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packs 07-03-2019 12:50 PM

But your example is made on the assumption that the person selling goods has access to enough goods for an indeterminable amount of time that they can afford to sell food and still have more food to eat after the sale. It also assumes the vendor has access to outside markets, which the people of Venezuela do not.

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2019 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1895238)
But your example is made on the assumption that the person selling goods has access to enough goods for an indeterminable amount of time that they can afford to sell food and still have more food to eat after the sale.

I know you're from the city, but do you know what a farm is? Seriously?

packs 07-03-2019 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 1895240)
I know you're from the city, but do you know what a farm is? Seriously?

I do, actually. That's kind of the point, your farm and your goods would become much more valuable than any piece of metal. Farms, as great as they are, also can't produce all of their goods instantaneously.

Here's a scenario that is more true to life than what I've seen put forward: I'm a merchant who sells food in a populated city in Venezuela. I sell all my food for as much gold as I can get. Now I'm hungry. Where do I go to exchange my gold for food? My customers? Other vendors like me? Won't they want to hold on to something for themselves?

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2019 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1895243)
Here's a scenario that is more true to life than what I've seen put forward: I'm a merchant who sells food in a populated city in Venezuela. I sell all my food for as much gold as I can get. Now I'm hungry. Where do I go to exchange my gold for food? My customers? Other vendors like me? Won't they want to hold on to something for themselves?

You answered your own question.

58pinson 07-03-2019 01:08 PM

I don't see any assumptions in my post except that basic human affairs and interactions will continue if they can. You seem to believe that paper (1988 Topps cards) are preferable to conduct those transactions. In normal times I have zero arguments with that position. In troubled times things can sometimes become much more stressful. What the theoretical vendor in any country would have in such times if they accepted gold/silver instead of paper in something of much more value than paper currency that has lost the confidence of the populace. You are also transposing the merchant and the farmer in your illustration.

Throughout history, and this is especially true in Asia, precious metals have been revered as stores of value not subject to the capricious wiles of corrupt and despotic central governments. If they don't interest you I fully understand. You have 99% of the US population right in your corner. I just see things a little differently. You know you had asked if there was any backup for the Germany city blocks changing hands for a few gold coins. These type of events were reported fairly commonly during the height of the Weimar hyper-inflation of the 1920's. I might mention that there are a fair number of holocaust survivors who owe their lives to being able to bribe officials with gold or diamonds and such to get out.

Anyway, off to watch Sweden/Netherlands in footy. Cheers!

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2019 01:45 PM

Here's the bottom line. Stackers are either right or they're wrong. I don't think there is any in between.

So if we're wrong, the majority can laugh at us and say, "I told you so" and I'll admit that I was wrong. In the end though, I'll still have my metals and I can exchange them for fiat currency. In other words, I didn't lose anything. There were no consequences.

But if the non-stackers (I don't know of another word to use :)) are wrong, you're up a $hit creek without a paddle if the SHTF. Here, there are potential consequences.

That said, that is not the reason I stack. People stack for various reasons. I stack because I like the long term potential for silver. It's got a number of industrial uses. I can't verify this (and I'm too lazy to look it up), but I heard they passed a new law in California that starting in 2020 all new homes have to be solar powered. There is silver in solar cell panels. That's just one of the industrial uses, I won't get into all the others. But that's the reason I stack - for investment (and don't get me wrong, I still have my 401k and some other investments too). But, at the same time, I have to look what is going on with the government and the insurmountable debt and realize that a SHTF type of event could be a reality.

Oh, and the answer to the question, "What was Manhattan purchased for?" is beads. Manhattan was purchased for some beads. :)

packs 07-03-2019 02:17 PM

Not that it matters but Manhattan wasn't purchased for beads or precious metals, it was traded for goods. It was also traded by a tribe of Native Americans who didn't actually own the land they traded.

Sometimes context is important.

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2019 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1895261)
Not that it matters but Manhattan wasn't purchased for beads or precious metals, it was traded for goods. It was also traded by a tribe of Native Americans who didn't actually own the land they traded.

Sometimes context is important.

What goods?

packs 07-03-2019 02:31 PM

Exact details have been lost to history. The beads story is just a story that got repeated enough to be taken as a general fact, like when people say “Elementary, my dear Watson,” in reference to Sherlock Holmes, who never once said that.

Mark17 07-03-2019 02:36 PM

Having some gold, silver, rhodium stacked away is a prudent diversification that helps people feel less stress when economies and fiat currencies become volatile. When everything else goes to hell (real estate, stocks, baseball cards, etc.) metals usually go up. It gives comfort to know that part of your accumulated wealth is helping, to some extent, balance the losses you are experiencing elsewhere.

My preference is gold and silver Canadian Maple Leaf 1 oz. coins. The silver coins have a $5.00 face value but considering mining and manufacturing costs, they should never get that low. Still, at least there is a floor (in case somebody snags a 1000 ton asteroid made of solid silver someday.)

As far as doomsday scenarios, I think the point is that some type of money is essential when bartering goods and services, and if the fiat (paper) money becomes undependable, the fallback is precious metals. Whether that scenario will come into play in our lifetimes who knows, but it's nice to feel at least a little bit protected.

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2019 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1895266)
Exact details have been lost to history. The beads story is just a story that got repeated enough to be taken as a general fact, like when people say “Elementary, my dear Watson,” in reference to Sherlock Holmes, who never once said that.

