Re: Just Another 1952 Mantle PSA 9
 

+1 here as well.

+1 making the popcorn and set my reminder for the auction to watch...

Hey, Honus. How do you feel about all this fuss over a Post-War Double-Printed Non-Rookie Card?

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Put it next to the jumbo Wagner or a similar grade and I will take the Wagner, no doubt. Same for Baltimore News Ruth PSA 4.

Good Luck!
 

Evan-it's a beautiful card and I hope it crushes the estimates. Thanks for showing it to me at last year's national.

Honestly though, when I saw first saw this Mantle in the picture, I felt like I was sinning.

As much as I would like to simply say I'd take a nice Wagner --- I honestly think I would take this Mantle if such a choice was miraculously offered to me. There is just something about the Mantle, even though I don't collect any Topps series at all, or care for the Yankees in the slightest.

I think I know what it is though - I grew up in the Beckett era, and would spend hours looking at, and dreaming about "XRC!", the italicized names, the emboldened prices that were seemingly infinitely higher than any other card in the price guide - and just a tad bit higher than my EX-MT 1990 Score Sammy Sosa that I had in my special "Cases Box". It was the 1952 Mantle and the 1984-85 Star Michael Jordan that held that lore for me. So, even though I now collect T206 and other Pre-War Cubs - it still isn't enough to overcome the overall nostalgia of scouring over every new Beckett price guide to see the unattainable cards from years that not even my dad experienced. Combine that with stories from my grandpa about Mantle, Williams, and there you have it: nostalgia bias.

Would you feel the same way if it was raw and you weren't influenced by the flip?

I'd take that Mantle raw over a Wagner. I'm influenced by its beauty and because I love the card, the player, and the team. And as a collector of that card I can appreciate how rare that specimen's overall beauty is. Just as I am not influenced by the Wagner's value, because in my collecting journey I've never really felt pulled to own the Wagner. I appreciate its significance, yet no matter how hard I try sometimes, I just don't have a strong connection to it.

Bottom line, to each his own.

I was born in '76 and feel the same way. Nostalgia is a powerful force in collecting cards and everyone's life gives them nostalgic connections to different cards.

How many 9s and above are there? How many Wagner’s are there?

So for you, it appears that overall rarity vs condition is most important. I can totally relate as a photo Collector. The Mantle sure is pretty though. By far, the most ICONIC/recognizable baseball card(Americana) and MINT.

I had a Mantle once, just a PSA 1, so I could say I owned one. And that was kind of fun, but it's not a card that I ever would have cared much about except for other people's opinions. I like owning rookie cards of the top players, I like owning rare cards, and I like owning cards I find aesthetically pleasing. But the '52 Topps Mantle isn't any of those, and neither is the T206 Wagner. I'd be happy to own either one of course, but I'd rather have the money.

I'll take them all, they're all great cards. How do you know any of them are not altered? If you're going to throw around words like that on the most valuable thing I own I'm afraid I'm triggered and will have to request that you identify yourself in your posts per forum rules.

Beautiful card!

Good luck. I hope you get more than you are hoping to get.

Absolutely, it's a beautiful card. As a collector I would just rather have a Wagner; or a NM Mantle and the millions in difference between a 7 and a 9 to spend on something else if I had to make a choice.

I don't think that the flip has anything to do with this example. The card is incredible with elite centering, registration, color, and corners. It is potentially the best 52T Mantle in the hobby.

A collector may prefer other cards from different eras but that is their choice. To each their own. Differing opinions are what makes the hobby interesting.

Perhaps, but put it in an 8.5 holder or another TPG holder and its market value goes down exponentially. And you can't judge the corners from the scans that have been provided, IMO.

Good points. I meant that you are not trying to convince yourself that this card belongs in the holder. No question from my stand point.

It probably does belong, no reason to think it doesn't, I'm just making the obvious point that the flip for better or worse is a big part of the perceived value.

Depending on how you look at it, it lasted till 1974..

https://www.cnn.com/2014/01/17/world...ies/index.html

He and I had several PMs as soon as I saw his post which was right after he did it (I believe). That was the impetus for the other thread I started too. He has edited out his response to be much more generic. He was asked to edit it out, or put his full name out here, so I can't really mandate that now that it is edited. However, if whomever wants to know someones name and they had a comment directed their way, I will usually tell them with the condition they don't make the name public. That would defeat the purpose of the option to the member in the first place. I explained the litmus test too. :) It was over on this one.

I see someone edited their post but like their original, I too, when I think of "The Wagner", think of it as being trimmed.

Maybe I am being biased as I love 52's and own a Mantle, but that card screams nostalgia to me.

If I had the money where 4 million wasn't necessarily a big deal to me, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase that one!

