You know, I collect raw and I am always trying to amass reasons not to slab and the sheer weight never dawned on me. Let's say a collector has 25000 raw cards and 25000 slabs. The raw cards would be a pain to move..The 25000 slabs would be painful to move.:D

25000 slabs would weigh about 1500 pounds. No, seriously...1500 pounds. That's enough weight to possibly require extra structural support to whatever room they reside in.

I don't know if anything fishy going on with PSA submission (it certainly looks suspicious), but deleting threads and banning folks who wish to discuss the issue speak volumes negatively about the company in my view.

I concur with others in expressing appreciation of Leon and other moderators who allow free discussion of controversial subjects, including at times this Board.

This is the thing that drives me nuts about this situation. JO (or one of his minions/employees) should have addressed this publicly as soon as P_P's sub was publicly exposed. Deleting and banning doesn't quell thoughts of conspiracy/cover-up... it pours gallons of kerosene on an already raging fire.

The other thing that has always galled me is the fact that nobody there knows who the moderating team is. It was weeks to months after the fact that everyone became aware the Carol was gone. Now there's a Jackie, but she's got PMs blocked. So if we have a question, who exactly are we supposed to go to? Call JO? Sure, that'll work. The moderating team needs to be public and interactive. I've been on probably a couple dozen message boards over my years on the interwebs, and I've always known who was in charge.

My guess is "Mum's the word" on that topic.

Specific to this option, it will be interesting to see if and when any of the OPC cards come to market. Will we see the typical rough cuts found on cards from this company (especially from early to mid-70s OPC), or will all the edges be smooth?

20813312 1977 O-PEE-CHEE STEVE CARLTON GEM MINT 10
20813313 1979 O-PEE-CHEE JOHNNY BENCH GEM MINT 10
20813316 1980 O-PEE-CHEE RON GUIDRY GEM MINT 10
20813317 1980 O-PEE-CHEE NOLAN RYAN GEM MINT 10
20813447 1971 O-PEE-CHEE RUSS NAGELSON GEM MINT 10
20813448 1971 O-PEE-CHEE BOB ROBERTSON GEM MINT 10
20813482 1974 O-PEE-CHEE GARNET BAILEY GEM MINT 10
20813483 1974 O-PEE-CHEE CRAIG RAMSAY (GRAIG) GEM MINT 10
20813484 1974 O-PEE-CHEE TOM BLADON GEM MINT 10
20813485 1974 O-PEE-CHEE NORM GRATTON GEM MINT 10
20813487 1974 O-PEE-CHEE DWIGHT BIALOWAS GEM MINT 10
20813488 1974 O-PEE-CHEE DON SALESKI GEM MINT 10
20813489 1974 O-PEE-CHEE REY COMEAU GEM MINT 10
20813490 1974 O-PEE-CHEE RON HARRIS GEM MINT 10
20813491 1974 O-PEE-CHEE DETROIT RED WINGS CHECKLIST GEM MINT 10
20813492 1974 O-PEE-CHEE GREG BODDY GEM MINT 10
20813493 1974 O-PEE-CHEE DOUG HORBUL GEM MINT 10
20813494 1974 O-PEE-CHEE LARRY ROBINSON GEM MINT 10
20813495 1974 O-PEE-CHEE BOBBY ROUSSEAU GEM MINT 10
20813496 1974 O-PEE-CHEE NOEL PRICE GEM MINT 10
20813497 1974 O-PEE-CHEE LYLE MOFFAT GEM MINT 10

Here you go........


http://www.ebay.com/itm/1977-O-PEE-C...item35c33fdfd1

Call JO?

I called him 3 times today. I was told on the 3rd call that he wants in today.

Who's in charge?

The last 'Named' mod I received an email from was Jackie. My most recent emails have been from an unnamed mod. Rumor going around the PSA boards is that there is a mod who is a member. This rumored mod is supposedly the one who gets things deleted in the middle of the night and on weekends and holidays. The conjecture is this is a well known not universally like member. I am just relaying what is talked about in the shadows on the PSA boards because people are afraid to talk in the open over there. I think you are correct. The lack of transparency over there only leads to background whispering making conjecture the only thing possible.

BUT who is ultimately in charge. Generally, in any business the person responsible for EVERYTHING is the boss and the bosses boss or bosses. Blaming a low level staff member is BUSH! (not that you were blaming anybody for anything)

Thank you Leon for making discussion possible here! Seriously!!!!!