The beads story is what I always heard and apparently you've heard it as well. Maybe it's truth, maybe it isn't. Who knows? I can't prove it's true but, then again, you can't prove it's not.

"...Manhattan wasn't purchased for beads..."

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2019 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 1895270)
My preference is gold and silver Canadian Maple Leaf 1 oz. coins. The silver coins have a $5.00 face value but considering mining and manufacturing costs, they should never get that low. Still, at least there is a floor (in case somebody snags a 1000 ton asteroid made of solid silver someday.)

As an American, I feel like I should be buying Eagles, but it just makes much more sense to buy Maple leafs. Not only because of the face value, but the fineness as well. The American Gold Eagle is only 22 karat gold (91.6% gold and 8.4% copper), but the Canadian Maple Leaf is 24 karat gold (.9999 pure). SilverTowne has the Maple Leafs for $1470.25 and the Eagles for $1488.95. Ummm...I'll take the less expensive one with more fineness, please. :)

packs 07-03-2019 02:55 PM

I thought about it and I think I will dabble for the value. If you're right about doomsday at least I'll have some.

Mark17 07-03-2019 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 1895274)
As an American, I feel like I should be buying Eagles, but it just makes much more sense to buy Maple leafs. Not only because of the face value, but the fineness as well. The American Gold Eagle is only 22 karat gold (91.6% gold and 8.4% copper), but the Canadian Maple Leaf is 24 karat gold (.9999 pure). SilverTowne has the Maple Leafs for $1470.25 and the Eagles for $1488.95. Ummm...I'll take the less expensive one with more fineness, please. :)

All the reasons you mention, plus one:

Suppose it's 1933 scenario all over again, and the US government returns to a gold confiscation policy. Would you be feeling guilty you didn't buy American Eagles, or would you be thankful you bought Canadian Maples?

If you're holding Eagles, you might have to hide them for 50 years, but if you're holding Maples, a trip to catch a Blue jays game (and maybe a brief stop at a coin dealer's shop to sell some of your Maples) could convert your gold asset to liquid currency rather easily.

PolarBear 07-03-2019 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 1895208)
Thanks, Don. It may be a 1950. I pulled the image from eBay and the seller's description said 1960, but they may have mistyped. I'm not familiar with paper currency.

Either way, it was a rhetorical question. I knew the answer. I wanted to see who else knew and wanted to spark a conversation. Your answer is correct. It was one of the steps to a fiat currency system.

However, that's not what our forefathers intended. In fact, they were very much opposed to paper currency. Shortly before Washington's second inauguration, Congress passed the Coinage Act of 1792. They intended for our currency to be in the form of coins which were made of 90% gold and silver. The value of the coins were based on a fixed price of gold and silver. There was no fiat currency.

This worked great until the Civil War when Lincoln started issuing promissory notes to pay the union soldiers. That's was the start of the fiat currency system that we have today. However, our currency was still tied to gold and silver reserves for many years later.

So what changed to bring us into today's fiat currency system? What is our money backed by today? Why aren't coins still made of real silver and gold anymore? Who is going to pay our 23 Trillion dollar debt? Can our government just keep printing money over and over and over again and expect everything to be ok? Something has to give, right?

Whether it's a 1950 or 1960 note, y'all really need to take another look at the wording on that $20 bill and open your eyes to what it happening in the US with our fiat currency system. If you still don't know, just ask someone from Venezuela what happens when the paper currency becomes worthless.

Glad to say that my wealth lies outside of the banking system.


You should read "The Creature From Jekyll Island" if you haven't already.

vintagetoppsguy 09-04-2019 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 1889841)
...silver is only $14.82 per ounce...

As I type, silver is at $19.50 an ounce, up nearly $5 an ounce from less than 3 months ago. I'm not selling right now. Just the opposite, I'm still buying. I think we'll see $25/oz silver by the end of the year...if not much sooner.

Directly 09-04-2019 05:42 PM

Why do we buy baseball cards, some buyers pay millions for say a T206 Wagner..Lets for discussion say the economy tanks, as 1929.

Question: What might be possibly best to trade for a piece of bread--a ounce of silver or a Mantle baseball card. So just in case why not have both!

Cash may be king, did the decline of the Roman empire begin when they removed the silver from their coins, ring a bell?

vintagetoppsguy 09-04-2019 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Directly (Post 1914411)
did the decline of the Roman empire begin when they removed the silver from their coins, ring a bell?

Sure. The gradual removal of silver from their coins played a large part in their decline. Their own people didn't want their coins. Shows you how valuable and important silver really is, huh? Just like the removal of silver in US coins plays a large part in the decline of the United States.

In 1964, gas was $.30 a gallon. I could take a Kennedy half and a Roosevelt dime and buy two gallons. Today, a gallon of gas is about $2.20 here locally. However, that same Kennedy half and Roosevelt dime are worth $8.46 because of their silver content. I could sell them for that amount and buy nearly 4 gallons a of gas. Which was worth more / held their value in the long run? Fiat currency or silver? The fiat currency lost its purchasing power. The silver gained in value.

Here's my point. If I gave you the choice of a $20 bill or an ounce of silver and told you that you could do anything you want with them, which would you choose? You'd be a fool not to choose the $20 bill. But if I gave you the same choice and told you that whichever you choose that you had to hold on to for 10 years, then which would you choose? You'd be a fool not to choose the silver. It will be worth more than the $20 bill in 10 years.

