My guess is that it is a St. Louis pennant company, because of the prevalence of Browns and Cardinals team pennants ... don’t know if any other team has undated pennants from the series.

Was thinking ... an interesting project could be archiving pics of pennants not by team (like the pennant “price” guide) but by series. Hmmmm....

That would indeed be pretty cool. But it might involve some "guesswork" and maybe a few good debates every now and then. Sure would be fun to try.

I'll post something loosely related to that effect in just a minute...

OK, speaking of pennant "series"...

One thing I've noticed is that the "Stadium Pennants of the 1950s - 60s seem to have been released in multiple "series". A few examples pictured below...

1. Earlier Reds
2. Later Reds
3. Earlier Pirates
4. Later Pirates
5. Earlier Cardinals
6. Later Cardinals

My evidence to support this is that (as a kid) my Dad got me the LATER Reds and LATER Pirates pennants from Crosley Field. Both were bought in 1968.... just before the pennants all turned stiffer and featured the 1969 MLB Logo. So (sadly) these were the last "Stadium Pennant" designs ever produced.

A central theme seems to be that the earlier Stadium Pennants depict a larger stadium and the later versions feature a smaller stadium. I believe these were all made by Trench, so it's kind of cool that they kept things fresh by revamping the designs.

Here's a more perplexing one, of which I don't know the answer...

During their brief stay in Kansas City, the Athletics had 4 different Stadium Pennants (see below...) Anyone want to take a stab at the order in which they were released?

This one's a lot easier, based on the style of Wahoo...

1. Earlier Indians
2. Later Indans

Looking forward to reading Mark's posts but, for now, here's a photo of a pennant on ebay. Isn't this part of a series you guys were recently talking about?

Great observation Mark! These pennants don't get the love they deserve (at least monetarily), which I guess is good if you want to collect them. I've always been a bigger fan of the politically incorrect Indians mascot than the more delicate later one.

And I never quite got the concept of A's man. Ummm...errrr...why?

Hey Rob, that’s a Keezer for sure .... not one with zigzag stitching but still cool.

Mark: GREAT stuff, I’ll be chiming in shortly.

Now here’s the smaller Forbes stadium ... dated 1959. And a Redlegs with smaller Crosley ...

Baseball Rob:
Yes, I do think that Dodgers Pennant is likely part of the series that includes the Keezer Astronaut, Colt 45s, Oilers and Angels Pennants (in other words, not the zig-zag stitching series). It has the same level of rarity and a very similar design. It looks to have the right type of spine and thicker tassels, but would be good to have a better close-up shot, just to verify whether they are indeed "ribbed".

Football Rob:
Fully agree.... that "A" Guy might be the dumbest logo/mascot ever created. But regardless of "why" he was created, I think he represents the last A's mascot before leaving KC. They carried him over to the earliest Oakland A's pennants, so that one is likely the last-ever KC Stadium Pennant.

Greg:
You've shot some holes in my theory with that smaller Forbes Field (depicted on the '59 All Star Pennant). So I guess Trench must have sold the larger and smaller Forbes versions concurrently. Definitely some overlap there... but I know for a fact that the smaller Crosley and Forbes versions were sold in stadiums as late as 1968. Could've been just leftover inventory, I suppose. So the mystery continues...

D**gers pennant is $400 BIN or best offer.

I breathed a sigh of relief when I got this black, "horizontal bat" pennant. I had visions of one of my Giants "friends" snaking me on it....so much so that I increased my snipe from $130+ to $150+ to $200+ :eek:. Turns out I got it for $66 :D . I was going to (grudgingly) pay the $14.90 shipping but my snipe said shipping was $8.90....so, I asked the seller for clarification and he shipped it for $7.00! P.S. the tip is sharp.

Have we decided if this "horizontal bat" is unique to Giants or did other teams do it as well? It is about 50x (?) rarer than the vertical bat and bridge.