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I hope the scandal chases all the douchebags away. The people who smoked cigars, drank expensive wine, drank all the weird coffee because it was hip, then moved on to the next fad.
A lot of the morons who have to have the #1 rated set in the registry but couldn't tell you what team the players played for. The guys who spend $20,000 for a 1/1 of the biggest prospect, just to brag on YouTube but couldn't pick that player out of a lineup or even pronounce his name correctly. I wouldn't miss any of those assholes. |
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I still use "pack fresh" (if they are) when describing cards, especially lots. I try to provide 'guidance' as to the centering of the cards, but I don't always get into specific OCs (80/20, 70/30, etc). I usually scan a 'sampling' of the cards as an indication. I would also note if there were gum stains on x number or y% of the cards. Again, mostly for lots. Technically, they are not "mint", but I rarely go higher than NM when trying to specify a grade anyway. Individual cards get the 'high scan treatment' with a statement of grade without considering centering and noting any defects as needed. Most can tell how well the card is or isn't centered and judge on their own what the means to them. I get a lot of "exactly as" or "better than" described, which may mean I leave money on the table, but oh well. My piece of mind and not having to worry about nit picking is worth the cost. :) |
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That idea of the preservation of the card being the important part is probably the only thing we ever had in common. He did know his cards though... |
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It doesn't affect me one way or another . More power to them. Some people just have way more disposable $$$ than others to,spend. They should be able to spend it anyway they want. Not sure why it upsets you so much. John P |
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Lets say a card in a 6 is 80, and in an 8 it's 200. Someone takes a 6, trims it and gets an 8... Then sells through a popular venue where possibly some of the bids aren't legit. And that fake 8 sells for 300. Hey... that just went up 50%... maybe now the 6s should be higher. Maybe not 50% higher, lets say instead of going to 120, it only goes to 100. Well, that's not so bad if I already own one, but that pricing is still a total sham. If I don't already own one, someone just trimmed a card an potentially cost me and anyone else wanting a 6 an extra 20 Or, If I want a legit 8, and there's only say 20 of them, and nearly all have been trimmed to make fake 9s... I may not be able to buy it at all. Between two trimmers, there may be no legitimate 8s left. Like it or not, it affects us all. And PSA is leading the parade of corruption and incompetence. |
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I believe in the not to distant future that PSA’s Slabs/Opinions will be worth far less to the market then they are currently. I’ve said this for years, Registry and Pop Report are two of their biggest money making marketing tools. Both are inaccurate and total BS |
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But then the Asset Doctors come along, and, using lower-graded or ungraded cards, produce another 5 PSA 8s. Now there are 10 in the market, which makes them half as scarce. Doesn't it make sense that the price of an asset, all things being equal (same asset, same grade, same TPG) will be lower if 10 are in circulation, rather than 5? I think PSA, their numeric grading, and their registry create demand that inflates prices. But what the Doctors are doing, creating more of those higher grade cards, must have a somewhat mitigating impact, assuming the age-old concept of supply-demand is valid (and it is.) |
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I was just referring to the name calling. Calling someone a D-Bag , Moron , A-Hole because they collect high end and maybe some of their cards may be altered is out of line. Save those names for the card trimmers and thieves. JP |
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These guys are total douchebags, pure and simple. |
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Is it immoral to chase a fad, or to have less knowledge of baseball than you require? |
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John P |
Back to the subject at hand, y'all are worrying needlessly.
According to Joe, As far as the other question that you had in regards to this investigation of the auction here in our industry, I can answer it very short and sweet. We don't believe that there is anything of a material nature for our company to be concerned with. and And we think that in the overall scheme of our business that some of this has been blown way out of proportion. But we are very confident in the services that we provide and very confident in the grading staff that we have, and so is the public |
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any civil lawsuits?
Its been another several months....tons of different card owners out there that bought altered cards...yet zero lawsuits that i am aware of..
obviously people are satisfied with the card, the refund or the loss they are taking that its tough to put this in Category 5 scandal territory at least at this point. |
One quick trim to Yaz, and a $7,800 profit.
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showth...315750&page=25 Seriously... Is PSA really not in on this scam somehow? The revelations and new altered card examples are gaining steam instead of subsiding. No legitimate TPG can really be this bad. It has to be something else. :confused: Since the blind majority are submitting in greater numbers than ever (and since PSA won't even acknowledge there's an issue), it appears our only hope is with the FBI. I hope they dig very deep on this, or an end will never be in sight. People will be submitting doctored cards in greater numbers than ever. :mad: |
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How many cards are harder to find that the T206 Wagner? Hundreds? How many are worth as much? The most valuable card in the 52 Topps High number set is a double print. The demand matters more than the supply, in most cases far more. Even for cards that are truly rare in high grades, that shouldn't necessarily translate into higher prices for lower grades, which are simply commons. But that's not reality. |
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:mad::mad::mad: THAT WAS MY YAZ!! 40 1 26809377 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1965 Topps 170 Hank Aaron Card 41 1 26809378 EXCELLENT 5 1965 Topps 207 Pete Rose Card 42 1 26809379 NEAR MINT+ 7.5 1965 Topps 385 Carl Yastrzemski Card 43 1 26809380 VERY GOOD+ 3.5 1966 Topps 50 Mickey Mantle Card 43 2 26809381 VERY GOOD+ 3.5 1966 Topps 50 Mickey Mantle |
I hope the criminal at least left you positive feedback.