David, I've been the recipient of one of those anonymous "stop it, or else" emails. It was a result of running afoul of a CU member who used to refer to himself as "we" and "us", but has now dropped that nonsense. I could talk long and loud about this particular member, but it serves no purpose here. I do not think this particular member is the moderator, as the followup emails I had with the anonymous CU employee made it clear that they were aware he was sort of a PITA.

I pointed out in my recent CU post that the only two employees that have publicly posted on the SC&MF recently were "JackieC" and "LauraR", who both started Announcement threads in October. Neither of them have their PMs turned on.

I get what you are saying and again there should be a lot more transparency on those boards. That way the members wouldn't have to discuss things in the shadows. And when they reach a boiling point and spill into the boards you end up with the President of the company coming on and publicly calling CUSTOMERS conspiracists.


But I think we are getting off the point here. Did you see this amazing submission! Its just spectacular! And to put ALL questions to rest Mr. Orlando personally vouched for it!!! That should mean something!

20813173 1978 TOPPS MIKE SCHMIDT GEM MINT 10
20813174 1978 TOPPS PETE ROSE GEM MINT 10
20813175 1986 TOPPS NOLAN RYAN GEM MINT 10
20813176 1986 TOPPS NOLAN RYAN GEM MINT 10
20813177 1968 TOPPS DAVE JOHNSON GEM MINT 10
20813178 1968 TOPPS DICK DIETZ GEM MINT 10
20813179 1968 TOPPS CECIL UPSHAW GEM MINT 10
20813180 1968 TOPPS RON SANTO ALL STAR GEM MINT 10
20813181 1974 TOPPS CATFISH HUNTER GEM MINT 10
20813182 1974 TOPPS MICKEY RIVERS GEM MINT 10
20813183 1974 TOPPS ED BANE GEM MINT 10
20813184 1979 TOPPS KIKO GARCIA GEM MINT 10
20813185 1979 TOPPS JAMIE QUIRK GEM MINT 10
20813186 1970 TOPPS ED BRINKMAN GEM MINT 10
20813187 1970 TOPPS ANDY KOSCO GEM MINT 10
20813188 1970 TOPPS DANNY CATER GEM MINT 10
20813189 1970 TOPPS FELIPE ALOU GEM MINT 10
20813190 1970 TOPPS AL JACKSON GEM MINT 10
20813191 1970 TOPPS RON BRYANT GEM MINT 10
20813192 1970 TOPPS BILL RIGNEY GEM MINT 10
20813193 1970 TOPPS JERRY MAY GEM MINT 10
20813194 1970 TOPPS WILLIE STARGELL GEM MINT 10
20813195 1970 TOPPS VADA PINSON GEM MINT 10
20813196 1970 TOPPS PHILLIES TEAM GEM MINT 10
20813197 1975 TOPPS MINI GENE MICHAEL GEM MINT 10
20813198 1975 TOPPS MINI STOLEN BASE LEADERS B.NORTH/L.BROCK GEM MINT 10
20813199 1975 TOPPS MINI EDUARDO RODRIGUEZ GEM MINT 10
20813200 1975 TOPPS MINI SANDY ALOMAR GEM MINT 10
20813201 1975 TOPPS MINI DAVE PAGAN GEM MINT 10
20813202 1975 TOPPS MINI STEVE FOUCAULT GEM MINT 10
20813203 1975 TOPPS MINI JERRY TERRELL GEM MINT 10
20813204 1975 TOPPS MINI TONY TAYLOR GEM MINT 10
20813205 1975 TOPPS MINI DOYLE ALEXANDER GEM MINT 10
20813206 1975 TOPPS MINI DON WILSON GEM MINT 10
20813207 1975 TOPPS MINI JOHN LOWENSTEIN GEM MINT 10
20813208 1975 TOPPS MINI RANGERS TEAM BILLY MARTIN, MGR. GEM MINT 10
20813209 1975 TOPPS MINI BREWERS TEAM DEL CRANDALL, MGR. GEM MINT 10
20813210 1972 TOPPS DENNY LEMASTER GEM MINT 10
20813211 1972 TOPPS GENE MAUCH GEM MINT 10
20813212 1972 TOPPS DENNIS HIGGINS GEM MINT 10
20813213 1972 TOPPS PAUL SPLITTORFF GEM MINT 10
20813214 1972 TOPPS JOE LAHOUD GEM MINT 10
20813215 1972 TOPPS TOMMY DAVIS GEM MINT 10
20813216 1972 TOPPS JOHN BATEMAN GEM MINT 10
20813217 1972 TOPPS DEL UNSER GEM MINT 10
20813218 1972 TOPPS LEO DUROCHER GEM MINT 10
20813219 1972 TOPPS TONY CLONINGER GEM MINT 10
20813220 1972 TOPPS MIKE JORGENSEN GEM MINT 10
20813221 1972 TOPPS DUKE SIMS GEM MINT 10
20813222 1972 TOPPS BOB JOHNSON GEM MINT 10
20813223 1972 TOPPS MANNY SANGUILLEN GEM MINT 10
20813224 1972 TOPPS BOB BARTON GEM MINT 10
20813225 1972 TOPPS JERRY JOHNSON GEM MINT 10
20813226 1972 TOPPS NL PITCHING LEADERS GEM MINT 10
20813227 1969 TOPPS PHILLIES ROOKIES R.STONE/B.WILSON GEM MINT 10
20813228 1969 TOPPS JIM PALMER GEM MINT 10
etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc...

