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-   -   NY Times covers the scandal (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=270117)

darwinbulldog 06-14-2019 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80 (Post 1889034)
Doesn't your example show rare to be a relative term? 1 card is considered rare relative to another, yet common when compared to a 3rd card rarer than them both.

Yes, in the same sense that tall is a relative term, but I wouldn't claim to be the tallest person in the world when others are objectively taller than I.

Maybe we're in agreement here. I guess my point is just that rarest is not a relative term.

Bram99 06-14-2019 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leon (Post 1888865)
I certainly prefer no politics on our forum. That said, when I was growing up I always thought the papers should just report the news and not take a political stand. I quit taking our paper, after many years, when they got all political. All that said, lets refrain from political commentary. This place has enough craziness already.

Back to the article, it is very good but it would have been nice to go a bit deeper on it. It didn't make the situation sound as bad as it really is, to me.

I am happy the article was in NYT -that’s great. But i'm disappointed that it makes the issue sound like it is a matter of taste whether a trimmed or deciliter card is graded highly. It doesn’t do justice to the fact that PSA is incompetent to find alteration.

pokerplyr80 06-14-2019 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog (Post 1889051)
Yes, in the same sense that tall is a relative term, but I wouldn't claim to be the tallest person in the world when others are objectively taller than I.

Maybe we're in agreement here. I guess my point is just that rarest is not a relative term.

Yea it was just an oversight in the article. I would assume the 25 rarest cards all have 1 or 2 copies in existence and also that I have never heard of most of them. But the comment that he just has a collection of condition rarities was an unnecessarily harsh description of what I personally believe is the finest collection I've ever seen or heard of. Even if that's not the way it was intended to read.

Bram99 06-14-2019 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 1888816)
Online today, hard copy tomorrow I am told.

You would think they could have found a better source for that comment about originality.:eek:

Gary denied everything, it seems. He was only looking for bumps.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/14/y...ype=collection

I have read it several times. So disappointing. Great job by Peter but the author totally misses the point and portrays the situation as a legitimate debate over whether restoration and alternation is ok, rather than about the intentional misrepresentation by card doctors and the incompetence of PSA and others. If this is the best of the coverage, the "scandal" will be largely a yawn. If this scandal is to become more than a tempest in the Net54 and BO teacup, then something different will have to be written, or a follow-up on arrests will have to follow.

perezfan 06-14-2019 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bram99 (Post 1889116)
I have read it several times. So disappointing. Great job by Peter but the author totally misses the point and portrays the situation as a legitimate debate over whether restoration and alternation is ok, rather than about the intentional misrepresentation by card doctors and the incompetence of PSA and others. If this is the best of the coverage, the "scandal" will be largely a yawn. If this scandal is to become more than a tempest in the Net54 and BO teacup, then something different will have to be written, or a follow-up on arrests will have to follow.

Very well said!

I wish the article included verbiage of the undeniable tampering, as documented on BO over and over again. Was there even one reference to the "before and after" photos on BO? I would think that a general audience would be interested to see examples of just how these cards were identified as altered.

Well at least it's a start. :o

toledo_mudhen 06-15-2019 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630 (Post 1888838)
NYT is complete Bird Cage Paper but I might buy one tomorrow ...

Both of my birds are Independents

frankbmd 06-15-2019 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen (Post 1889130)
Both of my birds are Independents

La Cage Aux Folles perhaps?

kateighty 06-15-2019 02:56 PM

Props to Peter! Now if only we could get that quote on a net54 t-shirt. I'd totally buy it.

Johnny630 06-16-2019 08:15 AM

To me this is article is all about the Vast Differences

Alteration/Fraud Why Because Cards Are made By a Machine not a Human!!
Art is a done by human being, restoration is acceptable if disclosed ....
That’s the point I wish people would get through their heads ....

vintagetoppsguy 06-16-2019 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630 (Post 1889418)
To me this is article is all about the Vast Differences

Alteration/Fraud Why Because Cards Are made By a Machine not a Human!!
Art is a done by human being, restoration is acceptable if disclosed ....
That’s the point I wish people would get through their heads ....

Comic books are made by a machine and alterations are acceptable.

Peter_Spaeth 06-16-2019 02:40 PM

The Times story was reprinted today in the Houston Chronicle, apparently. As well as the Sunday edition of the Times. So whatever our disagreements or disappointments with the focus, presumably more collectors will know there are issues.

https://www.pressreader.com/

Johnny630 06-16-2019 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 1889554)
The Times story was reprinted today in the Houston Chronicle, apparently. As well as the Sunday edition of the Times. So whatever our disagreements or disappointments with the focus, presumably more collectors will know there are issues.

https://www.pressreader.com/


Well done Peter

Peter_Spaeth 06-16-2019 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630 (Post 1889557)
Well done Peter

I had nothing to do with it. Again, the credit for all this belongs with the person who alerted the Times to the story and the guys doing the detective work outing altered cards. My only contribution was to take a phone call and try to explain the issues to a guy who didn't have much background.

Johnny630 06-16-2019 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 1889560)
I had nothing to do with it. Again, the credit for all this belongs with the person who alerted the Times to the story and the guys doing the detective work outing altered cards. My only contribution was to take a phone call and try to explain the issues to a guy who didn't have much background.

It would be great if this story makes it on the National Nightly News casts or the prime time big 3 cable News Stations Wednesday night before the National.

How many collectors and investors are going to continue to be ignorant to PSA’s ability to accurately grade cards ?

darwinbulldog 06-16-2019 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630 (Post 1889562)
It would be great if this story makes it on the National Nightly News casts or the prime time big 3 cable News Stations Wednesday night before the National.

How many collectors and investors are going to continue to be ignorant to PSA’s ability to accurately grade cards ?

Doesn't feel like a nightly news story. It's a long shot, but maybe 60 Minutes.

JollyElm 06-16-2019 04:55 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Originally, the movie was called "4.5"...

Attachment 356656


But then the Moser/PWCC film company got a hold of the project and used all sorts of filters and editing in post-production to turn her into something to look at...

Attachment 356657

perezfan 06-16-2019 05:32 PM

Excellent!

And I think Shallow Hal would agree. Rumor has it that he's now a grader for PSA.

(Hopefully someone here remembers that movie :o )

groundskeeper 06-21-2019 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swarmee (Post 1888911)
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showth...90614&page=110
Just keep scrolling forward or back. Hundreds of examples.

SWEET JESUS!
Hats off to the people who did the investigative work.
PWCC eneds to go.
PSA needs ...to....i don't know?
I'm done buying cards over 6!

RichardSimon 06-22-2019 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Klein (Post 1888987)
Mr. O'Keefe, as was the case with most of the Daily News staff was laid off years ago. He's out of the sports card reporting business.

Rich

Michael O Keefe is now with Newsday. I offered him information on a story about the hobby but he told me that his newspaper would not have been interested.

RichardSimon 06-22-2019 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630 (Post 1888838)
NYT is complete Bird Cage Paper but I might buy one tomorrow ...

Gee whiz, I wonder what they will now do with their 127 Pulitzer Prizes, including two this year. And I am sure more will be awarded to them.

2dueces 06-22-2019 10:24 PM

New York Slimes actually wrote a factual article?
Must be snowing hell right now.

Joe Brennan


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