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-   Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions (http://www.net54baseball.com/forumdisplay.php?f=2)
-   -   Subject Front/Back Combo Completions (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=161829)

cfc1909 02-24-2013 09:54 AM

http://photos.imageevent.com/cfc1909...eBaltimore.jpg

DerekMichael 02-24-2013 11:51 AM

Seriously, your Baltimore runs are priceless!

cfc1909 03-02-2013 05:22 PM

http://photos.imageevent.com/cfc1909...0T206Backs.JPG


http://photos.imageevent.com/cfc1909...oughbacks1.jpg


http://photos.imageevent.com/cfc1909...toughbacks.jpg

http://photos.imageevent.com/cfc1909...oughbacksb.jpg

teetwoohsix 03-02-2013 08:12 PM

Very nice Jim, you have an amazing collection !!!

Sincerely, Clayton

atx840 02-01-2014 10:33 PM

Fun thread.

g_vezina_c55 02-02-2014 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atx840 (Post 1235289)
Fun thread.


THis thread need a pic of cobb front back run :)

Matvoo 08-12-2014 11:59 AM

Sorry to bump an old thread but looked through all pages and it was amazing
:eek::eek::eek:

Sean 08-12-2014 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matvoo (Post 1309314)
Sorry to bump an old thread but looked through all pages and it was amazing
:eek::eek::eek:

This is still one of my all-time favorite threads. :)

peterb69 08-12-2014 01:01 PM

One of mine as well

Jobu 08-12-2014 01:11 PM

Congrats, that is a nice group.

tedzan 08-12-2014 04:32 PM

Exclusive 12 / red HINDU run
 
These 12 subjects from the 460-only series are the only T206's in this series printed with the red HINDU back.

I'm still searching for the Sheckard card to complete this run of 12......any help acquiring this card is greatly appreciated.


http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...llDuffy25x.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...lDuffy25xb.jpg

http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eyerHumm25.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...erHumm25bx.jpg


http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx50.jpg

.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...Hummel25xb.jpg

http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...efFord25xx.jpg.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...heckard25x.jpg

http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...efFord25xb.jpg.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eckard25xb.jpg




TED Z
__________________________________________________ _____________________________________
LOOKING for this T206 guy to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 red HINDU sub-set (12 subjects)

SHECKARD (glove)
.

Sean 08-12-2014 05:26 PM

Great run Ted. How did Crandall and Duffy grade so low?

tedzan 08-12-2014 05:50 PM

Hi Sean
 
It's a good question. Perhaps the stain on the back of Crandall may explain the low grade. However, unless the Duffy has a flaw that is not evident,
it's a mystery to me why this card isn't at least a 3 (or even a 4).

These two cards were graded prior to my acquiring them. I'm tempted to have SGC grade them again on my next trip to SGC.


TED Z
.

ZachS 08-13-2014 02:05 PM

Sean C sent me scans of his Merkles and asked me to do a layout. Here's his very cool Merkle back run:

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...psa175b120.jpg


http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...psbfdc6282.jpg

Sean 08-13-2014 02:18 PM

Thanks Zach. I've posted these before, but I wanted to put them in this thread, and this grid format looks better than anything I could have done. :):):)

wazoo 08-13-2014 02:41 PM

:eek: :eek: :eek: wow what a collection

Sean 08-13-2014 02:58 PM

Thanks Waz. One of these days you'll be posting a Schlei back-run. :)

t206hound 08-13-2014 07:22 PM

My little contribution
 
2 Attachment(s)
I knew I should have posted yesterday... now I have to follow the Merkle with the Brown Lennox, Pirate and Uzit.

Ted showed his version of the Rossman run. My little contribution is the guy who only appears in four series... but I've added in two miscut cards to make it a little more difficult for others to complete :) Still missing the Rossman-Thomas. And I've almost completed it twice :)

shernan30 08-13-2014 08:05 PM

Some awesome collections!!

tedzan 08-13-2014 08:45 PM

Hey Erick
 
Don't forget the Type 1 "COUPON" :)




http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...Rossman50x.jpghttp://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...ps309a7233.jpg
.http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...ossman50xb.jpghttp://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...psa80d0b16.jpg


E96

http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...Rossman50x.jpghttp://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...ossman50xb.jpg



T-Rex TED
.