what does that card book for raw? a nickel?

Mr. Orlando vouched for it. What a guy.

Not the best scan, but to be fair, left and right edges both look fairly rough. That card actually looks like a solid 10, not sheet cut, all things considered.

As somebody who has never sent in anything for grading, I'm blown away by what some of these "10's" go for.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1962-CIVIL-W...p2047675.l2557

Observations
 

#1 we all would love a truly objective way to quantify a cards' condition, etc. yet this cannot exist and psa like any other co. is an imperfect co. to offer such a service

#2 joe sounds very defensive which indicates he is trying to hide something

#3 card grading can allow one to miss the point of collecting in the first place i.e over-emphasizing condition rather than the subject of the card

If you are selling PSA 10's, get a decent scanner!
JimB

+1

I would think rather than deleting threads, banning folks, and after the fact making a statement that reeks of disrespect, it'd make more sense to leave the thread up and address the issues openly to his board members (and customers). I think the questions sounded legitimate, from what's been posted here.

Sincerely, Clayton

That would only make sense if you're under the impression that people are buying the card, not the holder. Just think how many more PSA10's you could get graded at the cost of a good scanner.

I'm sure the purists on the board crack open all their PSA 10 holders so they can feel the cards.:rolleyes:

But it's a PSA 10, so it HAS to be perfect, therefore you don't even NEED a scan... ;)

amen...

I heard all the purists are closet PSA 10 collectors.

This whole psa debacle wreaks! Nothing new at all...all that goes up...well y'all know how this ends!

Not a big secret but we had a group sub on CBT last month. I sent in a card that I know was trimmed. Watched it get trimmed. It's in a PSA 9 holder now. In the same sub, I had two 1971 Topps PSA 8 crackouts that got an EOT.

The trimmed PSA 9 will be on eBay soon with a large disclaimer.

I doubt your buyer will be as honest. Why even put this in the market if you know it is bad? Why send it in if you watched it get trimmed? This is borderline in my eyes.

^^ What he said... Crossing the borderline, actually.

The point was to list a worthless card at about $250k with an explanation in the listing. Yes I am bitter towards PSA and yes I hold grudges.

Bi.ll Hol.ler

PSA is a joke...and a scourge on this wonderful hobby...and I hope that good ol' Joe O gets what he deserves sometime soon!

Well, Mr. Orlando seems to provide superb customer service. At least to his BIG one's. Small customers like me get publicly called out by him on his message board as trouble makers and conspirators.

And when you make a comment like this "We will not tolerate that kind of behavior. It is unhealthy for the community and the hobby, not to mention flat out wrong." you certainly set yourself up for a HUGE fall should any of those conspiracies ever turns out to be true.

Someone mentioned the Wagner Card. Did PSA know it was trimmed? What was the deal behind that?

Did PSA know the Wagner was trimmed? Are u joking? Do a little archival searching and you'll find the answer to that!

It's a long read...but worth it!

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...ghlight=wagner

Sorry - I am new here. I forget there would be archives on this stuff here. The posts on the other boards get poofed to quickly to find out what the truth is. They are gone before much conspiring can go on. Their archives are conspiracy free zones! I am still not used to the open discussion allowed here. I'm getting it! Thanks!

