1971 Topps Color shift
 

Found this card today in a vending box of 1971 cards.

Best regards,

Joe

There’s a similar thread as this one in the post 80s forum. You should share it there as well.


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Black border break at top and bottom of portrait.

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"Lefty" Grove comes with or without this mark in the left border. It's a green line with a small red line above it. Most Grove's are found off-center with a thicker left border, but even those not cut properly usually don't have the mark. I don't know the sheet layout but would guess this is probably a mark from the sheet, by a single slot, for part of production. I have only noticed this on the normal cream stock, not the tougher glossy version of the issue (card on the right is the glossy).

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Nice looking pack Al.

Very clean!

The # 80 card cost more than the pack ;) It is on the back of the Grove. Can also be found on the backs of Tinker and Collins. Grove seems to have it more than the other two, but still quite rare. They do not come up very often. Not likely issued at retail, unless maybe a few by mistake. They can be found as unissued proofs or cancelled/cut. There is no Pepper Martin card in the set

What is this thing! A 1969 topps project Alcaraz card via photoshop?... ;)

If I got that sorting through a lot I'd stop right there with 'my purpose has been served'

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Ever since I found Mr. Dingmans list, I have been a variation adding fool.
I recently picked up the following 1971 Topps Bob Johnson's. Two were somewhat expected (left and center) and one, the 50th Anniversary card, was not expected.

Cheers

Butch

You may be buying some of them from Richard. He is selling a lot of his variants on eBay now. He sells as brightair

I sent him a direct email after seeing a number of his postings on eBay. Indeed I have purchased a number of them from him directly. Which is cool! :cool:

Butch

Butch- do you have the 1971 Nash and Northrup blobs? There are some graded out there. I saw some at the Chantilly show and picked up.

I had a 1969 Topps 50th stamp of the 1969 Arcia white letters (prob 1 of 1) - but I sold it :( to buy more cards :)

Best,
Ed

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Ed,

I do have the Nash blob and I have 3 color phases of the Northrup blob.

Nothing wrong with selling a card for more cards. :)

Butch

1975 Strom
 

I checked mine and it looks perfectly normal - was this left off the earlier posts for that reason, or was it that this wasn't a commonly known variation?

Yes, that is the common card of Strom.

I think it was just not included in the initial postings.

Ok….found another 1967 Topps back variation…..517 Fred Talbot can be found with white spec top and black dot spec’s in stat box

I have spent way too much time recently examining 1969 Topps #50 Bob Clemente cards, and I noticed something pretty cool. I call it 'Redbatto Clemente.'

The Clemente on the left is the traditional card, wherein his bat is the basic light beige color without a speck of magenta to be seen. The two cards on the right, though, show how his lumber can be found transformed into a piece of redwood...

Attachment 536075

Since there are countless 1969 Clemente cards on eBay, it's relatively easy to track one down, but their occurrence rate as a percentage is extremely low. The extra red is quite noteworthy in his fleshtones as well.

1966 Ed Bailey
 

I ran across the second one of these recently.

Eric---I have one of the Baileys as well. The amount of red seems to verry some. Scarce recurring print defect ?

1962 #471 Mantle AS
 

I found this on a listing for it at $600 on ebay. Thankfully I got this one for about $80 from another seller. I have only seen these two with the white line across the top of the red info blurb. I also notice that on the lower example, there is some red in the stitching on the ball. It appears that the ball is down farther.

Picked this up on ebay for low $...the seller had a few other similar cards avail with more popular players (unissued proofs) Seem real...not sure they are retiring from making fake Mark Wagner test proofs?


If anyone has any cool unissued photo proofs (like the 1967 Maris Yankees) pls share. I always had my eye on the 1977 Topps Proofs with unissued photos (I've seen them listed here or there) but could never part with the $.

Best,
Edhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...17f95bdfa4.jpg

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The 1982 Fleer Test cards are legit and not overly rare, I think the only pricey ones are a couple of Cal Ripken’s.

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The last are extension of these

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Ok….I’m so tired of looking at my 1967’s lol. I found another variation….470 bob Shaw can be found with bottom black boarder break under the S in Mets

The Shaw border break can be found without the red registration issue so I guess you could get 3 versions:)

I found a million dollar error…….yeah lol……eBay 1/1 :)

A Bob Shaw or 1967 master set collector would almost have to have it whatever the cost :)

1959 #85 Anderson
 

Here are three RV of this card. The bottom one was bought by me in 1959 from a wax pack so it is not something I did to it. The middle one has some missing stats and there are a few of these on eBay and perhaps COMC.