Please forgive any spelling or grammatical errors. I'm typing this rather quickly from my cell phone.

Peter_Spaeth 09-04-2019 08:25 PM

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This chart suggests silver is still at nearly an all time low on an inflation adjusted basis. I guess one way to look at it is it has plenty of upside.

barrysloate 09-05-2019 08:18 AM

Gold is having a pretty good run too, hitting $1550 an ounce. But on a percentage basis, silver is doing better.

Edited to add both silver and gold are way down today, but the Dow is up over 400 points. We are finally starting to see precious metals rise and fall in inverse proportion to the Dow.

Peter_Spaeth 09-05-2019 09:24 PM

If silver was a good buy yesterday it's an even better buy today, down $1 an ounce.

Directly 09-06-2019 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 1914770)
If silver was a good buy yesterday it's an even better buy today, down $1 an ounce.

So could this be a good time to buy Jose Canseco RC, at their peek, trading around a C-note --now $1-$5 dollars--???

Peter_Spaeth 09-09-2019 07:30 PM

Back below 18 today. Strange market.

bnorth 09-09-2019 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 1915643)
Back below 18 today. Strange market.

It is going to go WAY up. Seen a commercial on TV saying it could go clear up to $100 a ounce. People trying to sell you silver wouldn't lie would they?

todeen 10-04-2019 10:30 PM

This was an interesting thread that died. I didn't really see any input by preppers, kind of shocking. Nor did there seem to be any historical explanations.

To make sense of a preppers' response, one must understand the historical understanding of currency. Over thousands of years humans have moved away from a barter based economy to a currency economy. Humans once used shells as a means of currency. Eventually, moving into minted coins - think of the Romans 2000 years ago. Although silver might seem like a worthless metal, it has defined human currency models for hundreds of years. Before the US Dollar, silver was the global currency. World exploration after Columbus was defined by silver when the most powerful global economies were based on the idea of mercantilism. England decimated the Qing dynasty (China) by robbing their coffers of silver, in exchange for opium. tsk tsk tsk. During the slave trade in the Atlantic, European economies realized they would bankrupt themselves if they purchased slaves with silver, so they turned to trading weapons and rum, among other trade goods. They took the slaves to the Americas where they were exchanged for silver, and the silver returned to Europe. Only in more modern times have individuals believed that paper currency can be backed by a country's GDP. It's an interesting concept that preppers think is based on sleight of hand.

Preppers therefore believe that if the global economy fails, or even the US economy, currency will revert to the previous system of trading in metals and trade goods. Why? Because historically, for thousands of years, people have believed that metals hold value. And gems. And things that glitter to the eye. One can't necessarily walk around with a Picasso or a Van Gogh, but one can walk around with a shiny coin in their pocket. One prepper book I read suggested a supply of junk metal, bullets, cigarettes, and some other trade goods that might be appealing to others. Obviously as has been quoted earlier, silver takes up a lot of space and is heavy. But it also can be divided much easier than gold. Can you imagine having to chip off flakes of gold? How bothersome! So junk silver, silver eagles, and silver bars would be much more beneficial in that regard.

packs 04-26-2020 02:51 PM

Anyone make any trades?

ronniehatesjazz 04-26-2020 03:57 PM

Cool thread, surprised I've never seen it before now. I've "stacked" on and off again since 2008. I'm not a prepper but I am wary of potential inflation and I think it's kind of a fun hobby. Worst investment decision I've ever made though was buying a bunch of palladium at $200/oz and selling it at $450 only to see it cross $2k years down the road.

The cool part about it IMO is the history... getting gold coins for Europe that are hundreds of years old at a slight markup to spot is a fair price and just incredibly cool. The bad part is when it goes beyond this IMO and collectors/investors fall victim to charlatans who are either projecting "Gold to $10,000 by 2025....buy my book" or slinging a "Collectors Edition Chewbaka 2 oz silver round" for only 4X spot... basically lots of people get burnt and have no clue what they're doing.

I will be buying some again in the near future but can't justify paying the spreads right now. I'll just play GLD until I get a chance.

Cliff Bowman 04-26-2020 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by todeen (Post 1921441)
This was an interesting thread that died.

So have the Net54 accounts of many of the participants in it.

rgpete 04-26-2020 04:51 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by barrysloate (Post 1892975)
David- I believe that $20 bill is dated 1950.

Interestingly, while any $20 will purchase $20 worth of goods, in the late 19th-early 20th century consumers had more faith in gold and silver certificates than they did in federal reserve notes or other forms of currency..

A different version for gold in a Federal Reserve Note

rgpete 04-26-2020 05:10 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 1889638)
All these card doctor threads really have me depressed. I think I'm going to take a break from cards right now and focus more on my other passion...stacking silver. Any other silver stackers on the board? If so, how long have you been stacking? What are you currently stacking?

I've been stacking for about 6 years, but I bought my first silver (and gold) bullion back in 2002.

I mostly stack SilverTowne bars and junk silver. But I dabble in other areas too. Lately, I've been on a junk silver kick. With 13% eBay Bucks last week, I purchased 2 rolls of Kennedy halves one day and 2 rolls of Washington quarters the following day. I got $31.62 in eBay Bucks on the halves and $31.04 on the quarters.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/FULL-DATES-...72.m2749.l2649

https://www.ebay.com/itm/FULL-DATES-...72.m2749.l2649

I probably could have purchased them cheaper at my LCS, but over $60 in eBay Bucks made it a pretty sweet deal!

