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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Thanks Bruce.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>Were you two guys like lovers in a previous life? Talk about overkill. One thing i know to be fact is that people will buy cards at a auction house and then immediatly put them on e-bay or another auction to make money. I saw several of my cards sold while i waited for my consignor check.
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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Your last comment towards Barry was uncalled for. He was only thanking Bruce for a compliment. I hope no one compliments me, or else, according to you, I might have to do unnatural acts with them?
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>It's okay Leon- Marshall's erratic behavior and inappropriate comments are well known by now...water off a duck's back.
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Two thoughts: <br><br>Leon, comeon, not that there's anything wrong with that. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>And Marshall, I was speaking tongue in cheek. Urban legend has it that certain auction house(s) falsely report as sold certain lots when in fact the lots do not change hands due to either a promised price not being reached or the consignor simply protecting his lots by 'buying' them. Sometimes consignors use their close friends to bid and protect their lots. Sometimes they even use their employees. For example, if I had a bunch of expensive lots in an auction and I was a neurotic, dishonest jerkoff I might have my associate bid on my lots in an effort to set an artificial reserve price just so that I wouldn't lose a few dollars that I would not otherwise miss.
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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>I don't even.....well, never mind. <br>But back to the topic...You certainly hit the nail on the head. I can't stand the shennanigans that go on in our hobby. If a consignor wants a reserve why is it so difficult just to have a reserve and it be known? As we spoke, if I go to sell some of my cards I am sure there won't be a market as strong as what I have paid due to the false bidding; that I am positive of. It kind of sucks. best regards
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>Leon...i was just kidding around. Barry i meant no harm to you and everyone knows who you are and what you stand for. I just found Bruce's post sappy so i should have just said that. One thing is for sure is that when my cards were sold at Milehigh before i got paid the cards were for sale elsewhere and i will leave it at that. Here is a prime example of what kind of activity takes place at auction houses.<br><br><br><br>Freeman's auction house just outside of Philadelphia recently sold 5 Faberge items. The estimates on each piece were from 1000 to 3500. I know one of the top 3 Faberge experts in the world and he said 100% the items were fake which i thought all along after handling the pieces, the hallmarks were not right and neither was the craftmanship. The top item sold for 650,000 and two of the others brought 100,000 plus. There could only be two reasons for this. 1.The Russians could possibly be laundering money because what a inventive way to launder 1,000,000, just consign a couple of fakes and then have two people bid the items up so that the money changes hands. 2. The consignor figured by establishing the prices that if they would run them through another auction a few years from now then the prices are set. These kind of activities go on all the time.<br><br><br><br>
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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>no prob.... AND I agree the smoke and mirrors approach sucks. I probably shouldn't say this because I run an auction....but I don't like the fact that any auction house employees can bid in their own auctions. That's just my personal opinion. regards
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Posted By: <b>Rob D.</b><p>What would be the harm in a law that would prevent the two or three major auction houses from getting the best consignments? Maybe they could be limited to having only so many items valued at $15,000 or more in an auction, and the rest of the high-profile items could be redistibuted to smaller auction houses, who would then auction them.<br><br>After all, is it right that such a small percentage of houses continually get all the best stuff? Don't smaller auction houses and dealers deserve to make a living? Shouldn't the wealth in this hobby be spread around?<br><br>Just asking.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>I went to a auction the other day where the family was bidding against the public and also the auctioneer bid on several items. I thought to myself what in the hell is going here? So i thought you know this is just not right so everytime the auctioneer started to bid on a item instead of holding up my bid card i just yelled out yeah loud for the next bid, when the item got near the market value i dumped it on him. After three pieces of that going on he stopped bidding (lol).<br><br><br><br>The auction took place in Virginia and when i went to settle my bill the auctioneer asked where i was from. He said he did not appreciate me running items on him in the sale and that he genuinely wanted the items.....Rigggghhhhttt i might have been born at night but it was not last night. I told him well the next time you decide to have a auction perhaps take yourself out of the game and do not bid, my belief is no auctioneer or employees should be allowed to bid on items in a sale.