ZachS 08-13-2014 08:46 PM

Erick, even without the Uzit and brown Lennox that's still a nice run. I like the abundance of name top and bottom cards.

t206hound 08-13-2014 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedzan (Post 1309933)
Don't forget the Type 1 "COUPON" :)

If Burdick says it's not a T206... then I say it's not a T206 ;)

I'll try to get one some day... thanks Ted!

tedzan 08-13-2014 08:59 PM

Erick
 
We cannot fault Burdick....his records indicate that he had the Type 1 Coupon cards time-lined with the Type 2 and Type 3 (1914-1919).

But, we now know better. The type 1 cards are a 1910 Coupon issue.

I rest my case......these cards should be included in the T206 family.
'


TED Z

t206fix 08-13-2014 11:24 PM

Almost...
 
1 Attachment(s)
any help out there????

atx840 08-13-2014 11:31 PM

Nice Tony!!

Certain SC649OP subjects appear to be significantly harder to find with OM backs. I find one record of a Johnson selling on eBay back in 09.

t206fix 08-13-2014 11:42 PM

Thanks, Chris. I'm guessing it will be awhile until I complete this back run. The OM seems to be a tougher card to find:eek:, but it's the hunt that makes it fun! I've also seen a 649 with two factory numbers so if any one has one of those, I'd be interested in adding it to this run also.

bn2cardz 08-14-2014 07:29 AM

My only back run from the e90-1 set is this Krause, and as far as I know this is the only full back run made with these two backs (there aren't any other images only found with e90-1 back that is also found with a blank back):

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/...psd8b0da7c.jpg


I am currently working on another back run that is a lot more difficult, but since it isn't done (and doubt it ever will be) it can't be posted here.

Sean 08-14-2014 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t206hound (Post 1309874)
I knew I should have posted yesterday... now I have to follow the Merkle with the Brown Lennox, Pirate and Uzit.

Ted showed his version of the Rossman run. My little contribution is the guy who only appears in four series... but I've added in two miscut cards to make it a little more difficult for others to complete :) Still missing the Rossman-Thomas. And I've almost completed it twice :)

Hey, sorry Erich, I didn't mean to overshadow your Rossman run. And I think that those name-on -top miscuts are a nice touch. Good luck.

ZachS 08-14-2014 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atx840 (Post 1309975)
Nice Tony!!

Certain SC649OP subjects appear to be significantly harder to find with OM backs. I find one record of a Johnson selling on eBay back in 09.

There was one that was in a Sterling auction back in 2012... possibly the same one from the 09 ebay auction.

http://www.sterlingsportsauctions.co...entoryid=13384

t206hound 08-14-2014 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1310022)
Hey, sorry Erich, I didn't mean to overshadow your Rossman run. And I think that those name-on -top miscuts are a nice touch. Good luck.

No worries Sean... I said that in jest. Love those Merkles... almost as much as I love my Rossman-McBride miscuts. If I could just locate that Rossman-Thomas...

tedzan 08-14-2014 08:37 AM

SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #42 run
 
The Exclusive 12 subjects are the only T206's in the 460-only series printed with this SWEET CAP back.

.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...460x42x25x.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...460x42x25b.jpg


.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...460x42x25x.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...460x42x25b.jpg



TED Z
.

refz 08-14-2014 12:38 PM

Nice Ted! On those 12 does it matter which factory is on the sweet caps? 42 only?

tedzan 08-14-2014 12:49 PM

Hi Danny
 
The Factory 42 is significant because in this series the other 460-only subjects were not printed with the SWEET CAP 460 Factory 42 back.

And, while this back is not one of tougher T206 backs to find, it is nevertheless a tough back.



TED Z

jp1216 08-14-2014 07:27 PM

Shown before, but not in this thread. C.H.O.P. set:

http://www.billripken.com/bucket/T206_CHOP_Carey600.jpg

atx840 11-05-2014 06:29 PM

Picked up the tougher Buffalo Type-2, completing the Coupon run. Thanks Duncan!

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3777/...da2f9c46_b.jpg

Sean 11-05-2014 07:00 PM

That's great Chris. I didn't know that there are two different Chase Coupon Type-2 cards. Congratulations. :)

ZachS 11-06-2014 06:22 AM

Sean asked me to update his Merkle run to include the latest addition... a very cool Coupon Type 3 Fact 8 overprint:

http://i58.tinypic.com/1191ac9.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/27wrvkl.jpg

Sean 11-06-2014 10:12 AM

Zach, thank you again for making the Merkles look good. Since Chris bumped this thread, I thought I should add my recent acquisition.
Eighteen down, one more to go: T215 Red Cross. If anyone has even seen one of these, please contact me. I'd love to get confirmation that they exist, and whether they're a Type-1 or Type-2. :confused:

mrvster 11-06-2014 01:33 PM

Sean.....
 