So, any other stackers on here? Let's get a conversation going? Maybe we can learn from each other? Or, if you're not a stacker but have questions, just ask. I'll try and help any way I can.

1963 Kennedy Half by Daniel Carr

vintagetoppsguy 04-30-2020 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1975022)
Anyone make any trades?

Not me. Silver is very hard to find in my area right now with premiums of $5-8 an ounce (or more) when you can find it. And a lot of the online dealers are sold out or have very little stock. Even then, they're telling customers 5-6 weeks for delivery. If anyone has any for sale, let me know. I prefer junk silver, generic bullion or ASEs - nothing collectible with high premiums.

2dueces 05-05-2020 04:09 PM

2 Attachment(s)
A few ASE’s and Indian Heads in the collection but I’ve been purchasing gold at spot or above for years. Nothing major, just a coin here and there a month. It adds up over the years. My latest passion is British Sovereigns. Beautiful little coins and almost 1/4 ounce of gold. My latest.

bbcard1 05-05-2020 05:16 PM

The last couple of years, I've tried to buy an ounce of gold and a little silver. I usually like the Australian stuff...it's pretty.

vintagetoppsguy 05-21-2020 03:23 PM

Anybody able to find any silver at their LCS or elsewhere? My LCS sells it as quickly as he gets it. If you've bought some, what kind of prices are you paying? I see it for sale on eBay and generic 1 oz bars and rounds seem to be going for about $24-$28 delivered. I just can't see paying that much. Then again, I may be looking back in a few months from now and be wishing I'd picked it up at that bargain price. Who knows?

My LCS has plenty of junk silver (90% silver coins). Last week, I purchased some Peace Dollars and Mercury Dimes. I paid $18 each for the Peace Dollars so 18X FV, and I paid $1.50 each for the Mercury Dimes so 15X FV. How much is junk silver going for where you live?

I'll probably go back to my LCS this weekend and hopefully he has some bullion but, if not, I'll buy some more junk...maybe some halves.

What are your recent experiences?

Mikehealer 05-24-2020 01:33 PM

David, I would say that's a good deal on the silver dollars. From my experience
silver dollars usually sell for a little more than the ounce spot price. I had a good friend a couple of years ago selling his mom's silver coins and the local coin shop offered $17 each for the dollars, silver at the time was between $14-15.

ronniehatesjazz 05-26-2020 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikehealer (Post 1983814)
David, I would say that's a good deal on the silver dollars. From my experience
silver dollars usually sell for a little more than the ounce spot price. I had a good friend a couple of years ago selling his mom's silver coins and the local coin shop offered $17 each for the dollars, silver at the time was between $14-15.

This is correct. Typically spreads are ~$1 over spot for rounds and $2-4 for eagles (over the recent 10+ years... obviously a percentage is more useful for spot prices significantly less than or greater than they are today). Right now spreads are wild but to mitigate it you could buy at basically spot with GLD or SLV. I think there is still a lot of value in having physical bullion (just my opinion with unfortunately no insight to the future of gold and silver prices) but if it's for purely an investment a mix of one of the ETF's and physical could be a nice play (in case something happens to the ETF... delivery issues, unlikely government confiscation, etc.) as the physical will still have a spread over spot on the bid side. If it's more from a collecting aspect, I would hold off for spreads to drop or just buy a small amount at today's prices.

Mikehealer 05-30-2020 07:47 AM

I buy gold and silver that I like. The same way I buy cards. As for gold, the $10 gold Indians are easily my favorites.
I like silver dollars and halves, especially the walkers as well as old silver bars.


https://photos.imageevent.com/mhgt/w...2CB50FF2A.jpeg

vintagetoppsguy 07-03-2020 04:37 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Finally picked up some silver today from US Coin and Jewelry here in Houston. I paid $20.50/oz. I thought that was a pretty good price. It seems like the premiums are back to where they were pre-pandemic.

I picked up (10) 1oz Merrill Lynch bars and (2) 5oz SilverTowne bars.

Snapolit1 07-05-2020 02:12 PM

Granted these bars are kind of cool, but why not just plow money into a ETF or fund specializing in silver, and not have to worry bout storing bars in a shoebox in your garage and having to sell them some day?

bnorth 07-05-2020 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1 (Post 1996528)
Granted these bars are kind of cool, but why not just plow money into a ETF or fund specializing in silver, and not have to worry bout storing bars in a shoebox in your garage and having to sell them some day?

Because when the worlds economy tanks everyone will automatically know silver is worth something. I know when paper money is no longer good I would happily trade food and water for silver because it is so cool and extremely useful.

Snapolit1 07-05-2020 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 1996540)
Because when the worlds economy tanks everyone will automatically know silver is worth something. I know when paper money is no longer good I would happily trade food and water for silver because it is so cool and extremely useful.

So when the world economy tanks and pandemonium sets in, you are going to walk to the nearest Subway sandwich store (which will be open and have food) and hand a silver bar to some guy in exchange for a few 6 inch subs? Or there will be gas at the nearest place miraculously and the guy happily take a silver bar?

No, I don't get it.

The UK is in its worst economic situation in 300 years. Are there people in pubs in London paying for pints with silver bars?

bnorth 07-05-2020 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1 (Post 1996593)
So when the world economy tanks and pandemonium sets in, you are going to walk to the nearest Subway sandwich store (which will be open and have food) and hand a silver bar to some guy in exchange for a few 6 inch subs? Or there will be gas at the nearest place miraculously and the guy happily take a silver bar?