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Hard to believe an auctioneer would actually say that to an active bidder. Live auctions really have some funky stuff going on. Part of the problem is everything moves so quickly, and most improprieties won't get noticed. Before you can blink you have to focus on the next lot on the block.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>I think the problem with auction house shilling and things of that nature are simple. Everyone knows who the whales are what they buy, also when you see a card that three or four people need to bump their set registry average then that is when someone can be hammered. I only bid at live auctions where i can see what is going on and i never bid against a left bid,phone bid or internet bid. If you look at the above advertisemnt for Mears auction the first bullet point is No Shill Bidding!
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Marshall, fraud is obviously rampant in auction houses in general -- and in any unregulated business. As I've been crying about for years, in certain auction houses it's patently clear that items are run up by the house. I think if you cut off all ten fingers of certain acutioneers they'd use their toes to press that button on the computer to run up a price. You cut off their toes, they'd use their noses -- which are appropriately long enough to do the job due to all the lying they've done when loudly and publicly proclaiming that their auctions are clean.<br><br>As for Rob, at last you're getting it, comrade. It's about time someone stood up for the little people. And before anyone claims what you're saying is socialism, I disagree: you're just advocating spreading the wealth around, that's all.<br><br>Edited to add: yes, I need to find out who does Mears' marketing. Simply brilliant: no shill bidding. What a relief, I feel so much better. Does that rule apply to the 23,000 Mears' items in Mastro's latest auction? Because I've got a hankering for a 1990 NY Knicks Pete Meyers game used jersey and I need to know this before battling it out.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>I'm getting ready to head to a auction today and this place just cracks me up. As soon as i hit the door this gal will spot me and start pointing out where all the rare items are in the sale-as if i could not find them myself- i already know that consignors put things in the sale hoping that myself and a few others will get into bidding wars on them. The last sale i just sat motionless as a painting sold for way under the money and there was so much tension it was sickening. The auctioneer looked my way several times while selling the painting and i just kept reading the Racing Form. Also everytime i bid on items people will bid against me because they feel the piece must be valueable which can get old. Now what i do is just have this old man that i know bid for me and i give him a few Yankee cards for doing it. He is 82 years old and just breathes pinstripes so for him to have a card of Whitey Ford or any other Yankee is heaven.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>Jeff you are cracking me up today. Let me say that there is about 20 auction houses within a 40 mile radious of where i live. Every one of those auction houses is unethical in some way or form. This one auctioneer before every sale starts out with bible versus and praising Jesus, he then states that the proceeds will help God's will and the family. The guy is such a con artist that it is sickening but i love the action and have gotten some bargains at his auction house.
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>"This one auctioneer before every sale starts out with bible versus and praising Jesus, he then states that the proceeds will help God's will and the family."<br><br><br>It's fairly well known that Jesus was a big time collector of Koufax, Greenberg, and several other Jewish players. I'm sure I read that on this board, so it must be true.
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Posted By: <b>Alan</b><p>You mean that auctioneer is not Jewish ? <img src="/images/wink.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="wink.gif">
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>Let's just say he did not start the day with bagels and cream cheese.
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>It's also been pointed out that when an ebay seller includes "god bless" in his item description, you know right there he is a con man.<br><br>Marshall, you must find an auction to go to every day. Where do you live?
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Posted By: <b>Dan Bretta</b><p>Marshall, I know firsthand some of the complaints you are talking about with local auctions. I used to collect coins and would attend a regular coin auction. They had a guy who would bid the first bid on nearly every single lot and he made sure that gold/silver never went for less than the market value. I found out later that this guy had a gig on the radio with one of the auctioneers appraising items for callers...I saw a story on them in the newspaper. My brother was a much bigger buyer at local auctions than me...I generally only bid on items that I collect (Baseball)..but it got to the point that people would bid against him just because they figured it had to be worth something if he was bidding. I also have had occasion where someone would bid me up just because I was bidding on something so I started bidding on a few items I didn't really care for and then stuck them with it.
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Jim, Jesus was a big-time collector of cards of Jewish players. He often trolled the pre-1930s section on ebay and put in one simple word in his search: "JEWISH." That usually turned up plenty of great cards though sometimes he was misled into bidding on Moses Yellowhorse and Jerry Moses cards or even an occasional fake 'underprint' card. Yes, even 2000 years ago frauds existed.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>Dan...the same thing happens here. What i do not understand is how come there are not laws in place against these type of things. If a auctioneer thought his license could be pulled then maybe he or she would think twice. In the state of Md you do not even need a license. I could rent out the local community center and throw a huge auction if i wanted to.
