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rats60 10-05-2021 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowman (Post 2150907)
Yet another reason why people often say "baseball is all luck". The Dodgers were the best team in baseball this season (and by a sizeable margin as well). They have an SRS of 1.6 vs the Giants 1.2, which is a better predictor of playoff success than is total wins or even Pythagorean wins (and they had 109 PWs vs the Giants 101). Yet, here they are in a one-game playoff just for a shot at a series against the inferior Giants (albeit with a slightly better record).

Here's an interesting and relevant excerpt from The Drunkard's Walk that I often reference when discussing statistical probabilities in baseball with my friends...

You say it, but that doesn't make it true. Baseball is a situational game. Games are decided by performance in clutch situations such as getting a two out hit with runners in scoring position or on the other side getting the third out to get out of the jam. Pythagorean wins are just a bunch of nonsense. All they do is tell how much a team under performed or exceeded expectations in crucial situations. They aren't real.

That is a really ironic quote. The Giants and Dodgers played a 162 game schedule and the Giants won more games. However, you have decided because of " theoretical" wins, those 162 games should be ignored and the Dodgers are the best team. Why even have a playoffs? Just give them the title because you said so.

mrreality68 10-05-2021 02:50 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Go Yankees Go :D

Snowman 10-06-2021 03:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rats60 (Post 2150946)
You say it, but that doesn't make it true. Baseball is a situational game. Games are decided by performance in clutch situations such as getting a two out hit with runners in scoring position or on the other side getting the third out to get out of the jam. Pythagorean wins are just a bunch of nonsense. All they do is tell how much a team under performed or exceeded expectations in crucial situations. They aren't real.

That is a really ironic quote. The Giants and Dodgers played a 162 game schedule and the Giants won more games. However, you have decided because of " theoretical" wins, those 162 games should be ignored and the Dodgers are the best team. Why even have a playoffs? Just give them the title because you said so.

The great thing about statistics is that we don't have to guess at who is right or wrong. We can test out different theories and see which ones are more predictive of future success. Pythagorean wins are not "a bunch of nonsense". They are more predictive of future success than regular wins are. It may be a statistic you don't care about, but that doesn't mean it's not useful or informative. I've been building predictive baseball models for years using advanced statistical techniques (I also work in this field). I've beaten the Vegas spread 8 of the last 9 seasons. I am well tuned into what makes one team better than another, and spoiler alert, it's not their record of wins & losses. I assure you, on a neutral field, the Dodgers in a 7-game series would be favored against any team in baseball this season at every sportsbook across the country. But that doesn't mean they will win the World Series. There is a tremendous amount of variance and short-term luck in baseball. Far more than in any other major sport. The worst team in the league can beat the best team on any given night. This almost never happens in football or basketball. It's just the nature of the game. The difference between a game-winning double in baseball can be a bad hop where the ball catches a seam on the bounce, or whether or not the seam on the ball makes contact with the bat, causing the ball to shoot off at a different angle, or the launch angle can be changed by just 1 millimeter difference in the swing plane. A player has little to no control over many of the most important variables that ultimately determine the outcome of a game. Anyhow, I could go off on this topic for hours, but nobody wants to read that. I'm either preaching to the choir or arguing with someone who has no idea what they're talking about. I'm not breaking new ground here though. This stuff isn't exactly a secret.

TUM301 10-06-2021 05:21 AM

I like to sit in the bleachers at Fenway, get a sunburn eat pretzels and watch the game.

mrreality68 10-06-2021 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TUM301 (Post 2151283)
I like to sit in the bleachers at Fenway, get a sunburn eat pretzels and watch the game.

Good Problem to Have and Great Stadium to enjoy it in

Sadly my team will be sunning on the beaches in Florida

Snapolit1 10-06-2021 06:08 AM

All the post mortems on the Yankees will talk about a lost season and what a mess it was. Yep, team 21 games over .500 and it was a complete
and utter train wreck and heads should roll. The depths of Yankee fan entitlement never ceases to amaze me all these years later.