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Obligatory Seinfeld or Simpsons video clip: Homer and Barney's tour of the Duff Beer beer is made, focus on the assembly line quality control starting at 1:45 |
Move Along This is A Non Issue Guys
As far as the other question that you had in regards to this investigation of the auction here in our industry, I can answer it very short and sweet. We don't believe that there is anything of a material nature for our company to be concerned with. Joseph J. Orlando, Collectors Universe, Inc. - CEO, President & Director [11] and this And we think that in the overall scheme of our business that some of this has been blown way out of proportion. But we are very confident in the services that we provide and very confident in the grading staff that we have, and so is the public and this Joseph J. Wallace, Collectors Universe, Inc. - CFO & SVP [43] So I think this whole trimming issue that we spent a lot of time talking about today is really something that we don't consider material to our business. And we'd probably just like to leave it at that in terms of any additional questions on the subject. Another Big Up Yours to Collectors :-( very sad state of affairs......the fun is being sucked out of this hobby |
I choose to not do business with PSA, and I am enjoying the hobby just fine.
Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk |
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I cannot agree with this more. I had thought about taking part of the current group submission to PSA but in the end I felt I would be hypocritical for me to do such a thing as I just don't like PSA's business practices. THey are going to continue take our money without addressing any of our concerns so I will just choose to take my business elsewhere. |
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Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk |
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuBHak_S7bE that people would continue to feed an KNOWN fraud. It's really just a symptom of the human condition that people are so very stupid and trusting. Where is Bernie Madoff? I'd like to invest in his fine high paying fund. |
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Chuck It’s A Shame Very Sad!!
Most do not care about the Cards At All!!!! It’s all about making money they could care less about any of these Frauds. Until PSA slabs start bring far less money the crap won’t stop I think it’s only going to get worse. |
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The above does make sense, except for the demand side. If there are 5 or 10 in circulation doesn't matter much if there are 100 people that really want one and can afford it. The difference between 5 and 10 may make a few people decide it's too common, but unless that becomes a big difference, the demand still far exceeds supply. What I'm talking about is where that demand goes as the price increases. If 100 people can afford a card at a particular grade, and there are only 5 of them, at some point, the people who can afford it a bit less will either stop wanting the card, or will accept that they can only afford the card in a lower grade. When the difference is big enough, someone who was borderline able to afford it in one grade becomes a major force driving price at a lower grade. There are cards that I could afford when I started back in the late 70's, and back then I could have afforded a fairly nice one. Enter grading and registries and the hobby expanding (Not necessarily all bad things) And now I would have a difficult time justifying even buying one grade 1 or A. (Most major rookie cards from the 50's, and most prewar HOFers from any set. ) The high prices for the top examples drive up the price of all the others. And in some cases, the price of different cards from the same set. (T206, 52 Topps... Both are fairly common, but sell for more than cards from tougher sets from the same era. ) |
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4louSPP3iE
This video asks the question "PSA: Incompetent or Complicit?" you know what I think. How about you? |
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There may be a third option other than "Incompetent or Complicit" and that may be "Indifference". I know PSA has been aware of this problem for quite a long time (at least 10 years based on my personal experience and more likely 12 years based on a reliable source who also confronted PSA) and best to my knowledge, nothing sufficient was done to fix the problem. It's become very obvious to me they have a business model where they put minimal effort into their service, put some effort into advertising and damage control, and consequently generate a lot of money and that's the bottom line. Everyone is happy: CU, CU stockholders, the card doctors and the hopelessly addicted competitive registry junkies. The one exception is the small minority of principled collectors that know about the problem and consequently sell their PSA cards and move on into some other hobby. |
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But if we only had a way to reach and inform the “Registry Whales” of their tainted cards, it could start to turn the tide. I know that some of them wouldn’t care to know (and only see the number on the flip). But I have to believe the majority WOULD care, if they only knew. And subsequent legal action would surely ensue. Perhaps if we ever figure out how to spread the word beyond these forums, we can finally begin to make a dent in the ever-increasing levels of corruption. Nothing will change at PSA unless their revenue stream begins to weaken. But as long as they’re raking in the cash, there is no motivation for them to change a thing. Shareholders before customers! |
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Would like to see this Scandal in the IBD or American Greed |
The card price in this link is a price example of my distaste for card grading companies. The Beckett Book Value of this card is $6.00. But Dean's Cards is selling it as if it is a PSA 8, and the card is not even graded.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Topps-...ss!38863!US!-1 |
Dean's Cards has ALWAYS sold cards significantly marked up from any book value, graded or not. He has been selling cards for a couple decades. I've never heard anything shady coming from his business, except that he's stubborn with his prices, which he has the right to be, for better or worse. Hell, if he hasn't been involved in any altering scandals, his mark ups might be worth knowing he doesn't sell altered cards.
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