:eek::eek::eek:

Tao_Moko 11-06-2014 09:07 PM

Tiny Run
 
1 Attachment(s)
Shared in another thread and very small compared to the others in this thread.

Sean 06-15-2015 04:50 AM

This is my all-time favorite thread. I'm going to bump it so that some of the new members will see it. :)

Joshchisox08 06-15-2015 09:44 AM

Sean all you did was make me very envious of people lol. I had actually considered doing a back run but there's so many cards I don't have.

I know which card/player it'll be when the time comes. Harry Davis batting.

docpatlv 06-15-2015 11:12 AM

My attempt at an Eddie Collins back run. I was the underbidder on the Cycle 350 in Goodwin's last auction. It might be a little tough to see but the Sovereign has a Yellow Kid stamp on the back. The duplicate Piedmont to the far right is a no name version.


http://i488.photobucket.com/albums/r...psbmqzixax.jpg

Sean 04-21-2016 05:44 PM

I'm bumping again for the new guys, and anyone else who enjoys back-runs. :)

Pilot172000 04-21-2016 05:53 PM

Thanks Sean!

ValKehl 09-16-2016 10:11 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Echoing what Sean and others have said, this is also one of my favorite all-time threads. I've always liked the Hugh Jennings cards with the orange background (orange is my favorite color), so when I won Leon's T216 Virginia Extra of Jennings in last year's Heritage auction to go with the T216 Mino and T216 Kotton Cigs of Jennings already in my type collection, I decided to work on a back run of this Jennings pose. Many thanks to Bryan L. (Net54 handle is "Jobu") for kindly taking my scans of the 8 cards I now have and turning them into the striking depiction seen below.

To the best of my knowledge, I need the following 9 cards to complete this back run (which I have no illusion of ever expecting to complete, but I'll have fun trying): D303 General baking, D303 Mother's Bread, E92 Croft's Candy-red & black backs, E101 anonymous set of 50, E105 Mello-Mint Gum, E106 American Caramel, and the two different back versions of T216 Kotton Tobacco. If I am wrong about this, someone please let me know.

One aspect of this back run that I find interesting is that the products advertised - bread, beverage, candy, chewing gum, eggs, and tobacco products (plus an anonymous issuer) - pretty much cover the entire gamut of the advertising found on pre-War cards.

Another interesting aspect to me is the great differences in the orange color of the background, from a rather light orange color to a deep orange-red color, which is immediately apparent from the way Bryan positioned the cards.
Val

Sean 09-16-2016 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ValKehl (Post 1585668)
Echoing what Sean and others have said, this is also one of my favorite all-time threads. I've always liked the Hugh Jennings cards with the orange background (orange is my favorite color), so when I won Leon's T216 Virginia Extra of Jennings in last year's Heritage auction to go with the T216 Mino and T216 Kotton Cigs of Jennings already in my type collection, I decided to work on a back run of this Jennings pose. Many thanks to Bryan L. (Net54 handle is "Jobu") for kindly taking my scans of the 8 cards I now have and turning them into the striking depiction seen below.

To the best of my knowledge, I need the following 9 cards to complete this back run (which I have no illusion of ever expecting to complete, but I'll have fun trying): D303 General baking, D303 Mother's Bread, E92 Croft's Candy-red & black backs, E101 anonymous set of 50, E105 Mello-Mint Gum, E106 American Caramel, and the two different back versions of T216 Kotton Tobacco. If I am wrong about this, someone please let me know.

One aspect of this back run that I find interesting is that the products advertised - bread, beverage, candy, chewing gum, eggs, and tobacco products (plus an anonymous issuer) - pretty much cover the entire gamut of the advertising found on pre-War cards.

Another interesting aspect to me is the great differences in the orange color of the background, from a rather light orange color to a deep orange-red color, which is immediately apparent from the way Bryan positioned the cards.
Val

Nice Val, and good luck. Especially with that Mello-Mint.

Rich Falvo 04-28-2017 07:06 PM

Looking through some old threads and came across this one again. Bumping it up in case new members haven't seen it. "Back run" threads are some of my favorites.

