Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson (Post 1653606)

I thought the new hire turned out to be his wife???

Then again, maybe neither nor or either or...

Originally Posted by Bored5000 (Post 1653409)

Michael Jordan cards are usually a good place to find some shady bidders. I didn't even look through half the 473 Michael Jordan auctions that PWCC is running currently, and the number of auctions in which the high bidder and/or underbidder has double digit retractions is just overwhelming.

The following auctions are just a sample of the bidding going on with Michael Jordan cards, and this is why posters are at least skeptical of how serious the attempt is to stamp out the problem. It's not like there are one or two auctions (or 20) out of thousands is which a questionable bidder is flying under the radar.

Edd*e Sm*th




Here is a Jordan Star card in which the high bidder has 15 retractions in the past six months (and feedback of over 50,000):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/142348167708...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Here is another Jordan Star card in which the high bidder has 26 bid retractions in the past six months (and feedback of over 40,000):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/352029920968...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Here is a Jordan auction in which the top three bidders have 7,8 and 21 bid retractions in the past six months:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1999-UD-MJ-M...4AAOSw~CFY8Sk4

Jordan auction for a 1986 Fleer sticker in which the high bidder has 14 bid retractions in the past six months:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-Fleer-S...MAAOSwj25Y8COL

Another Jordan auction in which the bidder with 26 retractions from above is also winning:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1987-Fleer-B...4AAOSww3tY7~6i

Another Jordan Star auction in which the underbidder and second underbidder have 15 and 14 retractions, respectively:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

A 1998 Jordan Flair Showcase card in which the high bidder has 11 bid retractions in the past six months:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1998-Flair-S...wAAOSwGy5Y8SiC

Jordan Star card auction in which the underbidder is the previously mentioned account with 15 retraction in the past six months:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Another Jordan auction in which the high bidder is the previously listed account with 26 bid retractions:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Another Jordan auction in which the account with 26 retractions is the high bidder. Not to be outdone, the underbidder has 27 retractions:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Jordan auction in which the top two bidders have eight and 21 retractions:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1999-UD-MJ-M...EAAOSwj25Y8SlP

Jordan card on which the underbidder has 14 retractions in the past six months:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2002-UD-Lege...QAAOSwB-1Y8Sm9

Another Jordan auction being won by the bidder with 26 retractions:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Jordan card in which the earlier mentioned accounts with 14 and 15 retractions are the current top two bidders:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1985-Star-Ga...QAAOSwGy5Y8B-A

Jordan card being won by the account with 15 bid retractions:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Another Jordan auction being won by our old friend with 26 retractions:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1993-Ultra-S...kAAOSw3utY8SVB

Mr. 26 retractions is the underbidder on this Jordan card:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1996-Topps-C...8AAOSwCWFY8Sc2

The account with 15 retractions is again winning this Jordan auction:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1985-86-Star...i:401307987090

Our man with 26 retractions is on top again in this Jordan auction:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1987-Fleer-B...cAAOSwc49Y8CIe

The 26-retraction account again leads the way on this Jordan card:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1993-Ultra-S...8AAOSwTM5Y8SVZ

Jordan auction in which the underbidder has 27 retractions:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2008-Exquisi...UAAOSw~CFY8SvG

Another Jordan Star card in which the account with 26 retractions is on top:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-Star-MJ...cAAOSwnF9Y7~6N

Yet again, the 26 retractions account is the high bidder:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-Star-MJ...AAAOSw03lY7~9H

This Jordan auction has an underbidder with 21 bid retraction in the past six months:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1999-UD-MJ-M...oAAOSwmgJY8SlQ

Jordan card in which the top two bidders have 13 and 21 retractions:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1999-UD-MJ-M...i:401308459405

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens (Post 1654830)

Thank you most sincerely for sending this to us. We placed blocks on 12 user IDs following this message (many of the problematic bidders from the multiple listings were the same user ID).

As always, until eBay allows us to filter bidders by defects like bid retraction history, assistance from the community in identifying bidders in violation of our policy is greatly appreciated.

Betsy Huigens
PWCC Auctions, LLC

Originally Posted by irv (Post 1654842)

What I don't understand is, how can a regular collector get this info quite easily but it takes you, a big seller on E-Bay, to rely on feedback in order to do the right thing? :confused:

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide (Post 1654860)

Probably because they have a massive number of listings going at the same time. I usually have only 300 or so auctions going at once and it would be impossible for me to monitor every single bidder for their retraction history. The only time I ever look at a bidders history is when they have actually retracted a bid. It would be very easy for ebay to allow sellers to block serial bid retractors but ebay doesn't want that to happen.

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide (Post 1654860)

Probably because they have a massive number of listings going at the same time. I usually have only 300 or so auctions going at once and it would be impossible for me to monitor every single bidder for their retraction history. The only time I ever look at a bidders history is when they have actually retracted a bid. It would be very easy for ebay to allow sellers to block serial bid retractors but ebay doesn't want that to happen.

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79 (Post 1654864)

Even if it was your full time job to do so? You can get any kid off the internet for 9 bucks an hour to police this stuff. You could outsource it to India, for 3 dollars an hour if you are that hard up for cash.

It is a zero skill job. I know for a fact I could find someone for 3.00 an hour within 1 day time.

