We know it won't happen, but would be a good system.

Jeff- Faith in the TPG's is obviously in question in general these days...BUT, I do feel strongly, in this hypothetical situation, that you need to distinguish between Authentic 'Unaltered' & Authentic 'Altered', IMO.

actually, it is Guaranty

from the Bible (internet)

"Guaranty” is the undertaking of an action where one is answerable to another for the payment of a debt by a third person. It can be undertaken for the performance of some specific duty when the other miscarries it"

TPGs are not being asked to pay the debt of a third person. Guarantee is correct.

https://www.grammar.com/guarantee_vs._guaranty

He means that guaranty is the word they use in their name. They're quite emphatic about that. But yes, the arrangement under discussion here is a guarantee.

sounds like from the others posting on the thread they dont legally owe anything.. . so again what is the recourse for this buyer of this allegedly tainted card and 60k price difference...

You're a lawyer and you're relying on what anonymous non-lawyers are saying regarding a legal agreement?

Like to see a answer from someone, you think PSA should pay 60k to this buyer? This isnt a 2k card argument example. If PSA doesnt pay him 60k does he have a cause of action. How long should he wait for PSA to review the card...3 months?

If PSA wont pay him and he doesnt live in California and doesnt want to pay a lawyer because they are too expensive he should just eat the card?

It's SGC, first of all, and second of all, he paid 80K for the card not 60. But more to the point, why are we even speculating about this when it just happened?

There were other cards that were also high dollar that didnt just happen....we can stop talking about the 1000 dollars cards and why would someone pursue legal action because the value is too law to be worth it . My point is there are enough high dollar cards out there either individual or together in someones collection that it would be well worth a lawsuit whether in california or mars (much be a city named mars) if they were not satisfied on what they were offered.

You basically said that someone with a 80k card that the bought altered would be willing to wait 3 months to get a decision from a TPG because 'what choice do they have'

no dream weaver

because basic logic dictates: they are altered, therefore they are fake

They would certainly have to wait a reasonable time before they could argue something like constructive refusal to honor the guarantee by virtue of delay.

:confused:

How about a class action lawsuit. What would you think would be found through Discovery in PSA, Beckett, SGC and PWCC's files? Probably could ask for SEC files on Collector's Universe as well?

I can't recall which thread but I've explained at length why this situation isn't conducive to class action treatment.

As for the SEC, I can't imagine even if investigative files existed which is doubtful you would get them via a subpoena in a civil lawsuit to which the SEC is not a party. Too many issues there to list.

Happily collecting beaters since the 80's.

Well, if this card was bleached, a simple test under a black light will be able to pick it up. If that's the case, the grading company (SGC) and or both are in trouble. If I was the buyer, I'd contact a lawyer and the FBI.

Whats a reasonable time? Seems like the buyer can submit the evidence of why the card was altered pretty easily and also what the card sold for and what it was bought for....3 months?

It would probably vary in my mind by card value. But in any event I would not be in any great rush, I would view litigation as a last resort in a case like this.

As opposed to some of the companies that have happily been beating collectors...

No, actually you're just happy with the result, just admit it.