Some guy is putting his 27 rings leather jacket back in the closet for a long winter. Outraged that somehow one of more teams performed better than the Yankees. Not how it was pre-ordained.

mrreality68 10-06-2021 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1 (Post 2151294)
All the post mortems on the Yankees will talk about a lost season and what a mess it was. Yep, team 21 games over .500 and it was a complete
and utter train wreck and heads should roll. The depths of Yankee fan entitlement never ceases to amaze me all these years later.

Some guy is putting his 27 rings leather jacket back in the closet for a long winter. Outraged that somehow one of more teams performed better than the Yankees. Not how it was pre-ordained.

Hi

I am not sure which Yankees fans are feeling entitled or which are bitching about the season.
I hope you were not implying I. I was just saying to H Murphy that it was a good problem to have and enjoy it and my team will not be since his team beat mine.

Snapolit1 10-06-2021 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151297)
Hi

I am not sure which Yankees fans are feeling entitled or which are bitching about the season.
I hope you were not implying I. I was just saying to H Murphy that it was a good problem to have and enjoy it and my team will not be since his team beat mine.

No Jeff. Honestly didn’t see your message.
Just on Twitter this morning reading one hand wringing outraged post after another.

mrreality68 10-06-2021 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1 (Post 2151300)
No Jeff. Honestly didn’t see your message.
Just on Twitter this morning reading one hand wringing outraged post after another.

Thanks for the clarification Steve.
my misunderstanding (especially since it came right after my post.
Like any fan of a team that lost I am frustrated about last nights game. But
1. I respect and enjoy what they have done this season
2. Respect the fact that they got beat in the wild card game and wished their fans to enjoy their run (I cannot wish the Boston Team a good run since we consider them the arch enemy :D )
3. Even choose the picture of the card for the game of ruth "NY Card" wearing the Boston uniform as a tie in)

bxb 10-06-2021 07:07 AM

The Yankees and Red Sox are both very good teams. They played 20 times this year with an 11-9 split. That game could have gone either way.

Baseball is a strange sport in that over the course of a season, the best teams win 3 out of 5, and the worst teams win 2 out of 5.

The unpredictability of any given game is part of its appeal I think.

Frank A 10-06-2021 07:17 AM

Yankees are GONE. Breaks my heart. NAAAAAAAAAAA

timzcardz 10-06-2021 07:59 AM

If you don't play well enough over the course of 162 games to avoid being caught up in a single game Wild Card game, you've got no one to blame but yourself.

Love the Yankees (as much as they aggravate me at times), but they but they fell short of what was required.

mrreality68 10-06-2021 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank A (Post 2151311)
Yankees are GONE. Breaks my heart. NAAAAAAAAAAA

For us fans it is a heartbreak. (same for any team that had a chance to make a run)

Especially since our NY Football Teams seasons ended before it started and as a result we have a long fall and winter sports season. :(

Peter_Spaeth 10-06-2021 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rats60 (Post 2150946)
You say it, but that doesn't make it true. Baseball is a situational game. Games are decided by performance in clutch situations such as getting a two out hit with runners in scoring position or on the other side getting the third out to get out of the jam. Pythagorean wins are just a bunch of nonsense. All they do is tell how much a team under performed or exceeded expectations in crucial situations. They aren't real.

That is a really ironic quote. The Giants and Dodgers played a 162 game schedule and the Giants won more games. However, you have decided because of " theoretical" wins, those 162 games should be ignored and the Dodgers are the best team. Why even have a playoffs? Just give them the title because you said so.

On paper the Dodgers do look like the superior team, but it's hard to argue with the Giants' success. As I recall the Giants teams that won the WS three times in the 2010s weren't overwhelming on paper either.

Peter_Spaeth 10-06-2021 10:01 AM

Martinez' injury is of concern. With a not so great staff, the best path to victory is to score a shitload of runs lol.

BobbyStrawberry 10-06-2021 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2151345)
Martinez' injury is of concern. With a not so great staff, the best path to victory is to score a shitload of runs lol.

Doing that against Tampa's pitching will be quite a challenge. But Alex Cora has proven he knows how to find, ahem, ways to win...

