Different type of hobby. Most modern collectors are into short-term flipping rather than long-term collecting.

That can't be good for long term valuations?

It's like noone wants to get stuck with the hot potato?

HFT, man.

This is exactly what it is and has been for at least 20 years for the section of collectors known as prospectors.

I really like reading posts over on BO from new to the hobby collectors that don't get the hot potato game. They actually are buying those crazily overpriced cards thinking they are a long term investment.:eek::D

Even though they are fun to laugh at it also sucks because after they lose a bunch of cash they leave the hobby.

I don't collect the new new stuff but I get the biggest smile on my face from looking through junk era cards.:)

Thanks for the comments Ben...makes sense...but that doesn't sound good for the hobby over the long haul...time will tell!

Now my reality is flipping through pages of raw cards from the 40's-present...not many last 20 years...and handling stacks of slabs of the graded stuff.

I almost like looking at the scans more than the actual cards! Maybe more a product of my vision!

Occasionally I'll find some stacks of vintage...50's-70's...I enjoy searching these unknown stacks the most!!!!

Hopefully a lot of those that get burned come back to the hobby later in life. Just like a lot of us that bought those Mark Lewis rookies back in the day.:D

Omg Ty Cob!!!! Never knew of that card. Amazing.

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The impact of young players in mlb has led to a big resurgence in new cards especially rookie autograph cards. Guys like Trout, Kershaw, Judge, Harper, Ohtani, Arenado, Bryant, Betts, Soto, Acuna and prospects like Vlad Jr, Tatis Jr are giving collectors something to chase. There is big money to be made and lost. It’s a gamble. You could have bought $1000 worth of Judge cards a couple years ago and cashed in for 50-100k or more. You could have bought $1000 worth of Greg Bird cards and have not much to show for it. And then you have basketball and football with guys like Mohames, Saquon, Curry, Lebron etc and overall it makes the new card hobby potentially very lucrative. But there is a lot of risk. Trout could get hurt tomorrow or stop hitting and you lose. He could go on to win 6 more mvps and a couple World Series and his stuff could go way higher than it is now. There isn’t much of a risk or reward in buying a Brooks Robinson Card. It will probably be worth as much in 5 years that it is today. Some people are investors - and they invest in cards. Personally, it is good to see people interested in current cards.

Not really. The buyer of this card is most likely a Jordan collector who will hold this card long term. Most modern collectors are no different from vintage, prewar or post war collectors, they just like to collect different players. Many are outside of the United States and are drawn to basketball cards and players such as Michael Jordan and LeBron James instead of Babe Ruth or Mickey Mantle.

The people who you are thinking of are not collectors, they are called prospectors. They buy rookie cards of minor league players hoping to flip them when they reach the majors or get hot for profit. It is not like they don't exist in vintage circles, just in another form. Many big REA or Heritage Auctions you see cards sell that are soon relisted on EBay or with PWCC in hopes of flipping for a profit.

It is an insanely rare Jordan card. Those aren't bubble material, IMO.

While I agree with your assessment of throwing a dart and trying to hit a bullseye with some rookie phenom, that's not at all the case with the card referenced throughout most of this thread. Jordan's legacy is right there with Ruth and Cobb.

I look at it this way; if I had an extra 500K to 750K just sitting around and looking to spend on something, if I had the choice, then instead of buying this Michael Jordan card, I would buy a nice condo on a beach in or near a smaller city in Florida.

Now, if we were talking about some pre-war cards then that would be different......

David

I knew I remembered seeing one of these a handful of years back and it going for close to 90k.


https://www.cardboardconnection.com/...michael-jordan


I checked the certs and the number on the back it is a different one and it too has the authentic grade.

I think the comments about modern prospecting are fair but this card doesn't fall into that category. For whatever reason it has been deemed to be the holy grail of Jordan inserts and for that reason it will always carry huge value. Michael Jordan has some fanatical collectors and for good reason.

This comes down to bragging rights as like most high priced cards do.

The initial bidding had tons of false bids being placed so the 500k to 700k price seems unrealistic to me but I wouldn't be surprised to see this move up some from here. Either way the current bid is higher than the sale from 2015 so if one wants to view this as a bubble, more hot air has come into the balloon.

Take it a step further....theres rookies out there like Fernando Tatis Jr fetching a thousand dollars. If I was dropping a $1000 I'd get me a decent early MANTLE.

Even Derek Jeter, and I do love Jeter----auto balls are $500? I can get a Mantle or Joe D for less.

