I don't know what the argument is. My only point which I stand by is that the public perception of Yaz is a little inflated, due to his popularity. Nobody here is saying he wasn't a worthy HOFer or a great player. You could make the argument that relative to his card values Mantle is overrated, and I would, but that doesn't mean I don't think Mantle wasn't great.

No I agree with you. I was responding to the gentleman earlier who questioned whether Yaz should be in the HOF bc of playoff stats and playing for Boston. That's when you started posting the splits, etc. I must have mistakenly assumed that you were siding with him.

Peter

Brock was already a 4-year established ballplayer (with the Cubs) when he was traded to the Cards. Furthermore, he did not directly step into Musial's "footprints". Musial
played his last game in Sept 1963. Brock was traded to the Cards in the Summer of '64.

Both Mantle and Yaz were 20 year old rookies when they replaced DiMag and Ted W, respectively. And, they directly stepped into the "footprints" of these two great legends.

Think about it, there is significant psychological factor in play here, which is not case in Brock's situation.


TED Z
.

Ted, good points. To be precise Mantle did play one season with Joe D. whereas Yaz simply filled Ted's position the following year. But with the Yankees expected to win the pressure on Mantle was probably greater.

Peter

I recall the Spring of 1952 quite well, Mickey had a slow start (perhaps as you said...."the pressure"). At the beginning, the fans were booing him when he struck out.

As the season progressed, the boos turned into to cheers. Mantle finished 1952....batting .311 with 23 HR's and 87 RBI's. Some of those HR's travelled near 500 feet.

And, the rest is history.


TED Z
.

I remember as a kid when Bobby Murcer was supposed to take over for Mantle. He had a decent career, but it didn't quite work out that way.

From NYT 12-28-52

http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/...psea335b74.jpg
http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/...ps7b1a602a.jpg

Mickey is going to have to ask for a big raise if he ever wants to afford one of his rookie cards.

Ironic, his most sought after card is a 1952 Topps # 311, or was that done intentionally by Topps?

Irv

The # 311 on this card has always amazed me, too. However, it is only by sheer coincidence.

The card was produced before the 1952 season ended. This I can attest to, since I remember
opening a TOPPS 5-cent wax-pack in Sept 1952 and getting this Mickey Mantle......


http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/d...mmantle52t.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...wrapper100.jpg




TED Z
.

Great story, Ted. :)

It was my Father's 77th birthday yesterday and our family all gathered to celebrate it.

Dad and I got talking about the 52 Topps cards he gave me but can't specifically remember buying them?
He collected comic books and coins back then and assumes he purchased them but the more we talked the more he guessed/got confused that maybe someone else gave them to him?

He said he did remember receiving his BeeHive hockey cards that were given to him so he thinks, again, that maybe he did purchase those 52 Topps cards for some reason?

Judging by last night, I don't think the mystery will ever be solved?

Needless to say, I am glad he held onto them for all these years! :D

P.S. Forgot to add. Your card has a similar looking crease/mark to the left of Mickeys face as what mine does, and our 2 aren't the only ones I have seen like that?:confused:

Irv

Talk about coincidences....your Mantle and mine have very similar "creases".

Actually, on my card it's not a crease, it's a "surface wrinkle" or a scratch (as, it does not appear on the back of the card).

And, a Happy Birthday to your Dad.


TED Z
.

I Agree Peter, maybe even lower for me. This guy hit .260 on the road for his career! Yes, a ton of All-Star appearances, but these are voted on by the fans. This gets me back to the Boston/ Fenway mystique supporting his popularity....Everybody loved Yaz and Fisk....

I'll have to have another closer look in hand at mine but IIRC, I don't believe mine has any creases/marks/anomalies on the back either?

And thank you for the birthday wishes! :D

It just seems wrong that his rookie card in pristine condition is worth more than mickey made in his whole career!

Players salaries weren't exorbitant yet. Now they are kind of out of whack, imo.....Maybe they should cap contracts at like 100M or something to keep ticket prices down and make going to a game affordable again?....

Yaz rookies are not that scarce....

Yeah, except that it would effect ticket prices a bit. The owners know the point at which they can price tickets to maximize profits. All that would happen is that ownership would make more money.