Finaly checked my set. I have the middle deviant, so had to look for normal card. That has happened to me a few times during this thread.

Sharing as a tribute to Dusty looking so happy tonight post the walk off win...

Um but still...go Yankees! (and Mariners)

Green print shift
...and the elusive blue....https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...9dfc41f130.jpg

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Shift is a neat one. There are several threads in here on how blue variants arise, like the 58 Aaron or the 66 Mays

Nice color shift on the top Baker.

Below is my elusive white letter Hebner card, missing the yellow just like the bottom Baker card. My guess is that the missing yellow on both cards is due to the same source....too much sun light. My Hebner card came straight from my west facing window after sitting there for about a month or so.

Shoutout to Ed for the following.

69 Topps Ed Stroud Blue mark on his shoulder. Not sure if this is the one that Dingman documented or not. He mentioned a black mark so if someone has the black marked one, I would like to see it to compare with this one.

Hi I heard the yellow to white but not yellow to blue. I thought topps just didn't run the yellow (to make green) will check the other article mentioned in above reply.

So for the Ed Stroud Card that Butch just posted are we saying that if he left it in the sun that Senators and Stroud would turn white and the green circle would turn blue?...I haven't seen that happen...but open to learn more.

Didn't someone post a blue team circle 1969 Hannah a few years ago? To prove the theory above, was the team name in white?

Best,
Ed

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Sometime back some blue 58 Aarons turned up and sold for high dollars as missing color variants, but some of our printing slouths. Ben and Steve I think, demonstrated that blue turns to green after a lot of sun or light exposure.I think Ben posted results of some experiments he ran.

Here are my Mays and Aaron. Fortunately I got my Aaron after the market imploded on them. The amount of blue varies depending on exposure. Some Aarons are much bluer than mine.

You can also see yellow goes white

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For the example you gave, yes, most likely the team name would turn white and the green circle would turn blue if left in the sun for an appropriate amount of time. The yellow ink that Topps used in this time period appears to be the quickest to fade as compared to the red and blue inks.

Below are some examples (I have posted previously in this thread) of this same scenario where some clever person tried to create their own WL version of these cards that do have WL variations. They merely covered all but the top portions of each card (the reason the team name didn't turn yellow) which caused the upper parts of the green circles to turn blue and the yellow letters to turn white. On the Epstein card, you can still clearly see the green below the WLs of Epstein.

I’ve made some “blue” vintage Topps cards from green cards a couple of ways. Exposure will do it easiest. I do not believe any of this type, even when people are paying hundreds of dollars for these “variations”, are legitimate. None of them left the printer this way, it’s damage. It looks cool sometimes though.

I'm going to say that was all Ben, who has really studied and experimented with the fading. A missing color is possible, but considering how easily they can be made from normal cards I'd have to consider any missing yellow to be very suspect.

The Mays is a really strange one, having a different color back. I'd have to experiment a bit to see how to make that happen with chemicals, as I don't think it's fading.

Everyone needs to remember that 'savedfrommyspokes' Larry is the dream killer!!! When you've discovered an incredibly, historically new variation, he turns your life into a nightmare as he proves it to be nothing more than a fanciful daydream. And I should know, because like others, my head is a trophy mounted on his wall. :D

(Great guy, though!! ;))

Yes agreed. Everything looks so dark on the Baker card (without any fades). In my heart of heart I feel the 1971 Topps crew smoked a few extra marlboro 100's on the back dock while the yellow ink ran out.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...d324d930b0.jpg

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This is why the myth persists, and some are still manufacturing these to sell on eBay. People want to believe they are real. The ink didn’t run out. These blue Topps cards are honest damage or dishonest alteration. Yellow to white and blue to green should raise immediate flags on a Topps card, just as red to orange on a T card should but often doesn’t.

The irony of this is that my head is right next to Darren's on my own wall.....within a few weeks of each other, we both had picked up these historic 71 WL cards from the same source. After getting my 71s and thinking back to all of Ben's sun tests on cards, I tried it on a 71 myself....