D. Bergin 10-06-2021 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151306)
Thanks for the clarification Steve.
my misunderstanding (especially since it came right after my post.
Like any fan of a team that lost I am frustrated about last nights game. But
1. I respect and enjoy what they have done this season
2. Respect the fact that they got beat in the wild card game and wished their fans to enjoy their run (I cannot wish the Boston Team a good run since we consider them the arch enemy :D )
3. Even choose the picture of the card for the game of ruth "NY Card" wearing the Boston uniform as a tie in)


Yeah, I thought the Yanks did well to even make the "Wild Card" game. Half way through the season, they didn't look like a team that should even be a part of the playoff picture.

Part of me wishes they would do a 3 game series for that spot, rather then a 1 and done. Makes things kind of anti-climatic, but it is, what it is. More for a team like the Dodgers this year, rather then the Yankees.

I'm an odd sort of Yankee fan I guess, in that I'd probably root for the Red Sox, if they were to get to the World Series. I'd rather the AL East team that beat out the Yankees win, then the NL team I'm more unfamiliar with. Unless maybe the Brewers get in the series. Then I might have to root for them to get their 1st title.

Peter_Spaeth 10-06-2021 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry (Post 2151353)
Doing that against Tampa's pitching will be quite a challenge. But Alex Cora has proven he knows how to find, ahem, ways to win...

Short series, one can always hope.

Shoeless Moe 10-06-2021 04:44 PM

WS
 
How 'bout Brewers vs. the Astros

Wait.......who's the NL team and who's the AL team?

egri 10-06-2021 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Bergin (Post 2151359)
Yeah, I thought the Yanks did well to even make the "Wild Card" game. Half way through the season, they didn't look like a team that should even be a part of the playoff picture.

I'll be curious to see if they bring Aaron Boone back. He did bring them back from the dead, but he also had them at .500 in July, and although I don't follow them too closely, he seemed like he pulled a few headscratchers during the season.

SteveS 10-06-2021 10:35 PM

How 'bout those Dodgers!!

Vegas Cards 10-06-2021 10:54 PM

Epic game setting up what should be an intense series. Two best teams in baseball this year meeting for the first time in the post season.

Snowman 10-07-2021 02:32 AM

Well, what do you know... The Dodgers opened up as a -144 betting line favorite to beat the Giants in the NLDS despite the Giants having home-field advantage.

The best teams don't always win, but they are always the betting favorite.

mrreality68 10-07-2021 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowman (Post 2151564)
Well, what do you know... The Dodgers opened up as a -144 betting line favorite to beat the Giants in the NLDS despite the Giants having home-field advantage.

The best teams don't always win, but they are always the betting favorite.

I am not a fan of either team
But I am a Baseball Fan and Love a Good Game/Series
This has the potential to be a classic.

Should be a Great Series and on paper the Dodgers Should be the favorites based on their pitching and offense.

However the Giants are built more old school style and have veteran players that know how to play good fundamentals, knows how to work the count and work the pitchers pitch count up, and just get on base. Their defense has also been more solid than I would have thought.

So I will be Cheering for a Close, Tight, and Long Series

SteveS 10-07-2021 07:46 AM

The lifelong Dodger fan in me obviously picks them to win it. And the objective baseball observer in me agrees. I'll take Buehler, Urias, and Scherzer in any series where a trash can isn't involved.

But as much as I despise the Giants, I have to tell you why their manager, Gabe Kapler, is a class guy. My dad and stepmother have a small, two-unit apartment building behind their house. About ten years ago, they were looking to rent one of the units, and a big, muscular guy showed up. My stepmother asked him if he was an athlete, and he introduced himself and said that he was a baseball player and he lived down the street, but was looking for a place for his brother. My dad said that his son is a huge baseball fan and would be excited to know that he was there. He ended up deciding that the apartment was probably too small for his brother but he'd let him know about it, then left. But a few minutes later, he came back with a couple of autographed cards and asked my dad and stepmother to give them to me. Just a nice guy doing a nice thing.

mrreality68 10-07-2021 08:29 AM

Any Prediction who is going to win each series and in how many games?