Mantle=VALUE LOL!!!

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Hold on im running to the bank

Some people here seem to forget that Michael Jordan is not an unproven baseball prospect.

There also seems to be some conflating of “prospecting,” which is one endeavor, and simply collecting modern players you like.

There is also such a thing as collecting with no enjoyment hinging on future monetary values. It’s wrong to assume every public purchase is a mercenary investment to be judged on ROI, as opposed to simple collecting. Who’s to say what someone’s reasons are for a purchase, or what their bank acct looks like?

There are lots of different ways to play in the card hobby, and to each his own.

There are things like prospecting or busting expensive boxes (vintage or modern) that some guys love; not my cup of tea, but it doesn’t feel right to slight it or look down on it.

Maintenance costs and annual taxes will be less on the Jordan.

As DPeck mentioned, ego probably has as much to do with a lot of purchases as investment, if not more.

I agree with you, but there are 110 year old Cobb cards that are even more rare than this Jordan, and they don’t go for nearly this much. It’s a weird phenomenon. If the guy has the money, and wants to spend it on this, then God bless him. But there is no rhyme or reason to the value of cards. Supply and DEMAND is the easy answer.

The card pictured on my avatar (which I no longer own) is a 1908 Cobb with a known population of 2! It predates all of his popular cards and is an image that is unique to this card. I paid $17,000 for it at auction. So we have a combination of:
1. Legendary player
2. Extreme rarity
3. Early and unique image

And yet it sells for a small fraction of what this modern Jordan sells for. Again, I’m not going to say that one is better than the other, but in my estimation, DEMAND is the only explanation. Why there wouldn’t be more demand for aCobb like this is insane to me, and a subject for another thread. To each their own.

Yes Michael Jordan is in the pantheon. I would never question the staying power of his card or his career. What I would question is anyone hoarding Jacob DeGrom or Aaron Judge cards. Too many. Too many variations. Too much hoarding. Old cards like old comic books are a valuable thing because few people ever considered to save them, much less preserve them in excellent condition. Most modern cards are valuable because of a gimmick. I bought a Topps David Wright farewell auto card for like $199. It was a nice card. There were versions that were much more because they were blue or red or purple or some other color. People paying real money to get a different color in the background. Whatever floats your boat. Seems a little silly to me. Is one color worth more than others? Lol.

Markets are changing imo. Not a lot of kids (like we all were) are collecting. There are so many other choices for kids nowadays. My teenage son, who is a pretty good player, has zero interest in my vintage stuff. Or modern for that matter. He knows the players of yesteryear pretty well, as he is a vigorous reader of the books I read as a kid. Many of his peers do not know about George Brett. Or Walter Johnson. They don't collect cards either, and not sure they know much about the history of our sport other than Trout or recent award winners.

They all know about Ruth. A handful know about Cobb. Christy Mathewson who?

Again, most kids do not collect. There are exceptions to the rule of course, but it does make you wonder where the market will be in 20 years.

Good thing those of us who enjoy collecting such cards don’t care what Snapolit on the internet thinks.

Think of the prewar cards with less than 10 known copies you can buy for $750k.

Haven't we been hearing for years and years that kids aren't collecting any more though?

Absolutely.
If true, and it seems like it is, there may not be a market.
I'm still having fun

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My point is that kids collecting doesn't seem to be needed for a market. I am not sure about the notion that only people who collected as kids buy cards as adults.

True

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Guys, forget about the $600K or whatever it got up to in the first auction. It's currently only at $100K with four days left.

This is good to see; shows the hobby is alive and well and inclusive of more than us middle agedand old guys.

Funny that vintage collectors will rip on manufactured scarcity but have no problem with a Lajoie #106.

There is a Brady card in the same auction over 150k already. The holy grail of modern football cards apparently.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F401708753101

The Jordan bidder may already have them

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that's a terrible analogy!

Transfer that thought to T206 collecting.

Why?

the 34' goudey lajoie was created by goudey in response to an outpouring of letters from people trying to complete the set but there was no card #106. So those who wrote letters got cards.

How's that anything like a modern card company just deciding to only make a certain # of a background color...to "create" a rare card?

There are numerous vintage cards in the hobby that are manufactured scarcities and sell for big dollars: The William McKinley U.S. Caramel card is a $100,000 card . The Leaf Rocky Graziano boxing card is a mid five figures card. The Bert Cobeau card from the 1923 V145-1 hockey set is a mid five-figure card. What would a Maple Crispette Casey Stengel sell for at auction?