As Darren's collectorisms list grows seemingly daily, I may have missed it, but I am quite sure there should be a term for this scenario if there is not already.

Sunny Strays comes to mind. But I don’t have the pizzazz that Darren has with these creations.

103. Rays of Might
Asking whether a card is a ‘missing ink’ variation or just a card affected by overexposure to sunlight.

See also: Sunblather - trying to convince someone that an obviously sun-bleached card is a rare, missing ink variation.

See also: Fraudosynthesis - leaving a card out in the sun for a long time, and then attempting to convert the inevitable color fading into the energy of big-time dollar signs by calling it a ‘missing ink’ variation.

See also: Sunspurn - not buying the bogus story being sold to you about a 'missing ink' card.

Missing the "I" in the "1961 BATTING LEADERS" line.

This recurring back obscuration can be found in varying degrees in size.

I am not ready to see the light (pun intended) of salvation!...that Baylor is soooo dark.

I just can't accept that cheap Topps printers never ran out of yellow....even with all the stuff we've seen in this thread...never no yellow? Whoever sold yellow ink to Topps (always stocked up)...lived in a big house on a hill.

Butch...leave that Stroud in the sun!

Ed



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Oh, I wasn't responding to you, just to Larry who wondered if I have 'Collectorisms' for these types of things.

Please look at this from a different perspective. By your reasoning that some aloof worker allowed the yellow run to happen with no yellow ink, then there should be multiple other cards from this sheet that would normally have either green or yellow letters but due to the missing yellow would then have either blue lettering or white lettering instead.

In my 40+ years of collecting, I have not come across, either personally or seen through forums such as this, other cards from this sheet missing their yellow run. Not to say they have not been out there for years, and just not uncovered. However, logic would dictate that sometime over the past 51 years some astute collector would have pointed these yellow-less cards out to the rest of the hobby...as far as I know, they have not.

Bottom line is if the Baker is legit, there should be other yellow-less cards out there.

Now, watch in the next month or so, they'll be a plethora of yellow-less 71s pop out of the woodwork (after 51 years of not being discovered).

Why are the vast majority of alleged 'missing color' cards the colors that just happen to easily fade to the color the card has present instead? Why is it almost always yellow to white, green to blue on Topps, red to orange on T cards?

Reason gives us the answer.

Ed, No way dude! :D

Sharing the Topps color wheel of doom! Middle left is not a safe place to be.

*This image is a 1 of 1 nft variation with red and blue in white font ;)

I had bought the 2 bakers from the same seller (same blue tape) ..at least he (and I) went 1 for 2 in identifying print variations.

Ed
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Interesting Pesky
 

Hello Everyone,

I got this card in a lot of 1949 Bowmans the other day. First, I thought it was just a faded card, but then the gray strip at the top of the card and the ghost image of Pesky's hat at the center top, caught my eye. I guess that it is a missing color, gray slate variation wan-a-be. Any thoughts?

Best regards,

Joe

The layers of colors are misaligned, hence the cap, the gray strip at top, and the misalignment in his jersey text. Gray/Slate fronts are totally missing a color to make them appear that way, and this card is an exemplar that shows why. Without the red layer, that's the background color

Neat defect Joe

Thanks Greg and Al.

I understand the misalignment defect that caused the gray strip and the ghost images with the Boston logo and the jersey text, but I am still not getting the error in color. All of the Pesky cards that I see on eBay or the other red background 1949 Bowmans that I have in my possession are a rich deep red color. (I am attaching a picture of the Pesky next to a Rosen card to show the difference in color.) My question is the difference in color have to do with natural sunlight fading, or is there another missing color in the Pesky card? In other words, are there two separate printing errors, poor alignment and missing color?

I appreciate the board's expertise and patience.

Best regards,

Joe

Much older cards were sometimes done with multiple layers of similar colors, but that was pretty much out by the late 40's. Nearly everything you'll see postwar is just CMYK. None of those are missing, so it's down to if it's fading or not.

Yellow seems about right.
Blue Seems a bit light
Black/gray Shouldn't fade and looks about right
Red is obviously light.

Red can fade readily for a lot of the colorants, so fading wouldn't be a surprise.