Peter_Spaeth 10-07-2021 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151633)
Any Prediction who is going to win each series and in how many games?

Contrarian (sort of) picks.
Giants in 5.
Braves in 4.
Red Sox in 5 lol.
Astros in 4.

BobbyStrawberry 10-07-2021 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151633)
Any Prediction who is going to win each series and in how many games?

Giants in 5
Brewers in 3
Rays in 4
Astros in 5

tschock 10-07-2021 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowman (Post 2151564)
Well, what do you know... The Dodgers opened up as a -144 betting line favorite to beat the Giants in the NLDS despite the Giants having home-field advantage.

The best teams don't always win, but they are always the betting favorite.

Dodgers were 0-2 this year when they were the underdogs (home and away), so they were favored to win in all but 2 games. Giants were 33-24 (25-14 away, 8-10 home) when listed as underdogs, yet ended up essentially with the same record as the Dodgers. The Giants also as an underdog had the best point-spread and margin of victory of any team in both leagues. It wouldn't be a big surprise (to me) if the Giants lost 2 games at home and still won the series (or at least went 5 games). They seem to be one of the best teams to do the most with the least. I think it will be a 5-gamer to decide.

And I just realized, that since the Dodgers were the underdogs only 2 times this year, that means at most the Giants were the favorites against them only 2 times, yet the Giants went 10-9 against the Dodgers during the season.

egri 10-07-2021 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151633)
Any Prediction who is going to win each series and in how many games?

Giants in five.
Tampa Bay in four.
Astros in four.
Brewers in five.

Snowman 10-07-2021 10:37 AM

My experience as a life-long Dodgers fan tells me that they will probably lose the series. But my experience as a sports bettor tells me to not bet against them.

mrreality68 10-07-2021 03:58 PM

My predictions (none of these are my teams)

Dodgers in 6
Braves in 5
Houston in 7
Tampa in 7

Then Dodgers over Braves
Tampa Over Houston

Then Dodgers over Tampa

SteveS 10-07-2021 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151785)
My predictions (none of these are my teams)

Dodgers in 6
Braves in 5
Houston in 7
Tampa in 7

Then Dodgers over Braves
Tampa Over Houston

Then Dodgers over Tampa

Jeff, I love your pick of the Dodgers' winning it all, but these series going on now are best of five games.

mrreality68 10-07-2021 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveS (Post 2151804)
Jeff, I love your pick of the Dodgers' winning it all, but these series going on now are best of five games.

Wow pretty pathetic of me.

Major oops

End result the same but this round

Dodgers in 4
Braves in 4
Houston in 5
Tampa in 5

And plenty of pie on my face lol

Shoeless Moe 10-07-2021 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2151813)
Wow pretty pathetic of me.

Major oops

End result the same but this round

Dodgers in 4
Braves in 4
Houston in 5
Tampa in 5

And plenty of pie on my face lol

Hey since you're probably a Mets fan it's understandable you are not familiar with the playoff structure.

egri 10-12-2021 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by egri (Post 2151676)
Tampa Bay in four.

Well I got the number of games right, just not the outcome...

mrreality68 10-12-2021 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by egri (Post 2153195)
Well I got the number of games right, just not the outcome...

At least you got the right number of games. I got both games and team wrong.

With my results I think I will switch jobs and become a weather person on network tv

Snowman 10-12-2021 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrreality68 (Post 2153197)
At least you got the right number of games. I got both games and team wrong.

With my results I think I will switch jobs and become a weather person on network tv

Move to San Diego if you do. Easiest job on TV.

SteveS 10-12-2021 07:17 PM

Astros vs. Red Sox. Didn't need a trash can or Apple Watch to see that coming.

BobbyStrawberry 10-12-2021 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveS (Post 2153312)
Astros vs. Red Sox. Didn't need a trash can or Apple Watch to see that coming.

Word is that both teams are being outfitted with "Altuve Edition" jerseys with built-in buzzers.

SteveS 10-12-2021 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry (Post 2153322)
Word is that both teams are being outfitted with "Altuve Edition" jerseys with built-in buzzers.