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>Barry you are right, when i see a listing that says God bless or Christian owned and operated i know it is a farce. I am remodeling the downstairs bathroom so i have had guys come in and give me estimates, this one dude came in and started right off with the christian owned and operated gig and i immediatly showed him the door, he was stunned and i said oh well and just shut the door. I saw him talking to himself as he drove away. I never trust anyone who starts bringing religion into any business dealing right off the bat.
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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>Im owed $15,000 and have been told 3 weeks in a row that the money is coming, wire problems, banking problems, etc etc. I wonder if thyer are waiting until thier current auction finishes until they can pay out to people from money that comes in.<br><br>Not hijacking your thread, im new but usually post in non sport section.<br><br>
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Posted By: <b>Ted Sherman</b><p>All my high bids are already outbid, looks like the FBI isnt scaring anyone <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>Jason</b><p>Looks at all these liberals askin big brother to come in and regulate their hobby/industry. Big governmt I tells ya!
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Posted By: <b>D. C. Markel</b><p>I rarely post on this Forum, but about 5 months ago I posted a message venting my dismay with Mastro since I wanted to consign a big ticket item for their December 2008 auction and contacted them and I didn't receive a reply back until 3 weeks later. After not hearing from them for a week I decided to go with another major auction house for their December 2008 auction and was quite pleased with the final hammer value and have since been paid.<br><br>In short, with all this nonsense going on, thanks Mastro for ignoring me. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>Andrew</b><p>...when i see a listing that says God bless or Christian owned and operated i know it is a farce. I am remodeling the downstairs bathroom so i have had guys come in and give me estimates, this one dude came in and started right off with the christian owned and operated gig and i immediatly showed him the door, he was stunned and i said oh well and just shut the door. I saw him talking to himself as he drove away. I never trust anyone who starts bringing religion into any business dealing right off the bat.<br><br>________<br><br>Spot frickin on. Praise the Lord.<br><br><br>"Take your life in your own hands and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame." -- Erica Jong
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Man! I hope none of you guys live in the deep South!<br><br>This was always one of my kids favorites!<br><br><a href="http://www.cbac.com/mission_purpose.aspx" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.cbac.com/mission_purpose.aspx</a>
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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Whenever I go to get my car fixed I just pray I don't get hosed. Personally, I don't really care what the technician or company believes in, in their personal life as long as they fix my car problem. Praise the lord and pass the biscuits.
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Me too, Leon. But these guys are in McKinney and Frisco, and every time we drive by, my kids crack up laughing.
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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>I have seen them too...I think they have a shop over on Midway and the George Bush Tollway too....I always thought it might just be their last name, but I guess not. I guess I could start a shop that is named "Jewish Fat Bald Guy Automotive"......
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Posted By: <b>Jodi Birkholm</b><p>Two things I REALLY wish I knew more about: cars and computers. Alas, my mind isn't geared towards the intricacies of the internal combustion engine or microprocessors. In life, finding an honest mechanic and affordable tech support are two of the best (and rarest) things that can happen to you.
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Posted By: <b>J.McMurry</b><p> Well I guess I have two strikes against me, I am from the South, and I am a Christian,but I too am put off by people who use their religion as an advertising tool. The first thing that usually comes to mind is rip off,but you would be surprised at the number of little old ladies around here that allow that to influence what businesses they use.<br><br>ps. Jesus would never get stuck with a fake card, because He could always make it real when no one was looking.
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Posted By: <b>Robert Klevens</b><p>My Mastro consignment check just arrived. I am off to the bank.
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Posted By: <b>boxingcardman</b><p>"Well I guess I have two strikes against me, I am from the South, and I am a Christian"<br><br>Now that's not fair; no one here has taken a pot-shot at being either from the South or an adherent of any faith. The comments have all been directed at people who try to use their professed faith as a business tool to convince customers that they are inherently more trustworthy, and the ironic reality that so many obvious ebay frauds try to paper over their scams with "God bless" or similar seemingly religious invocations. <br><br>Let's shelve the "I'm a persecuted Christian Southerner" rap; none of that is happening here. Yes, many of us on the West Coast and East Coast would just as soon revisit the end of the Civil War and allow y'all to secede if you asked again; we'd even give you your hunk of the deficit as a lovely parting gift. But here, my friends, cards are what make the friendships, not regional or religious alignments. Heck, some of my closest friends here are Christian Southerners <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Jody, <br><br>I meant no offense, to either Southerners or Christians. After all, I'm a Catholic, living just outside of Dallas. <br><br>I apologize if you you took my attempt at humor as an insult.