Rhotchkiss 04-29-2017 09:00 AM

Meant thanks Rich (and Sean) for continuing to bump thread

Rhotchkiss 04-29-2017 09:00 AM

Thank You Sean for bumping this thread; as you know, I am relatively new to this board and have never seen this thread (and certainly better reading than the Ultimate Trade up or Sands of our Lives Drama I waster 30 minutes on this morning). Back Runs are SO cool and I am 100% addicted to T206 backs! Current back-related pet projects: Tinker Bat off (really only need the AB, EPDG and Fact 42; Evers Chicago Shirt (tougher back still need are BL 460, Drum, CB Fact 42 and Tolstoi); HOF Tolstoi run, and; complete back run (preferably in HOF where possible).

Few things I have learned on this/thoughts:
1. It is an expensive endeavor, but so rewarding when you get something you need;
2. There are soooo many helpful and cool people in this hobby and on this board
3. Notwithstanding the above, you Gotta love the jerks who find out you are doing a back run and try to shake you down for way more than a card is worth bc they know you need it (my answer -- Go F$%# yourself)
4. Just when you think you have decided on 1-2 frolics/projects, more and more pop up -- this truly is the Monster
5. I find myself, even on common backs, caring as much about the way the back looks as the front; and on the rare backs, its 80% about the backs (especially with the big boy backs)
6. Paper loss on back is pretty much a nonstarter (but I say that as I continue to eye the BL 460 Baker in ML)
7. I love baseball Cards!!!!

Ryan

Bliggity 04-29-2017 10:48 AM

Nowhere near complete, but here's one I've been working on.

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...nbow-jan.-2017

tedzan 04-29-2017 12:01 PM

Deleted
 
Posted in wrong thread, sorry.

Sean 04-30-2017 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss (Post 1655911)
Thank You Sean for bumping this thread; as you know, I am relatively new to this board and have never seen this thread (and certainly better reading than the Ultimate Trade up or Sands of our Lives Drama I waster 30 minutes on this morning). Back Runs are SO cool and I am 100% addicted to T206 backs! Current back-related pet projects: Tinker Bat off (really only need the AB, EPDG and Fact 42; Evers Chicago Shirt (tougher back still need are BL 460, Drum, CB Fact 42 and Tolstoi); HOF Tolstoi run, and; complete back run (preferably in HOF where possible).

Few things I have learned on this/thoughts:
1. It is an expensive endeavor, but so rewarding when you get something you need;
2. There are soooo many helpful and cool people in this hobby and on this board
3. Notwithstanding the above, you Gotta love the jerks who find out you are doing a back run and try to shake you down for way more than a card is worth bc they know you need it (my answer -- Go F$%# yourself)
4. Just when you think you have decided on 1-2 frolics/projects, more and more pop up -- this truly is the Monster
5. I find myself, even on common backs, caring as much about the way the back looks as the front; and on the rare backs, its 80% about the backs (especially with the big boy backs)
6. Paper loss on back is pretty much a nonstarter (but I say that as I continue to eye the BL 460 Baker in ML)
7. I love baseball Cards!!!!

Ryan

Ryan, you also need to do a Sid Smith back run. How hard could it be? Piedmont, Old Mill, and Hindu. :)

Rhotchkiss 04-30-2017 01:04 PM

Good point but I am afraid the Piedmont could be a problem...!

Ronnie73 04-30-2017 04:30 PM

I agree that this is one of my more favorite posts also. Even though I don't have any pictures to post yet since I'm collecting all T206 front/back combos and not really focusing on any one card, on average I have many 4 to 6 card back runs and Hal Chase Blue Portrait is the most at 17 card backs. As I get closer to complete back runs, I'll start posting some pictures. Seeing some of the non T206 back runs posted here is making me want to start another project but I'm trying to stay focused for now and enjoying everyone else's posts and pictures. Thanks everyone for sharing.

Sean 05-18-2017 10:19 PM

10 Attachment(s)
I added the Lenox from REA, so I'm as close to finished as I'm likely to ever get. I'm missing the Red Hindu, which is one of one and belongs to David Hall. I'm also missing the T215 Red Cross, the only one I'm aware of belongs to Richard Masson ( same with my Merkle run: I'm only missing the T215 that Richard owns). Anyway, here goes:

Attachment 273586

Attachment 273587

Attachment 273588

Attachment 273589

Attachment 273590

Attachment 273591

Attachment 273592

Attachment 273593

Attachment 273594

Attachment 273595

Rhotchkiss 05-19-2017 07:23 AM

Pretty awesome Sean. Congrats!

Cooper1927 07-14-2017 06:01 PM

The other thread about back made me think about pulling this one back to the front.

Does anyone have the matty black cap run or the chase blue background run to post?

Sean 07-14-2017 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooper1927 (Post 1681001)
The other thread about back made me think about pulling this one back to the front.