And "bad tattoos" to hide the evidence.

jingram058 10-13-2021 09:17 AM

It's deja vu all over again, 70 years later...1 game to decide the pennant, er, NL West. The Dodgers just announced their starter is Newcome, with Branca out in the pen. The Giants will of course go with Sal the barber. They were out shining up the Eddie Grant plaque, and touching up the Always Buy Chesterfield, as well as the green. Sal Yvars is taking his telescope out to the clubhouse, and testing the signal button to make sure the buzzer is working in the dugout...

Peter_Spaeth 10-13-2021 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jingram058 (Post 2153456)
It's deja vu all over again, 70 years later...1 game to decide the pennant, er, NL West. The Dodgers just announced their starter is Newcome, with Branca out in the pen. The Giants will of course go with Sal the barber. They were out shining up the Eddie Grant plaque, and touching up the Always Buy Chesterfield, as well as the green. Sal Yvars is taking his telescope out to the clubhouse, and testing the signal button to make sure the buzzer is working in the dugout...

Anyone who has not should read Don DeLillo's fictionalized account of the game.

BobbyStrawberry 10-13-2021 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveS (Post 2153325)
And "bad tattoos" to hide the evidence.

Ha! I had forgotten that part of it.

Vegas Cards 10-14-2021 10:46 PM

Anyone that picked the Giants, your bracket is busted. Couldn't of happened to a nicer team.

BobbyStrawberry 10-14-2021 11:48 PM

Tell us how you really feel.

And it's couldn't have.

Casey2296 10-15-2021 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas Cards (Post 2154053)
Anyone that picked the Giants, your bracket is busted. Couldn't of happened to a nicer team.

Atlanta in 6

Peter_Spaeth 10-15-2021 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casey2296 (Post 2154059)
Atlanta in 6

If Kershaw was active I would agree. As it is, Dodgers in 6.

brianp-beme 10-15-2021 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowman (Post 2153290)
Move to San Diego if you do. Easiest job on TV.

Being a weatherperson in San Diego is actually not easy, as you have to be able to say the same thing over and over again and make it sound interesting.

Brian

SteveS 10-16-2021 02:55 PM

Besides having better talent, another reason the Dodgers will win the NLCS is because in their illustrious history the Braves have never had this level of singing and dancing skills (trust me, you'll get a kick out of this): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XWQ1K4SVbA8

mrreality68 10-16-2021 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveS (Post 2154543)
Besides having better talent, another reason the Dodgers will win the NLCS is because in their illustrious history the Braves have never had this level of singing and dancing skills (trust me, you'll get a kick out of this): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XWQ1K4SVbA8

My Updated prediction just like a weatherman which means nothing is

Boston vs. Dodgers with 1 of the teams winning

egri 10-16-2021 04:18 PM

As much as I'd love to see a Boston-Atlanta World Series, I think Astros in five, Dodgers in seven, with LA repeating.

egri 10-16-2021 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveS (Post 2154543)
Besides having better talent, another reason the Dodgers will win the NLCS is because in their illustrious history the Braves have never had this level of singing and dancing skills (trust me, you'll get a kick out of this): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XWQ1K4SVbA8

I was expecting the Don Rickles bit where he insults several of them. That was also funny, and well worth a watch.

mrreality68 10-16-2021 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveS (Post 2154543)
Besides having better talent, another reason the Dodgers will win the NLCS is because in their illustrious history the Braves have never had this level of singing and dancing skills (trust me, you'll get a kick out of this): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XWQ1K4SVbA8

Wow I forgot all about that video.

VERY VERY FUNNY

But it was actually done pretty dam good

Frank A 10-16-2021 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casey2296 (Post 2154059)
Atlanta in 6

I believe Atlanta will win in 6. I also believe they will win the World series in 7. Very scrapy team that does not give up. They will be the upset winner.

TUM301 10-18-2021 06:14 AM

So far like what I see from the Sox, got the hitting shoes on. 3 in a row at Fenway should be interesting to say the least. The Braves, as mentioned, are one scrappy bunch. Enjoy the games boys, Go Raffy........!


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