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Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>"Many of us on the west coast and the east coast would just as soon revisit the end of the Civil War and allow y'all to secede if you asked again"<br><br>Hmmm--I like Southeners--I can think of a lot more regions of the country I would like to get rid of than the south--after all--they are the only ones across the region to have the sense to vote for McCain.
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Posted By: <b>Dan Bretta</b><p>NO POLITICS....<br><br>And no religion too....
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Posted By: <b>J.McMurry</b><p> No,No guys, My bad attempt at self deprecating humor based on other threads. Sorry bout that. I dislike the "persecuted Christian rap" as much as the "advertising I'm a Christian business" rap. In fact,I cant even stand rap.<br><br>Sorry, no offense meant or taken.<br><br>
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Posted By: <b>Rich Klein</b><p>At least they know exactly what coffee regular means <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>And Jim; I'm still waiting for your exclusive card or photo honoring the PSA HOF so I can have you included in my hobby collection <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>Regards<br>Rich
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>So Jim, I guess you would have downtown Brooklyn wiped off the map...after all, we're all just a bunch of overeducated latte sippers. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Barry, <br><br>For a variety of reasons, ALL of Brooklyn may be on the list...<br><br><br><img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>Steve F</b><p>I've been saying it for years and here it is... Montague Street, The Rodeo Drive of the East Coast!
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Brooklyn's a pretty big place...I believe we would be the fourth largest city in the nation if we seceded from Manhattan.<br><br>Steve- Montague Street is right up the block...I was there this morning.
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Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Barry,<br><br>Yup--Brooklyn is on the list--in fact the only borough that is not on the list is Staten Island--you can also have Massachusetts, Vermont, New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, DC, Illinois, Minnesota, Oregon and California.<br><br>Jim
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>What do you think Jim...a civil war? Brooklyn vs. Staten Island? We'd whip them for sure.<br><br>Are you going to join us for the Net54 dinner next week at the Brazilian Steakhouse?
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Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Barry,<br><br>You probably would and then you would raise their marginal tax rates to 90 percent <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">.<br><br>When is the dinner?
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>It's next Tuesday at 6:00 PM, Fifth Avenue at 26th Street.<br><br>I'd offer to pick up the tab but I haven't gotten my stimulus check yet.
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Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Barry,<br><br>I will be in Texas/New Mexico for much of next week.<br><br>Leon says if I take him out to a good enough dinner he will teach me about vintage cards. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Hey! A Texas dinner is a great idea. We have way better steakhouses here!
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Whoa pardner...we've got Peter Luger's...end of story! <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>Jim- we'll catch you next time.
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Posted By: <b>Rich Klein</b><p>Need an excuse to go to a good steakhouse <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>Rich
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Barry, <br><br><br><br>Smith & Wollensky couldn't cut it here because of local competition. They gave up in less than 2 years. <br><br>Edited to add: I lived in NYC for 15 years of my life. Worked in Brooklyn for 3 of them. (I still can't believe that Gage & Tollner is now a T.G.I. Fridays!) I don't recall seeing one cow or steer. Your steaks are being shipped in from here! (Maybe a few are coming from Dan Bretta country.)
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>The Smith and Wollensky in Manhattan is quite good...Gage and Tollner has been gone awhile now.
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Prizner</b><p>Luger's rules. And I live in TX.
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>That's the spirit Jeff.
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Posted By: <b>Larry</b><p>Barry- Byrne's Steak House in Tampa is very impressive, even w/ Peter Lugers being here!
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Posted By: <b>Richard Masson</b><p>Hungry Lion<br>North Platte, Nebraska<br><br>Steaks so big you need two plates.
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Uh, Jeff? You're missing the point. We're trying to get Leon (and maybe Jim C) to pony up for a Plano/Addison dinner! (And maybe, pick on Barry a little at the same time.)