I am one of those weird guys, even if I had the $ I would be just as happy with the 52 Mantle Dale owns as the PSA9. I am very happy that condition means very little to me.

Really, really good decision!

Enjoy the house on the lake with the pasture and barn,

Larry

Evan, this is truly one of the most stunning cards in our hobby. "An exciting card" is really an understatement. Our lads here have a tendency to talk smack at the most inappropriate moments. I wish you the very best, sir, on this enormous consignment. It must be a tough one to part with, but the time must come for any of us to .....

Have a great day. ----Brian Powell

whats the deal with the other mantle to the right????

Meh, that's probably like a PSA 7.5 or something. Not worth your time.

52 Mantle
 

interesting topic in the PRE WWII section. Should we move it

If I hadn't just banned you I would now.

Ralph, check out Steve's link in Post #100 in this thread. :D

Ralph seems to have confused this place with some place that puts up with a lot of crap.

Anybody else notice that the end of the description has a list of currencies one can use to pay for this beauty, including Bitcoin?

"BTC, ETH, XRP, BCH, LTC, NEO, DASH, IOTA, & EOS."

I can't even identify another one without Googling it...

Might be kinda fun to take your $4 million payment in Bitcoins and check back in a few years to see if you've become a billionaire or a cautionary tale.

If there are PSA 10s and that one is a "just" a 9 -- what could possibly be the difference.
I love to (in person) see them side by side and hear someone with "insight" explain the difference to me.

It is such an iconic card.... I've always "liked" his 53 Bowman more aesthetically. As a collector my tastes (like most people here) run towards older and, perhaps, less "perfect" cards that were lucky to have survived at least one World War....

I think if you sit on 4m in btc, eth or ltc even until the end of this year you'll be pleased with the results. Right now is a good time to get in if you've been sitting on the fence.

Preview up
 

Go Evan!! Bitcoin is the safe bet according to a lot of people. I am not quite there yet. And a 3.5M estimate. I hope it goes for much more.

This occurred to me last night--I certainly wouldn't trade my 1907 Fielding Pose Cobb or 1907 Wolverine News Cobb, nor my 1939 V351 Ted Williams for it. Might be too tough to replace those. Wander what Orly would say about his magnificant Cobb collection vs this card? Of course, that's just me and my preference for really rare, period, rather than a condition rarity, where thousands of other lesser examples of the card exist. But good luck to Evan--hope it does really, really well! Sometimes it is time to cash in!

May collecting bring you happiness, in any shape or form,

Larry

Why is it, "vs." ?

A gorgeous card is simply for sale. It is not playing a baseball game or MMA match against any other card or cards.

Why is it not? A question of collecting priorities always factors into a decision to buy one card over another, to keep one card over another, and into determining the large picture goals of your collecting. Unless, that is, a collector simply buys cards at random, and I don't think there are many of those in our hobby. So certainly my last post posed an interesting philosophic question within the collecting context.

Regards,

Larry

Is it always "or?"
Is it never "and?"

-- Stephen Sondheim, Into the Woods

What’s the meaning is, or what the meaning of or is.

That is the question.

Let the bidding begin.

Current bid:
$875,000
w/ Buyer's Premium (BP) : $1,050,000.00

Maybe 'can't remember the guy's name' can trade his Mark McGuire 70th Homerun Ball for it? :eek:

Some really serious thinking going on....NOT! :rolleyes:

Todd McFarlane?

Wow, at $1.4 million with 27 days to go. Here are the pics of the card.

I am looking for a PSA10. PSA9 is not good enough.

Sounds like the 10 doesn’t look as good as this 9. Incredible centering on this one.

I mean, that card is absolutely amazing, which goes without saying, but I will anyways, LOL.

Perfect centering throughout, vibrate coloring, just the perfect card.

I hope to one day have the discretionary income to purchase such a card.

And to the seller, I hope it brings in all the money you hope for.

An interesting article, full of errors as usual, at least one apparently from the Heritage director of sports auctions --- Really, rookie card?! And he runs the sports dept.... https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...card/33238039/

Has to be fun to make over a million bucks on a card purchase.

oh for pete's sake! ;)

Just a spectacular card.

Hard to imagine the 10s are better.

Best of luck with the sale, Evan.

Now at 2.16 million with buyers premium.

Interesting thing about this auction lot to me is that they accept cryptocurrency like bitcoin as payment. I had not seen that before from an auction house.

Bitcoin fluctuates wildly even within a single day.

A lot of people made tons of money last year in crypto. It makes sense that on a card of this caliber the consigned would request that the AH accept it as payment. I don't believe any auction house normally does as a policy, but wouldn't be surprised to see it added in the near future.