No, I don't get it.

The UK is in its worst economic situation in 300 years. Are there people in pubs in London paying for pints with silver bars?

I don't get it either. If you go to a prepper site many there can explain(LOL) why silver with be a valuable commodity if everything else fails.

For normal people I could see the coolness of having some silver bars laying around. I know a lot of people with a few of them, nowhere new investment amounts.

Mark17 07-06-2020 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 1996602)
I don't get it either. If you go to a prepper site many there can explain(LOL) why silver with be a valuable commodity if everything else fails.

For normal people I could see the coolness of having some silver bars laying around. I know a lot of people with a few of them, nowhere new investment amounts.

It's diversification. I see it as a bit of an insurance policy against having everything in digital wealth.

You need some cash of course. Rental real estate is next in my humble opinion. Then stocks. Then tangible assets like vintage cards and metals. And have a pantry full of non-perishable foods, ample supplies of soap, toothpaste, TP, and so on.

Hold some mix of these things and you're about as well fortified as you can be to head into the future.

vintagetoppsguy 07-06-2020 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 1996602)
I don't get it either. If you go to a prepper site many there can explain(LOL) why silver with be a valuable commodity if everything else fails.

For normal people I could see the coolness of having some silver bars laying around. I know a lot of people with a few of them, nowhere new investment amounts.

No matter how much silver I own, I will never look at it as if it's an investment. If one is buying silver as an investment, they are surely to be disappointed. For me, it's diversification and an insurance policy as Mark mentioned. I take a look at everything that's going on within our government where the Treasury printing presses are turning nonstop, and then I look at the massive amounts of debt and I can't help but to wonder how much longer can the house of cards continue to last before it all comes crashing down? Do you think we can really sustain that long term? What is your fiat currency backed by? A promise? Silver has intrinsic value and it's been a form of currency of over 5000 years. I don't put all my money into silver. I have my 401k and HSA that I fully fund, as well as a separate brokerage account and other smaller investments too. I don't put all my eggs in one basket. Silver (or other metals) aren't for everyone. If you don't like it, stay away from it. Don't buy it. But because you don't get it, don't knock me and anyone else for it.

White Borders 07-14-2020 03:07 AM

I'm not really a silver stacker and I'm not really into numismatics, but I did pick up a couple of Morgan dollars in an auction yesterday.

bbcard1 07-14-2020 08:18 AM

An ounce of silver costs about the same as a lot of the commons I collect and is about as much fun to look at if you get if from a country that makes cool coins.

vintagetoppsguy 07-14-2020 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Borders (Post 1998692)
I'm not really a silver stacker and I'm not really into numismatics, but I did pick up a couple of Morgan dollars in an auction yesterday.

Would love to see pics. I don't own any Morgans right now, but I do have a lot of off-condition peace dollars that I bought just for the silver content.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbcard1 (Post 1998739)
An ounce of silver costs about the same as a lot of the commons I collect and is about as much fun to look at if you get if from a country that makes cool coins.

I love looking at the artwork on some of the coins and rounds from foreign countries. I don't personally buy them because of the high premiums associated with them (I'm more about weight, not collectability), but they sure are nice to look at.

packs 07-14-2020 10:21 AM

Old coins are probably the sole source of silver that I have. I inherited a coin collection from an uncle, who inherited a large portion of it from my grandmother. I would never sell any of the pieces because of the family connection but my grandmother kept a stash of about 50 (mostly peace with some morgan) dollar coins with her for her entire life. She grew up in the depression and the fear of being left with nothing never left her. Most of the peace dollars are from the 20s and 30s but mixed in are some morgan dollars from the turn of the century. My uncle told me that while she was growing up, my grandmother's family kept them stashed under a floor board in their apartment. When she moved out of the house, her parents gave her the stash as a wedding gift.

vintagetoppsguy 07-14-2020 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1998791)
Old coins are probably the sole source of silver that I have. I inherited a coin collection from an uncle, who inherited a large portion of it from my grandmother. I would never sell any of the pieces because of the family connection but my grandmother kept a stash of about 50 (mostly peace with some morgan) dollar coins with her for her entire life. She grew up in the depression and the fear of being left with nothing never left her. Most of the peace dollars are from the 20s and 30s but mixed in are some morgan dollars from the turn of the century. My uncle told me that while she was growing up, my grandmother's family kept them stashed under a floor board in their apartment. When she moved out of the house, her parents gave her the stash as a wedding gift.

That's a very cool story. And I'm glad to hear you've hung on to them. Hopefully you can pass them down to your kids or a family member with that same story and they'll appreciate them just as much.

One thing that really bothers me is when people inherit something and their first thought is, "How much $ can I get for this?" Doesn't sentimental value mean anything anymore? If your relative wanted you to have the money, they would have sold the item and given you the money. The item meant more to them than the money and its sentimental value should have meaning to the person who's left to inherit it. Unfortunately that's not the way it works most of the time.

egri 07-14-2020 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs (Post 1998791)
Old coins are probably the sole source of silver that I have. I inherited a coin collection from an uncle, who inherited a large portion of it from my grandmother. I would never sell any of the pieces because of the family connection but my grandmother kept a stash of about 50 (mostly peace with some morgan) dollar coins with her for her entire life. She grew up in the depression and the fear of being left with nothing never left her. Most of the peace dollars are from the 20s and 30s but mixed in are some morgan dollars from the turn of the century. My uncle told me that while she was growing up, my grandmother's family kept them stashed under a floor board in their apartment. When she moved out of the house, her parents gave her the stash as a wedding gift.