And down the rabbit hole we go........

A more detailed update on my attempt to get my questions answered:

Mr. Orlando wrote this to me and my fellow rabble-rousers on his forums yesterday. "If something comes up in the future and a person has a question about anything at PSA, I don’t think it is unreasonable to ask that you contact us so we can simply answer the question."

I decided to take Mr. Orlando's suggestions. I called his office several times leaving unanswered voice mails. I kept trying and finally got through. Once I identified myself to the person who answers his calls she knew who I was. She then proceeded to ask me if I was calling to be reinstated. Before I could answer her she told me that was not going to happen. I do not know if she was directed to speak to me that way or that is just the way she speaks with customers at time. After being treated that way by the person answering his phone I realized it would be a waste of time to ask Mr. Orlando anything.

I eventually decided that I needed to bring my questions to the top of the company. I then called Mr. Halls's office. Mr. Hall is listed as the Co-Founder, Pres, Chief Operating Officer and Director on the company profile on Yahoo. After identifying myself I was told Mr. Hall was in a meeting. She told me that Mr. Hall would return my call. My call was not returned.

This morning I called Mr. Hall's office again. After I identified myself she remembered me. I must be known in Mr. Halls office now too or they must by psychic mind readers and have some type of crazy Jedi powers over there. She proceeded to tell me she knew what I wanted to discuss with Mr Hall. I hadn't told her the reason for my call at that point. Anyway, I was told Mr. Hall was not in the office but he would be returning my call.

I am sure Mr. Hall is VERY busy. That is VERY understandable. I hope to be able to speak with him soon. I am trying my best to do what Mr. Orlando suggested. "If something comes up in the future and a person has a question about anything at PSA, I don’t think it is unreasonable to ask that you contact us so we can simply answer the question."

David,
What is your goal with these phone conversations? Im not discouraging you from calling, I am just trying to understand what you trying to accomplish?

I just don't want you to end up like my dog that chases squirrels around the yard and every now and then catches one. Clueless what to do at that point.

Also, I wouldn't want you to be disappointed if they tell you everything you want to hear and then nothing changes because this issue is really not affecting their bottom line.

A lot of interesting things going on in this thread. Here are my thoughts:

1. The CU forums, people getting reprimanded & banned

For some I think this happened because you simply need to learn how to behave like an adult, and ideally, like a professional. For others you simply stepped over a line that CU clearly drew in the sand.

2. Grading & many 10s in a row

Joe Orlando made it very clear how this happens and the service offered that allows for it. I agree poofing the thread that asked how this happens was kind of extreme, he should have just replied to it or pinned a thread explaining this circumstance.

3. Pristine Paper & Peter Iskowitz

I started another thread in the Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980) about this specific topic. I've purchased a good deal of cards from Peter to augment my sets and as such it is strongly in my interest that these cards be legit. My concern is not how PSA grades them, as the service indicated above seems reasonable, and more how Peter obtains these pristine cards, specifically, whether they are sheet-cut.

Some would argue that whether they are sheet-cut or not, if they pass PSA inspection then it's fine. Since the sheets were produced when the original cards were and all ... that said, cutting now has potential to be a lot more accurate then it was back in the 70's and earlier, and part of the (or the whole) point is getting cards that were cut and sealed back then and have survived the travel of time.

At any rate, I've communicated a decent amount with Peter and he seems like a nice guy. That said, has anyone here ever met him, ever seen how he gets his cards raw or unopened ... or perhaps has any proof that he is indeed cutting sheets.

Like I said I don't assume to know either way what's really going on here, but with such impressive results in the nature of PSA 10s, I think it's fair to question the authenticity of the cards, and the method in which they were procured. I'm all for transparency, as it builds confidence and allows for freedom to grow.

I miss the days when all we had to complain about was too many T206 threads.

edited ......


I shouldn't make negative comments about these guys - my apologies.

Where is the "smacking one's own head" emoticon when we need it?

I guess this one will have to do! :eek:

You can borrow mine :D

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x...onal/ohhhh.gif

I couldn't agree more! Abundance of t206 and that Peter fella wasn't too bad in hindsight :o

This too shall pass.

...like a rock.

Why doesn't anyone ask Joe Orlando about this issue at this years National PSA luncheon? I really would love to hear his answer.

Was thinking more like a kidney stone.