So the seller is swapping investments-card for crypto?? I would be doing the opposite. It had to have been a take-it-or-leave-it condition for Heritage to accept those terms. Unprecedented. Seller must have signed a contract to agree to cough up seller's premium in USD as a reimbursement. Since crypto is peer-to-peer this is the only way it could work. Buyer pays seller direct, no middleman. If it's a state with HA sales tax collected this is going to be even more complicated. How in the heck would HA deal with the buyer premium though? I bet HA is praying they get a buyer who pays USD.

What a great card, I also saw it at the National and it's really stunning.

I'd be more interested in - why Heritage?

Maybe Evan can't really discuss that, or wouldn't necessarily want to, which I would get.

But if he could/would, I wouldn't mind hearing how that decision was made. Why not PWCC or someone else via eBay (I remember all the special attention when the Superman comic was auctioned via eBay). Maybe Memory Lane? I might be leaving one or two other options out, but it's certainly a short list of 4-5 choices.

I don't imagine it was just as simple as say lowest sellers premium, because each of these auction houses also have different rules. I couldn't bid on this, but Heritage is always a bummer for me in Texas because I get hit with the sales tax - as a result I rarely end up winning auctions there but I'm 2nd/3rd quite often.

Anyway, just wondering.

If the winning bidder pays in crypto, they'll send me the crypto, and I'll pay HA their commission in USD. Crypto is very liquid even though it's volatile so I'm not trying to do a straight up swap. I have enough exposure in that space already. I'll convert most of the proceeds to USD, pay HA, pay for my house, and go on a card shopping spree.

These are good questions, there are a few factors that led to me choosing Heritage.
1. I ultimately decided to sell the card to buy family our dream home and HA had no problem advancing me the money to do so.
2. I thought that Heritage would be the best at getting the exposure the card deserves. I use PWCC and Probstein for the vast majority of my sales but I didn't want to roll the dice in such a limited time frame of 10 days. I do recall the Action Comics #1 CGC 9.0 you're referring to that was auctioned on eBay so the idea of PWCC or someone else on eBay is not asinine.
3. I had a nice discussion with Chris Ivy at HA and proposed the crytpocurrency idea which could open the door to a few more bidders. Him being receptive to that helped my decision.
4. And lastly, as this card is auctioning, I'm like a kid in a candy store bidding in their auction.

I did consider other auction houses like Goldin since they've done some impressive numbers on elite items. In the end, my gut was to go to HA and let it fly no reserve. Whatever happens, this is a really fun experience.

Heritage will get top dollar on this one, no need for concern.

No doubt. They have become the dominant auction house IMO, with an astonishing selection each major auction. I still think they should tone down those way overbright scans, but why would they listen to me lol.

There really is nothing like getting catalogs for Heritage and REA. The stuff they continually get is phenomenal. Best of luck Evan. Mantle is really cranking! And congrats on the dream house.

USA Today article on the sale:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...card/33238039/

I give the guy credit for selling the most important public offering since the Gretzky Wagner.

Received my Intelligent Collector magazine from HA and it also feature this PSA9 Mantle.. However, why did they put the card in the middle of two pages and image got crop off/bind together and completely ruin the image of this beauty???

What were they thinking??? I could only see 2/3 of the card technically.

(Sorry, not sure how to post pic from my phone to this board)

Im sure Courtney is going to try to snipe the card at the very end..

I’d like to be a fly in the wall as you do that.

Thanks for being so accessible with answers to all the questions. It’s interesting to peek behind the curtain, so to speak.




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I'm sure this appears somewhere on the Board, but could someone please advise of the top 5 sales of cards in order of price, whether by auction or private sale?

Thanks.

Best of luck to you and your family Evan.


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Just as a comparison, one of the Gem Mint cards has a slight tilt in the centering and does not compare to the one currently at auction.

i thought a 10 was supposed to be as perfect as a card can be?

According to PSA there is room for imperfection.

A 9 and a 10 are the same card but with different labels.

ya...i know...it's just sad and a joke and it pisses me off...that's all!

Evan's 9 over that tilted 10, all day.

I didn't read the whole thread and maybe this has been discussed. This Mantle is the variation that has the white fleck in the blue background on the upper left. This particular Mantle also has a fleck above the cap. These faults aside, this is obviously a great card and will break all records at auction. However, these printing defects keep it, as well as the PSA 10 pictured in this thread, out of the "flawless" mint category for me. I'm not trying to rain on anybody's parade. I'm just stating obvious concerns when dealing with graded cards and huge money.

I can tell you the two highest sales prices. The Wagner PSA 5 (known as the Jumbo Wagner) sold two years ago for approximately $3.1 million. Prior to that the Gretzky Wagner (PSA 8 or PSA Authentic, take your pick) sold for approximately $2.8 million in a private sale. The buyer is the owner of the Arizona Diamondbacks.

This Mantle appears likely to exceed both of these sales prices.

Nice card--tulipmania