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide (Post 1654860)

Probably because they have a massive number of listings going at the same time. I usually have only 300 or so auctions going at once and it would be impossible for me to monitor every single bidder for their retraction history. The only time I ever look at a bidders history is when they have actually retracted a bid. It would be very easy for ebay to allow sellers to block serial bid retractors but ebay doesn't want that to happen.

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79 (Post 1654864)

Even if it was your full time job to do so? You can get any kid off the internet for 9 bucks an hour to police this stuff. You could outsource it to India, for 3 dollars an hour if you are that hard up for cash.

It is a zero skill job. I know for a fact I could find someone for 3.00 an hour within 1 day time.

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 1654876)

From my understanding from Betsys posts is they have someone to do this job. Maybe they are just really bad at it.

Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson (Post 1653606)

I thought the new hire turned out to be his wife???

Then again, maybe neither nor or either or...

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide (Post 1654877)

I would think it would be easier and cheaper in the long run for PWCC to have someone design a program to monitor their bidders. People have made apps that let you know who unfriends/unfollows you on facebook, it can't be much harder to program than that.

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 1654876)

From my understanding from Betsys posts is they have someone to do this job. Maybe they are just really bad at it.

Originally Posted by Snapolit1 (Post 1652853)

I don't understand the hostility directed at PWCC for at least trying something. I have had real issues with them in the past unrelated to this issue, but it seems like some of you are expecting them to solve eBay weaknesses and cure a few diseases at the same time.

It may be a surprise to some of you, but PWCC can't tell eBay how to run their business. Yes, there is a problem with apparent shill bidding and BS bid retractions on some of their items. Maybe a not insignificant number of their items. There are consignors out there who will have friends and family, and maybe even themselves with alternative accounts, pump up the price of their auction items. This is an auction fact of life. Happens on eBay and happens everywhere else. Could happen at the church auction down the street. The guy bidding against you may have no interest other than helping someone else make more money. Deal with it. It's reality.

As far as bid retractions go, I have no evidence that they are worse for PWCC than any other major card seller. Nor do I have any belief that they are any worse than say some dude selling 10,000 hummels or 10,000 watches a month on ebay. Game playing will go on. If eBay allows people to retract bids with impunity, and PWCC reaches out to them to do something, I take this as both a tacit admission that there is a problem here that should be addressed and a positive sign that Brent thinks his company's credibility is taking a meaningful hit.

My final point is that I DO NOT find 5 bid retractions a day high for an outfit that often has 5,000+ items listed at a time. That might get 25,000+ bids in a day I'd guess. 5 or 10 or even 20 of those bids are retracted. I'd say at least 50% of those could have been genuine errors. Doesn't seem overly crazy to me.

Long winded way of saying that it seems many of you have real problems with eBay and blame PWCC for them.

If someone is retracting more than 5 times on PWCC in a 3 or 6 month period they should be barred from any PWCC auctions for 6 months. Although that probably wouldn't solve the problem anyway, as a person who wants to defraud others can just open a new account.

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards (Post 1655313)

FWIW I just sorted all their listings by "Rookie" and Highest Price. Went through the first dozen or so and was pleasantly surprised to see almost no retractions. Worst was 6 (which is still concerning) but I checked the top 5 bidders (not bids, but distinct bidders) of each auction and the vast majority were zero, with a couple of 2's and 3's and the one 6. I know it's fashionable to bash PWCC, but this does look like improvement to me.

PS. Brent, until you can pull the data from ebay directly sorting by highest price or number of bids and then examining bid histories would be more productive then random, or trying to focus on one type of card.

Originally Posted by vtgmsc (Post 1652757)

Brent,

Thank you for the monthly checks that ALWAYS arrive on time and for the crazy prices you get on some of my items!

I have NEVER been withheld funds on ANY item I have ever sent. I guarantee you that some of my items were not paid for since I've been consigning for 2 years now but I have been paid for EVERY item ALWAYS.

Thanks Brent!

Peace, Mike

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole (Post 1655391)

This nicely summarizes the issue presented here, and on the other PWCC thread. Crazy prices are paid and that's all that matters. How? No worries. Doesn't matter how. Doesn't matter if its fraud. For those sales that are, shall we say, less than on the up and up, you can say exactly the same thing that an honest seller would say and unless you do a Sherlock Holmes job, no one is the wiser. And some shill of the seller can come on here and solemnly proclaim how on the up and up it was and then be all indignant when people call bullshit. Right. I get it.

I seldom buy anything on eBay anymore, and these two threads make me question whether I should even bother trying to buy anything ever again. What a shit show. I hope that all the principals involved in this sad debacle experience the karma that they very richly deserve.

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens (Post 1654830)

Thank you most sincerely for sending this to us. We placed blocks on 12 user IDs following this message (many of the problematic bidders from the multiple listings were the same user ID).

As always, until eBay allows us to filter bidders by defects like bid retraction history, assistance from the community in identifying bidders in violation of our policy is greatly appreciated.

Betsy Huigens
PWCC Auctions, LLC

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards (Post 1655313)

FWIW I just sorted all their listings by "Rookie" and Highest Price. Went through the first dozen or so and was pleasantly surprised to see almost no retractions. Worst was 6 (which is still concerning) but I checked the top 5 bidders (not bids, but distinct bidders) of each auction and the vast majority were zero, with a couple of 2's and 3's and the one 6. I know it's fashionable to bash PWCC, but this does look like improvement to me.

PS. Brent, until you can pull the data from ebay directly sorting by highest price or number of bids and then examining bid histories would be more productive then random, or trying to focus on one type of card.