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>You can pick on me anytime. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>I have to say I'm not a huge fan of Smith & Wollensky in Manhattan. Luger's is simply the finest steak on the planet. When in Manhattan I'd take the Palm first with Sparks second.
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Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Jim,<br><br><br><br>I am hosting a business dinner in Dallas this coming Monday but I will buy you a drink or two if you can find your way to the Mansion on Turtle Creek.
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Posted By: <b>Tom Boblitt</b><p>I don't think you'll get a stimulus check this time. It'll just show up as an addition $8 a week. For those in White Castle country, that means you go from a sack of 10 to a 'Crave Case' and no more.........<br><br>We have this high fallutin steak house here in KY called the Longhorn.......not sure if Richard's palace in Versailles is near one......<br><br>For the uninitated....that's ver-sails, not ver-sigh
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Posted By: <b>Joe D.</b><p>"I have to say I'm not a huge fan of Smith & Wollensky in Manhattan. Luger's is simply the finest steak on the planet. When in Manhattan I'd take the Palm first with Sparks second."<br><br><br>Jeff... the finest steaks on the planet are in Aruba.<br>They get their beef from Argentina. I don't know what they feed the cows down there - - - but it makes for incredible steaks.<br><br>I guess based on that - Argentina would have great steaks too, but I've never been there so I couldn't say.
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Posted By: <b>Joe D.</b><p>"What do you think Jim...a civil war? Brooklyn vs. Staten Island? We'd whip them for sure. "<br><br><br>Hey now Barry... I don't know about that!<br><br>I say we ask the criminal defense attorney for his expert opinion on this one.<br><br>Whip Staten Island? fughettaboudit
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Staten Island is a bunch of wusses. We can take you with one hand tied behind our backs! <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif"><br><br>And back to steak: Argentina is 8000 miles away, and Peter Luger's is right off the BQE...and when am I going to the southern hemisphere?
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Prizner</b><p>oh my bad Jim, in that case Bob's rules.
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Posted By: <b>marty q</b><p> hey easy on staten island, my hometown for 37 years, now a jersey boy, and besides about 75 % of s.i. is from brooklyn..lol..
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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Hands down for me, it's Fogo de Cao.....Other than that maybe Ruth's Chris....
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Posted By: <b>boxingcardman</b><p>The best steak is the one I make at home. I pick the meat I like at the butchers, trim as needed, season and cook it just as I like it, and serve it the way I like it. I've stopped going to steak houses (and I've tried many in LA, NY, Vegas and several other cities) because I just don't care for their product as much as mine. But, I suppose for those of you who either don't have access to a grill or can't use it for months at a time due to inclement weather, a steak house will have to do. <img src="/images/sad.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="sad.gif"><br><br>Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>But Leon, you've never eaten at Luger's...so we will have to disqualify your vote.
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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Marty brought up a good point: Most of SI is filled with ex-Brooklynites. However, much of SI is now filled with criminals who walked out of the Witness Protection Program.<br><br>Very tough call...but I'd have to say that I'd take SI in a war with Brooklyn. Ten years ago my answer would have been different.<br><br>
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Posted By: <b>Joe D.</b><p>thank you Jeff - - - Barry is living in the past.<br><br><br>Jeff - you are welcome to the island.
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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Leon, <br><br>I love Fogo, but I'm never sure I can eat enough to get my money's worth. And then they have the nerve to tempt you with that outstanding salad bar. Like I would fall for that in an "all you can eat" restaurant.
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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I haven't given up yet Joe. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height="14" width="14" alt="happy.gif">
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Posted By: <b>marshall barkman</b><p>That is what i love about this board. A topic such as Mastro auctions ends up at the end in a debate over steak houses. The last time i was in Dallas the gentleman's club had a knockout steak and the service was out of this world (-:
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Posted By: <b>TONY</b><p>This thread started about Mastro.net<br><br>Now we are onto dead cows & where to find such eateries<br><br>Can we compare mastro.net to a dead cow!!
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Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>Flint Michigan has the only "DickMonalds" with a McSteak and a very special sauce....ya'll a coming this way ?
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More bad news for Mastro
Posted By: <b>Tony Andrea</b><p>"D" -<br>Now that's funny sh_t......<br><br>Tony A.
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