I don't get the outrage over manufactured rarities selling for huge money. Manufactured rarities have been a staple of the hobby nearly forever.

Goudey Lajoie, George C. Miller Andrews, Butter Cream Ruth, U.S. Caramel Lindstrom, etc. etc. were all manufactured rarity ploys by 1930s manufacturers TO SELL MORE PRODUCT.


Certified autographs, game-used inserts, high numbers, SPs, rip cards, variations, color waves, refractors, parallels are all manufactured rarity ploys by modern manufacturers TO SELL MORE PRODUCT.


There is nothing new under the sun.

I suppose its similar but different to me. Short printing a card to avoid too many contest winners plus the fact that in some cases the winners cards were not returned = rarity.

Upper deck making a few cards with a different color background to create a rarity is not the same.

Ill agree to disagree with you.

I collect some modern cards with my son and we enjoy opening packs and it is a lot of fun. The modern hobby actually spends a lot of time and effort to include players from yesteryear in their products, which I actually like and think is overall pretty good for the health of the hobby. Because of this my son has become a big Ken Griffey Jr fan just as I was when I was younger.

The modern hobby is a fun one but it is VERY expensive. Most boxes worth bothering with run $80-120 to start and most of the time the cards you get would not recoup even a small portion of that money. You end up with about 80-100 base cards, 10-15 insert cards that rarely sell for more than a few bucks, and maybe a minor hit or two (jersey cards & sticker-on-card autos are NOT popular as the thing now is limited parallel numbered versions of autographed cards... but only of the handful of super collected players). For example I purchased my son a box of 2018 Gypsy Queen at the National (probably my favorite of the modern retro-style sets up until they stopped doing the mini parallels) and we opened the packs when I got home and he was super excited when he got a pretty limited Ozzie Albies RC #ed to 50 B&W image w/Certified Autograph. Pretty exciting... until we went on ebay to see what they were "going for" and saw that even with a pretty decent hit in our box we barely would pay for the box with that card. Again, we had fun and that is why we did it but it illustrates the point to a degree.

I think this last point is my admittedly-personal problem with the modern hobby... way too much semi-worthless stuff and only a few "real" hits to be had in any given product, IF there even are hits in an entire product line. It feels more like going to the local gas station and buying some scratch-off lottery tickets.

An example of this was the last H&S Auction Lot #1198...
https://hugginsandscott.com/cgi-bin/...l?itemid=34308
I can only imagine the amount of money spent to get that many "hits" and the VAST majority of items in modern products, even the hits are problematic to sell or try to get anything out of.

I am not dogging on modern, I enjoy opening packs with my son and will continue to do so as we are both baseball fans BUT it is easy to see why some get sick of getting burned on so many modern products chasing the impossible cards that actually sell for the crazy prices we see at auction.

Well one difference is the modern manufacturer is creating scarcity to create a speculative secondary market in its product and to create the illusion it's a financially valuable commodity. Neither of which were the goals of the President of the Goudey card company. The old scarcities are rare today because they are scarce, not because someone set out to make them desirable on Ebay.

Let’s not forget Topps purposely creating a short print on 1952 topps high numbers by dumping pallets of the stuff into the ocean :D

This is well stated. Enos Goudey was attempting to get kids to spend extra pennies to try to complete a set. Topps’ primary objective is to get middle aged dudes to drop three and four figures on case breaks trying to win the lottery. There’s a huge difference.

Or, through the design of many variations, they are creating a layered and engaging collecting endeavor— for those who like to chase and assemble sets (i.e., Topps Heritage).

To try and say collecting ad backs or color runs of PreWar is somehow intrinsically superior to doing the same with modern is flat out wrong.

I collect mostly vintage, but I grab new stuff here and there. The NBA doesn't have 150 years of history. It started in the 1940's, and there were only three major sets issued before 1969. What early rare cards is the basketball collector supposed to chase once they have completed the Big 3? For a person with deep pockets, where do you go? The 1970's? Easy to complete. 1980's? If you jumped in early, those aren't that difficult either. These rare inserts are the only truly tough cards out there. The investor here is thinking that extreme rarity combined with a sure thing like Michael Jordan is this generation's T206 Wagner... except that 320,000,000 Americans know who Michael Jordan is, and probably less than 5 million know who Honus Wagner is.

Not my cup of tea, but if someone has the cash and they want to sink that kind of money into the hobby, by all means do it!

Yes but on the other hand those dudes surely have their eyes wide open?