But here, we have an extra complication. (Don't we always? :) )

Note how blue and red are in registration with each other. And how yellow and black are in registration with each other.
That's a sign that a 2 color press was used. Pretty cool.
Red and blue both being from the same pass and both being light makes me lean towards the sheet it was from being used for press setup. Adjusting the registration and ink levels. Probably an early pass, when the plate wasn't fully inked, and registration hadn't been fully adjusted.

Of course, it's possible that red and blue fade more readily than yellow and black on 49 bowmans.

1967 #403 and #361
 

Saw the 1967 Nen variation thread and checked my cards. I don't have the missing position variation, but I did have 7 copies of the card and noticed what looks like three different printings, with color differences. In the top row, the Senators team name is darker, almost blue, the sky is darker blue and the image of Nen is a bit muddy. In the second row, Senators is more purple, sky is lighter blue, image is clearer. In the third row, Senators is almost pink, sky is almost white, and image is very clear though a lot lighter.

http://moviecard.com/aapics/403nenx7F.jpg

Also notices on Checklist #361 card, the backs can be found in tan or white.

http://moviecard.com/aapics/361checklistx4B.jpg

I think you can find differences in all the 67 checklists, but on 361 the only 2 I have involve those same back color differences. Anyone have other differences ?

The only variation I have seen listed is the boxes are either even with the names and numbers or they are lower. Photo from Mike Cody's website.

Mike

Attachment 540639

Check out this thread I started many moons ago about 1967 checklist variations...

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=207639

That was a very helpful thread Darren. I had forgotten about it. I did find the front difference you point out on the two different color backs I have. The Clemente with the darker line under his chin and mark by his ear occurs on my whiter version

I am sure this print defect has shown up here somewhere before. A friend would like to know if our print experts have a theory on how both the white letters and the mark below his lips may have occurred

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Another cloud variation card....two different recurring copies with clouds behind the bat, on one copy the cloud almost reaches the helmet, the other doesn't.

Not a variation, just an oddity. Maybe everyone else already knows. The main pics are reversed but the insert photos are correct

Another 71 Pirate, #212 Hebner and I think a tough one. Finally found a second card with this defect to confirm it's not some other mark. Small black loop in the lower right of the white inner frame.

EDIT: Very similar to the long known Reberger #251, though not as easy.

#283 Dick Such, with a black line through the "e" in "pitcher". Found a second one online here.

Got my bimonthly 'box of vintage low grade rando's' from my dealer last week and sorting through all the 71's in it. #328 here of Don Buford WS has this blotch next to "GAME" in the card title. I'm 90% sure it's original printing but I can't find a second copy readily to confirm if it is a variant.

#426 Chris Cannizzaro, with and without a bold black spot on his glove. A look at COMC suggests both versions are roughly equally common.

577 Lonborg, recurring but difficult bluish ugly splotch over ear. I don't think I've shared this before, apologies if it isn't new.

Not a recurring defect, but a print variation as the thread originally asked! Slight registration issues can make for amusing cards. Cook on the left looks freaked out, Cook on the right looks calm.

That 71 Cook is awesome, I will need to look for one.

Cook looks like he, ummmmm, got hit by a batted ball.....somewhere on his body..

ROFL!!!!

Now I have to go digging through my dupes.

Your take on that facial expression is much better than mine :D

507 George Stone with green ink smeared over his legs and up the viewer's left side of his chest. I see a couple on COMC, so this is a recurring print defect, not a one off. Doesn't seem that hard.

On versions without this green defect, the areas of his uniform it covers are slightly darker, maybe a very slight bluish tint to those exact spots. Interesting.

So I was looking at Giants player Frank Johnson's crotch. The blue line appears to always be there, but it doesn't look like the green spot it runs through is always present and is a recurring defect.

Just not sure how to respond to this without being sent to the sin bin for a 5-minute major and a game misconduct. So I will just say.......thanks.

:p

It’s a hard job, but one of us variation nerds has to be the one to examine Giants crotches. I will make this sacrifice for the team

Wahahahahahaha,

You are THE MAN!

Thanks

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I posted that Paul Gibson a while back in the thread that someone created about strange cards.

I have the Mantle bat/ball/buster but now I have to go looking for the Charley Sands pee card.

Thanks Al ;-)

ROFL

Butch--Unless you collect the 75 Minis you may not need to worry about Sands