My grandmother had a stash of old silver dollars that her parents kept for the same reason; when the stock market crashed and the banks failed, my great-grandparents lost just about everything. Then a few years ago, when her dementia started setting in, my grandmother tried to spend them at face value :eek:. My dad and his brothers talked her out of it.

White Borders 07-14-2020 05:32 PM

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I picked up a third Morgan dollar today. Here's the best image from the auction web site. When I tried to copy the other images, they were a bit pixelated. I have some bids on some more Morgans ending tomorrow.

Attachment 409337
Attachment 409338

(Just noticed the Morgan dollar kinda puts Leon's quarter to shame, hehe!)

White Borders 07-14-2020 06:10 PM

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From another auction company I picked up some recently minted 1oz .999 silver rounds: Pledge of Allegiance, Austrian Philharmonic, and Australian Koala. I was the under bidder on the one I really wanted, Chinese Panda.

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vintagetoppsguy 07-14-2020 06:14 PM

All nice pick ups. I really love the Koala.

White Borders 07-14-2020 06:29 PM

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My final pickup was this silver Denarius. It was more due to my interest in European history (from the time of Julius Caesar to the end of WWI). The only thing I know about the Denarius at the end of the first century is what I just read online: That it weighed 3.41 grams (0.12 oz) and was 93.5% purity.

Attachment 409346
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vintagetoppsguy 07-21-2020 10:12 AM

I ran across this deal and wanted to share it with anyone that might be interested - a 10oz bar at spot price. I'm not affiliated with the company in any way, I just thought it was a great deal. Silver is way up today, I think it's at a 6 year high (I don't have the historical chart in front of me to verify that but, if not, then it's pretty close).

https://silvergoldbull.com/10-oz-sil...x-0GBgXbw_ZHMI

White Borders 07-21-2020 06:04 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 2001138)
I ran across this deal and wanted to share it with anyone that might be interested - a 10oz bar at spot price. I'm not affiliated with the company in any way, I just thought it was a great deal. Silver is way up today, I think it's at a 6 year high (I don't have the historical chart in front of me to verify that but, if not, then it's pretty close).

Here's the 5 year silver chart

Attachment 410421

bnorth 07-22-2020 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 2001138)
I ran across this deal and wanted to share it with anyone that might be interested - a 10oz bar at spot price. I'm not affiliated with the company in any way, I just thought it was a great deal. Silver is way up today, I think it's at a 6 year high (I don't have the historical chart in front of me to verify that but, if not, then it's pretty close).

https://silvergoldbull.com/10-oz-sil...x-0GBgXbw_ZHMI

Wouldn't buying at a 6 year high be about the worst time to buy? Isn't silver like cards, buy low sell high?

vintagetoppsguy 07-22-2020 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 2001426)
Wouldn't buying at a 6 year high be about the worst time to buy? Isn't silver like cards, buy low sell high?

It depends on if one thinks it will climb even higher or not.

When I posted that yesterday, silver was twenty one dollars and some change. As I'm typing this message, it's twenty three dollars and some change. If you bought yesterday, you already made money. if you sold yesterday, you lost money.

But the bigger picture, at least for me, is that the GSR continues to get smaller and smaller. I'm going to hold off on silver right now and start focusing on gold...at least for a little while.

I believe the stock market is about to take a blood bath that will continue to last into most of next year (maybe longer). And I think you'll see it start to happen by the end of this month, maybe early next month. Here are today's markets just so we can have a point or reference.

Dow 26,840.40
Nasdaq 10,680.36
S&P 3257.30

bnorth 07-22-2020 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 2001433)
It depends on if one thinks it will climb even higher or not.

When I posted that yesterday, silver was twenty one dollars and some change. As I'm typing this message, it's twenty three dollars and some change. If you bought yesterday, you already made money. if you sold yesterday, you lost money.

But the bigger picture, at least for me, is that the GSR continues to get smaller and smaller. I'm going to hold off on silver right now and start focusing on gold...at least for a little while.

I believe the stock market is about to take a blood bath that will continue to last into most of next year (maybe longer). And I think you'll see it start to happen by the end of this month, maybe early next month. Here are today's markets just so we can have a point or reference.

Dow 26,840.40
Nasdaq 10,680.36
S&P 3257.30

I know it is easy to find silver bars/coins to buy at or around the going rate. How does one sell it to get maximum return? Is it like cards where they have to increase at least 15-20%(AH/eBay fees) just to break even. Is there any sites were people buy and sell at no fees like the BST on here?

I am not interested in doing it but would like to learn how it is done properly.

vintagetoppsguy 07-22-2020 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth (Post 2001446)
I know it is easy to find silver bars/coins to buy at or around the going rate. How does one sell it to get maximum return? Is it like cards where they have to increase at least 15-20%(AH/eBay fees) just to break even. Is there any sites were people buy and sell at no fees like the BST on here?

I am not interested in doing it but would like to learn how it is done properly.

There are a lot of websites that offer a special "at spot" price to first time customers (like the link I shared yesterday). It's usually only one per customer/address, but you could probably take advantage of it several times and just have it shipped to different friends/family member's addresses.

As far as selling, you have the usual platforms like Facebook, Craigslist, Offer Up, Nextdoor, etc. but, just like with cards (or anything else), you have to be careful about who you meet and where you meet them.