A layered and engaging collecting endeavor? That’s rich.

Yes, modern brands are manufacturing rarity for the sole purpose of creating “a layered and engaging experience” for the collecting purists like yourself who simply value the cards with no regard to value.

Do you honestly believe that?

I’m not even saying it’s better or worse than vintage back runs it color runs. Those are your words. But let’s call it what it is. The marketing objectives of 1930s Goudey and 2019 Topps are very different.

People can collect whatever they want. Years ago I had friends loading up on limited edition Thomas Kincaid paintings. Made them happy. Today they ain't worth diddly squat. Does that make them stupid? No. If they spent their kids college money on them believing it was a good investment, does that make them smart. Uh, no.

I enjoy buying modern cards. Two or three times a year I buy a big ass box of a new release and enjoying going through them. Usually at the card store there are bunch of "kids" (i.e., guys in their 30s) ripping open boxes and flinging cards into a garbage can trying to find one or two special added relic or autograph cards. Don't strike me as "collectors" as the term is used on this board.

When I was a kid collecting Topps I never had trouble "engaging" when there were only base cards, not multiple levels of inserts, parallels, what have you.

Another difference, although this is pure speculation, is that the new rarities are more likely to depreciate in value than the old rarities. There are a zillion different Jordan cards. How meaningful will these green cards be 50 years from now? Not so many Lajoies, although the old cards could take a hit as well once the baby boomers move on.

Well you know as well as I know that the kids of today are nothing like the kids of yesterday and the day before. As a kid ripping packs open the cards had relatively no value at that time it was only the older cards that had any value. We ripped packs to try to complete the set and to collect our favorite team and players.

The lottery mentality started in the late 80s early 90s and now it has been taken to the nth degree just like the kids of today. The hobby is now a hobby for adults for the most part!

I agree 100% with this. Personally, I loved collecting when it was simpler. But in the past year I bought a couple boxes of Topps Heritage, and it was awesome. I thought the cards were beautiful. I didn’t get any “hits” though, and that wasn’t my primary motivation. But my belief is that Topps’ bullseye consumer is not me, the passive collector, but the dudes Steve describes who are breaking cases to try to hit it big. The sponsored case breaks at the National are not a celebration of set building.

There are a lot of neat and affordable products in the $40-50 range that feature several retired players. These sets usually deliver close to a set, an autograph and/or a relic card per, parallels, etc. While base set collecting is clearly dying, I've seen an uptick in player collecting, prospecting, insert set collecting, etc. There are several new ways to collect and that's awesome. I'm also witnessing a lot of diversity in these collectors. Several are STARTING as late teenagers and young professionals. I've personally witnessed an uptick in female buyers and people of color. These folks have an appreciation for the past and could definitely dabble in vintage in the future.

And that's my point. I don't think with due respect to Matt that the point of all the million inserts and parallels is to make collecting more interesting, it's about artificially creating and chasing value. Collecting was plenty interesting with your 598 or whatever card base set.

How many television channels did you have? How about video games? The internet?
Sure, Topps produces way too many different sets (actually they have to in their contract with the MLB), but your childhood was a lot different than the kids growing up today. One set of 600 cards is boring, and a sure way to kill off the collecting vibe.
But they do make sets like Opening Day for just this reason; inexpensive ways for kids to collect. In the past year, I've donated 10,000 cards (sports/nonsports) from the 80s to 2018 to my wife's school kids, and they're thrilled with them. They're from a rural area and probably can't afford them, and it's a good way for me to clean out the clutter from the one or two collections I buy a year.

Sometimes less is more. As for TV, more channels meaning more and more time spent in front of it (and of course the omnipresent devices) is not in my opinion a good thing at all. Kids growing up today are way too tech dependent for the most part. Every day I see groups of them but instead of engaging with each other each and every one of them is staring into their device. It's absurd.

Before we romantacise Mr Goudey, didn't he intentionally omit a card from his set to get kids to keep buying packs?

Also, while there are an abundance of Jordan base cards, there are a few rare ones that not many people know about.
That's why this hobby is so great. Something for everyone.

What’s “rich” is your post claiming a “huge difference,” when all you did was highlight a similarity: companies trying to make cards that will sell. And your beloved Mr. Goudey targeting kids’ 1930’s pennies is somehow supposed to put the cards you like on some pedestal? Your alleged target audience for the two is different, yet the underlying motivation is by your own words a similarity. That said, the children I know who enjoy opening packs would seem to explode your exclusive middle aged men theory. There can be more than one target audience. You even admitted you opened Heritage in just the manner I am referencing.