Does anyone have the matty black cap run or the chase blue background run to post?

Chris and Ted both have Chase blue portrait runs going, though whether they wish to post them we shall have to wait and see.

Ronnie73 07-15-2017 08:50 AM

I always view Chris's Chase collection at this link. https://www.flickr.com/photos/732180...57633304393887
Haven't talked to him in a while. Hope he's doing well.

Sean 07-15-2017 08:53 AM

I heard from Chris before the REA auction. He said he was taking time away from collecting, but hoped to be back in the fall.

Sean 07-27-2017 10:22 PM

8 Attachment(s)
Here's my latest back run, Bresnahan. As always I'm missing the Red Cross back. :(

Thanks to the board members who sold or traded with me to make this run possible. And a special THANK YOU to Ryan Hotchkiss for locating the last card that I was missing. :)

There aren't any real tough back except for the Victory, but here goes:

Attachment 281940

Attachment 281941

Attachment 281942

Attachment 281943

Attachment 281944

Attachment 281945

Attachment 281946

Attachment 281947

charlietheexterminator 07-28-2017 12:30 AM

Hey Sean,

Awesome back run...

DeanH3 07-28-2017 10:04 AM

Awesome back run Sean! These threads sure do tempt me to try one as well.

chalupacollects 07-28-2017 01:26 PM

These are cool! Old school rainbows!

Thromdog 07-28-2017 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1684820)
Here's my latest back run, Bresnahan. As always I'm missing the Red Cross back. :(

Excellent Sean!

Rhotchkiss 07-28-2017 02:57 PM

Congrats Sean. The run looks great. Thanks for the shout out - glad I could help. I hope to be on here soon with a complete tinker bat off run, and closing in completing an Evers yellow sky run (but that sucker is tough!)

Sean 07-29-2017 02:53 AM

Jeff, Dean, Chuck and Chalupa: thank you very much. And Ryan, I can't wait to see that Evers run. That should be a killer. :)

Tom S. 07-29-2017 11:52 AM

Billy Sullivan
 
I just finished the first back run for my White Sox master set when I received the Sovereign 350 that was included in my latest SGC submission. Sorry for the large scans!

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image.../sulivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy
https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...sullivan-billy

Sean 07-29-2017 03:23 PM

Very nice Tom. :)

Thromdog 07-29-2017 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom S. (Post 1685185)
I just finished the first back run for my White Sox master set when I received the Sovereign 350 that was included in my latest SGC submission. Sorry for the large scans

Congrats..... very nice!

Sean 07-29-2017 04:47 PM

Tom, how are you going to finish a White Sox master set with that Walsh/ Blue Old Mill out there? :D

Tom S. 05-02-2018 09:24 PM

Second T206 back run completed
 
I just got the EPDG back from SGC to complete the Lee Tannehill back run for my White Sox T206 master set... :)

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

https://www.collectorfocus.com/image...ehill-on-front

Luke 05-02-2018 10:03 PM

Nice Tom! Thanks for posting. Love those Old Mills in particular.

Rhotchkiss 05-03-2018 04:22 AM

Congrats Tom, that’s great! And smart - I keep picking players for back runs who have Drums or Uzits or BL 460s, etc :confused:

realbigfatdog 06-02-2018 06:13 PM

Wow, there are some really incredible back runs here (as well as some incredibly patient collectors putting them together). I know these are not T206, but here is a Jeff Sweeney run I have of various backshttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...0dc804058c.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Sean 06-02-2018 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by realbigfatdog (Post 1783031)
Wow, there are some really incredible back runs here (as well as some incredibly patient collectors putting them together). I know these are not T206, but here is a Jeff Sweeney run I have of various backshttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...0dc804058c.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Nice run; and they don't have to be T206. :)

realbigfatdog 06-02-2018 09:37 PM

Hal Chasehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...810699178c.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...65c1562c2b.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Thromdog 06-12-2018 03:46 PM

Pattee
 
Finally found the Sovereign.....such a tough card to find. One of my fave in the set, obviously. ;)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1738/...73c2b189_b.jpg

Ronnie73 06-12-2018 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thromdog (Post 1786109)
Finally found the Sovereign.....such a tough card to find. One of my fave in the set, obviously. ;)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1738/...73c2b189_b.jpg

Looks great Jeff!!! I agree that it is a tougher than average card. Same print run as the Pelty's. When the price was rocketing on the Pelty's, I was buying these fairly cheap. Still missing the Hindu on my back run.


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