I'm definitely not a flipper and a flipper may be able to offer much better advice, but that's what I hear from the flippers I know.

rgpete 07-22-2020 04:36 PM

I bought a 5 oz Monarch precious metals Silver bar back in Feb 26 2015 at $16.56 per oz with a .89 cents spot per oz from Monarch precious metals they had a special at that time, all said and done buying on credit and postage was 95.82 as of today with that bar I have a 53% gain holding long term, today the same bar costs $146.74 with silver being at $23.14 per oz and buying on credit card. The 5 oz bar was $ 87.25 with spot included in 2015

rgpete 07-22-2020 06:20 PM

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My Dad had bought this for me back in 1973 and did not sell when the Hunt Brothers tried to corner the silver market in 1980 known as silver Thursday This is still kept in the original mail package

rgpete 07-22-2020 07:28 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by White Borders (Post 1999016)
My final pickup was this silver Denarius. It was more due to my interest in European history (from the time of Julius Caesar to the end of WWI). The only thing I know about the Denarius at the end of the first century is what I just read online: That it weighed 3.41 grams (0.12 oz) and was 93.5% purity.

Attachment 409346
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Off Topic I had found this fragment on the ground outside the remains of a 1st Century BC Roman Villa in Italy during vacation

White Borders 07-23-2020 03:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgpete (Post 2001696)
Off Topic I had found this fragment on the ground outside the remains of a 1st Century BC Roman Villa in Italy during vacation

Wow, that's cool! Thanks for sharing :)

ocjack 07-24-2020 12:58 PM

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Digging thru boxes of forgotten collectibles, came across my old coin collection books (the blue Whitman ones). But also found this. My father owned a gas station in the 60's and won this when a Gates salesmen (mystery shopper) drove in and my father suggested he needed new belts. I never took the coins out because I liked the way they were represented and of course, original packaging is always best. The years in the top row are 1923 and 1922, the center one is 1921 and the bottom row is 1921 and 1935 (left to right). It's always fun finding something you forgot you had.

vintagetoppsguy 07-24-2020 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgpete (Post 2001655)
My Dad had bought this for me back in 1973 and did not sell when the Hunt Brothers tried to corner the silver market in 1980 known as silver Thursday This is still kept in the original mail package

That is so cool. The toning on the bars makes it even cooler. Thanks for sharing.

vintagetoppsguy 07-24-2020 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ocjack (Post 2002368)
Digging thru boxes of forgotten collectibles, came across my old coin collection books (the blue Whitman ones). But also found this. My father owned a gas station in the 60's and won this when a Gates salesmen (mystery shopper) drove in and my father suggested he needed new belts. I never took the coins out because I liked the way they were represented and of course, original packaging is always best. The years in the top row are 1923 and 1922, the center one is 1921 and the bottom row is 1921 and 1935 (left to right). It's always fun finding something you forgot you had.

Cool piece and story to go with it. Thanks for sharing.

MikeGarcia 07-24-2020 07:06 PM

Great timing
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ocjack (Post 2002368)
Digging thru boxes of forgotten collectibles, came across my old coin collection books (the blue Whitman ones). But also found this. My father owned a gas station in the 60's and won this when a Gates salesmen (mystery shopper) drove in and my father suggested he needed new belts. I never took the coins out because I liked the way they were represented and of course, original packaging is always best. The years in the top row are 1923 and 1922, the center one is 1921 and the bottom row is 1921 and 1935 (left to right). It's always fun finding something you forgot you had.


..did you see the spot silver price at end of trading today ? Wowee. Yer rich. RICH , I tell ya !!

..

White Borders 07-24-2020 07:40 PM

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rgpete 07-25-2020 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ocjack (Post 2002368)
Digging thru boxes of forgotten collectibles, came across my old coin collection books (the blue Whitman ones). But also found this. My father owned a gas station in the 60's and won this when a Gates salesmen (mystery shopper) drove in and my father suggested he needed new belts. I never took the coins out because I liked the way they were represented and of course, original packaging is always best. The years in the top row are 1923 and 1922, the center one is 1921 and the bottom row is 1921 and 1935 (left to right). It's always fun finding something you forgot you had.

That is nice that you have that from your Dad

MikeGarcia 07-26-2020 09:18 AM

Timing on selling ..?
 
..
..So is this a good time to try to sell the old worn Morgan silver dollars I've been moving around my junk drawer for all these years ? Anyone know of an internet site that buys beatup coins , just for the melted-down value of the silver content. ?? there's no "CC" mintmark so there is no rare-coin vale ...I've read too many horror stories about "E-Bay" and "Craig's List"...with this virus thing , I'm not driving anywhere to have people breathe on me. Thanks for any information. ,,MG54

..

Mikehealer 07-26-2020 02:09 PM

Mike, you shouldn't have any problem selling them for the melt value, which is $17.62 each at the close on Friday. You should be able to get more than that for them, closer to the spot price for a full ounce of silver or even a dollar or two more. Unless they are in really bad shape(holes etc.). At least that's my experience, others may disagree. Now if you want to sell them for melt value let me know:)

vintagetoppsguy 08-04-2020 12:32 PM

Gold broke an all-time high today and I think it's only going to continue to climb. But I'm still buying silver exclusively. I just think it has much more potential. Silver is still at only about half of its all-time high, so I think it has a lot of room to grow. Will it get back to $50? I think so.