Your posts above are both presumptuous and reductive; Topps certainly knows that while indeed there are buyers out there looking for an eBay flip, there are also collectors of all ages who do enjoy hunting for myriad variations— knowing full well that the Heritage Throwback semi-star they pulled yet desired for their set won’t be worth a dime down the line. Point being that it is highly presumptuous to claim you know why everyone is buying (for a “Lotto” ticket). The set design in that respect is layered and designed to engage the collector beyond the base cards; much in the same way some video games are layered to engage the player in multiple tasks, for example.

What is the endgame here? You want everyone to collect Gehringer or mid grade t206’s or whatever you collect? Sorry, but people are going to have different tastes no matter how hard some try and slight what they like. And — gasp— some of us will take home an e90-1 Shoeless and a Bryce Harper or Kershaw.

Last time I checked, all the cards in the hobby weren’t pitted against each other in some absurd battle; the collectors of them shouldn’t be either.

Endgame?

I don’t have one. I don’t give two sh*ts what other people collect. In fact, I would MUCH rather the big money go into modern than vintage. I’d rather not compete with the well-heeled fellow who has $600k to spend on a Purple Raspberry Platinum Refractor Jordan.

My argument is that the comparison between the manufactured scarcity of Goudey and 2019 Topps has different underlying drivers. Yes, both efforts are about selling more cards, but one was about driving kids to try complete a set (in vein); the other is about selling the promise of an instantly valuable “hit.” I’m saying this based on factual observations without assigning any value judgement. I’m not criticizing Topps or their consumers.

And yet your precious sensibilities are still offended.

We get it, Matty. You love your Aaron Judges and Gregg Jeffries just as much as your mid-grade centered Mantles. The purity of collecting is heavenly. It warms the heart. You feel like you must be the holy defender of all things modern.

But if you believe that Topps’ manufactured scarcity is only driven by a desire to make set collecting more “layered” and “fun,” you’re believing in a fiction on par with a Rambo sequel.

From Peck & Snyder to Old Judge to ATC to Goudey and Topps/Bowman the common denominator is marketing and money.. Otherwise, why bother? Modern is growing and pre-war is shrinking. Collectors should be hoping that the modern hobby continues to surge.

i am mostly a vintage collector, but I still don't get the stance on here that vintage manufactured rarities were somehow pure and good and honest, while the same thing in the modern hobby is horrible.

Modern collectors know what the deal is in that the chances are extremely slim of hitting a big money chase card. Collectors 80-90 years ago did not realize they were getting scammed into continually buying product in a near futile attempt to complete the set.

Absolutely correct. The 1933 Goudey set is a prime example of a gum manufacturer scamming their customers. At least modern companies give odds!

Oh I agree with you. I think what Goudey did was downright deceitful. At least Topps has the odds of finding hits on their box, much like the odds you see when playing McDonald’s Monopoly or a scratch-off.

The problem with this site is some folks try to make statements and other dudes read into them and assign value judgements to them. I don’t remember anyone arguing that one was good and honest and one was horrible. My personal argument was that they were motivated by different underlying dynamics, and therefore, not directly comparable.

Yeah who said anything favorable about short prints or skip numbering? Different -- not trying to create value -- not superior.

But I still don't see why intentionally making a few green copies of a card makes it so desirable.

As someone who works full-time in the hobby and has collected everything, I've noticed a sense of arrogance among some vintage collectors who often mock and demean the modern side of the hobby. It's particularly troublesome because most "shiny card" collectors are very respectful of vintage. Fortunately, I'm seeing less of this arrogance as the years go on.

Only because NY state forced them to by declaring a card pack to be a lottery.

And many get around the "odds" by having it be the overall odds, or just saying the odds of the non- numbered cards.

No need, That card gave me enough retinal damage that blinders won't help :D



I collect some modern, opening some packs now and then is fun.
I bought some Fleer metal when they came out, but only a few packs, as I thought the cards were just hideously ugly. And I really like a lot of hideously ugly cards....Metal just seemed too ugly to bother with.

You're right. MUCH better to SCAM kids out of their money seeking a card that fraudulently didn't exist than to sell to adults who know full well their odds.

I’ve watched kids in card shops and card shows rip open a pack, flip through the cards, and throw away the entire contents of the pack just because there was no autographed, diamond encrusted, jersey card with MLB logo on it. It appears to me that these hidden inserts have become the entire hobby, and base cards are just pack-filler. I think this difference alone is enough to put the Goudey comparison to rest. One sleezy gum company completely left a card out of a set 85 years ago. No one here is saying that’s ok, but I don’t see how it relates to the current state of modern cards. Those kids bought more packs in efforts to complete their sets, not in search of a 1/1 card that they hoped would pay for college. At worse, they ended up with a duplicate and a fresh piece of gum. The motivations of the collectors were far different, irrespective of the motivation of the card company, which is always money.

I think this Jordan card is particularly annoying to the vintage collector because there doesn’t seem to be anything really special about the card other than rarity. It’s not a rookie, or even an early Jordan card. It’s not from an all-time set. It’s not autographed. It’s not some spectacular image. It’s just a card that a company printed 10 of. That’s it. You can’t blame a collector for imagining all of the amazing cards they could buy with that money, and being stunned that someone would spend it on this rare, if unspectacular Jordan card. I’m sure that vintage guys grumble when an LBJ rookie sells for crazy money, but they will usually conceed that a 1/1 LBJ rookie is a special card. This Jordan just leaves some heads scratching.

Out of 50 or so years worth of pre war cards, are we really going to focus on, and cherry-pick one shitty scam by one gum company and use it as justification for what’s going on with modern cards? Goudey was in the business of selling GUM. Kids bought packs of GUM and got the gum. They were not defrauded. Again, it was a shitty thing to do, but the kids got what they paid for. This comparison really needs to die.

Or 1933 George C. Miller Andrews or 1933 Butter Cream Ruth or 1923 Maple Crispette Stengel or 1932 U.S. Caramel Lindstrom or 1948 Leaf Boxing Graziano, etc. etc.

The point is that the "manufactured scarcity" hand-wringing bandied about by so many vintage only collectors is a SIGNIFICANT part of hobby history, regardless of the contents of the final product.

The Brady I mentioned is at 190k with 7 days left. Am I the only one who had no idea this was such a valuable card?

Yes, rarely does a fraudster invent the wheel. You give great examples of times when a company may have manufactured scarcity on a particular card. This was often done so kids would have a tough time completing a set. But the problem is that the ENTIRE HOBBY now revolves around the manufactured rarity. The only real valuable cards are the ones that are intentionally rare. You cite the 32 caramel Lindstrom, but I would prefer the “base” Ruth.

I don't even disagree with your point about the modern hobby relying so heavily on manufactured scarcities as much as I disagree with what seems to be some posters looking down on what other people choose to collect.

I have written on here before that T206 Cobb cards or a 52T Mantle don't excite me at all because they can be purchased any day of the week on eBay, in various grades. But I understand why people choose to collect those cards. Some of the stuff that excites me might only be a $300 card, but only shows up once every 10 years or once in a lifetime. The Amelia Earhart card I use for my avatar right now was only a $300 card, but I love it because I have only ever seen one other Heinz Aviators Earhart at auction or for sale.

I love seeing some of the obscure cards Peter Spaeth posts on here that I have never seen before. I guess what I am really trying to say is that there is no wrong way to collect.

The whole point was vintage collectors, in this very thread, mocking the desirability of cards with manufactured scarcity. I was simply pointing out that the practice is not new, not uncommon but, hey, it was OK when it was done 80 years ago because reasons.

You aren’t wrong. Guys are vocal when it comes to bashing newer cards, but won’t bash other vintage collectors who collect stuff that they silently think is crap. Interesting phenomenon. Collect what you love. I think debate is fun though, and it drives this board.

I'm not sure the Brady you're referring to but yeah anything Brady from the year 2000, that's shiny is worth an a$$load of money.


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Idk. PMG green has turned out to be a Holy Grail set. It sometimes works that way in cards.

More crazy to me is $1000 for a Vlad Jr auto card . Could be in a semi star/common box like his dad in 5 yrs!!!


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I’d like to find that common box. Vlad sr didn’t have a major league rookie auto but his rookie Refractor rarely sells under $300.

Umm the modern bubble has popped more times than one can count. Honestly what the heck are you talking about?
On a side note, Let people collect or invest or whatever they want to call it, in what they want to buy. Worry about your collection and how you spend your money. For the record this price seems crazy to me but Jordan is popular world wide and there is a lot of foreign money (japan & China primarily)coming into the basketball card market. We can think it’s nits all we want but t looks to be a developing market wether we think it should be vintage only that goes for those types of prices or not.