Silver is right at $26 as I'm typing this. Lot's of silver in the BST section recently. I think these are people that bought on the high end in 2011 and no longer care about owning it and are just trying to get their money back. That's just my $.02.

MikeGarcia 08-11-2020 07:42 AM

Spot as of yesterday ??
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikehealer (Post 2003018)
Mike, you shouldn't have any problem selling them for the melt value, which is $17.62 each at the close on Friday. You should be able to get more than that for them, closer to the spot price for a full ounce of silver or even a dollar or two more. Unless they are in really bad shape(holes etc.). At least that's my experience, others may disagree. Now if you want to sell them for melt value let me know:)


...I'm reading $29 $ today ..??
.
..

vintagetoppsguy 08-11-2020 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeGarcia (Post 2007595)
...I'm reading $29 $ today ..??
.
..

Current spot price is $27.04 as I'm typing this. Based on melt value, Morgans would be worth just under $21.00

http://coinapps.com/silver/coin/calculator/

MikeGarcia 08-11-2020 09:48 AM

E-Bay
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy (Post 2007596)
Current spot price is $27.04 as I'm typing this. Based on melt value, Morgans would be worth just under $21.00

http://coinapps.com/silver/coin/calculator/


Yeah --- the "BIN"'s for beat-ups versus those of the exact same year/mintmark with just a hint of prettiness is fun to watch , especially whilst we live in " interesting times " thank you Ginah !

..

White Borders 08-11-2020 06:05 PM

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vintagetoppsguy 08-11-2020 06:14 PM

A correction was due.

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Borders (Post 2007739)


kaddyshack 08-12-2020 08:13 AM

Mike, this is a good time to sell your junk or cull Silver coins. Take pictures and post them on Net54. A good rule of them is that $1.40 of any denomination 90% Silver coins is roughly 1 oz of Silver. I also use coinflation.com for current melt values.

vintagetoppsguy 08-20-2020 10:26 AM

How I acquire “free” gold and silver using the gold to silver ratio (GSR).

I was recently having a discussion with an investor friend of mine about how I acquire “free” gold and silver using the GSR and he asked me to describe the process. So, I did, but I also thought I would share it here for anyone that might be interested.

What is the GSR? The GSR is basically how many ounces of silver it takes to make one ounce of gold (in terms of dollars). It’s simple division: spot price of gold/spot price of silver. As I’m typing this, the spot price of gold is $1945.20 an ounce and the spot price of silver is $27.13 an ounce. So, it takes 72 ounces of silver to equal once ounce of gold (actually 71.7:1, but I’m going to use round numbers for my examples).

Gold and silver both tend to move in the same direction at the same time. If gold is up, silver will mostly like be as well. If gold is down, silver will mostly like be as well. But they don’t go up and down at the same rate. The GSR does fluctuate over time. Silver is mined at a ratio of 8:1 over gold. For every 8 ounces of silver pulled from the ground, there is only 1 ounce of gold. You’d think this ratio would be reflective in the price, right? Wrong.

The first recording of the GSR can be traced back to the Roman Empire and was set at a ratio of 12:1. It pretty much stayed the same for hundreds of years until the Coinage Act (Mint Act) of 1792 where the US government set the ratio at 15:1. The ratio fluctuated throughout the 20th century due to manipulation and FDR’s gold confiscation from US citizens (also known as the Gold Reserve Act of 1934). However, the average GSR ratio was 47:1 throughout the 20th century. In the 21st century (the last 20 years), the GSR has ranged mainly between 50:1 and 70:1. The lowest was 32:1 in 2011 and the highest was 125:1 just within the last few months.

Why am I telling you the history? It’s important to know in understanding how the process works. For my example, I am going to use the dates of March 17th, 2020 and today’s date of August 20th, 2020. On March 17th, 2020, silver closed at $12.77 an ounce and gold closed at $1537.79 an ounce. The GSR ratio on that day was 120:1. When the GSR gap is far apart like that, you want to trade your gold for silver. As the GSR narrows, you want to trade your silver back for gold. It’s a process of trading back and forth as the GSR expands and contracts. So, here’s how it works. On that day, you could have taken an ounce of gold to a coin shop or bullion dealer and traded it for 120 ounces of silver. You would hold the silver until the GSR narrows back to your favor. That is today! Remember, as I said earlier, today’s GSR is 72:1. Continuing in my example, you still have the 120 ounces of silver that you traded for back in March, but today you’re going to trade it back in for gold. So, you take 72 ounces of silver back to the coin shop or bullion dealer and trade it for 1 ounce of gold. So, now you still have the 1 ounce of gold that you originally had, but you also have an additional 48 ounces of silver left over (the 120 ounces of silver that you originally traded for minus the 72 ounces that you just traded). Or, if you wanted to trade all 120 ounces of silver, you could get approximately 1.7 ounces of gold. Either way, you’ve earned “free” metals with only a little trading.

And this is how I acquire “free” gold and silver using the GSR ratio. It’s just a process of trading back and forth when the GSR is in your favor. Nobody can time to GSR just right to maximize the best trade, but I think you can get pretty close. I actually traded some silver for gold last week when the GSR was 75:1. If I had waited a few days, I would have come out a little more ahead but, like I said, nobody can time it perfectly. Still, I’m happy with my trade. When the GSR widens, I’ll trade the gold back for silver. And that’s how it’s done.

And always remember the Golden Rule: The one with the gold…rules.


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