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Posted By: <b>girl in tn</b><p>ive got the card in my hand right now and i cant tell that its fake at all theres no evidence of paste or rubbing off words

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Posted By: <b>Dave</b><p>I think you'll be wasting your time trying to get that card authenticated...but if you insist and Trae doesn't have time to mess with it you can email me and I'll walk you through step by step submitting the card to SGC or PSA...either way...again, I'd be interested in the pack itself if I get a scan.

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Posted By: <b>mark</b><p>with no word "reprint" on them also, i could be wrong. I'm sure someone on this board knows.

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Posted By: <b>Dan Bretta</b><p>I can't believe anyone here is falling for this.

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Posted By: <b>Steve M.</b><p>No one, and I mean no one on this Board would be happier for you and the hobby if in fact you had discovered an authentic Wagner. To suggest that we are all wrong in light of all the evidence presented you does us a disservice.<br /><br />I have tried, as has most everyone else who has posted, to be polite and understanding and helpful to you regarding the card.<br /><br />That time has ended (at least for me). Do with the card what you want. Don't have it authenticated. Continue to stick your head in the sand. Be happy.

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Posted By: <b>Dave</b><p>I'm not falling for the card being real...it wouldn't be as difficult though for someone to come up with an original cigarette pack..which is what I'd be interested in seeing..

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Posted By: <b>girl in tn</b><p>i wasnt trying to say that you guys dont know what your talk ing about b/c i know that you do know thats why i am still here talking to you i am going to send it off and i will get a scan of the cigg pack and i might even sell it but i wasnt saying anything to dissrespect any of you i really want to thank you for all of your help but i am gone if you want to talk to me or send me anything to help you can to my e-mail address jesikawhitlock@yahoo.com thanks have a nice day and i am sorry if i made anyone mad

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Posted By: <b>Dan Bretta</b><p>I don't think anyone is falling for the card being real...I think you may be falling for "her" story though. There is no cigarette pack, and there probably is no "jesika".

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Posted By: <b>Dave</b><p>Yes...I know the card is 100% fake...I know someone could be trying to pass one off with a real cigarette pack from the time period...although there is probably a 99% chance of that being fake as well. The "pack" should have been posted to start with if there is one..

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Posted By: <b>David Smith</b><p>Is this "girl" related to or dating the two black guys in Detroit or Cincinnati or wherever??<br /><br />As much stink as she is putting up after numerous people have told her the Wagner card is fake, I am starting to believe she is.<br /><br />David

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Posted By: <b>Dave</b><p>I don't even think she is from Tennessee.....the name she used can be traced to Buffalo.<br /> I wonder why she would persist with her story after clearly being shown that the card is fake. Could it be the money factor ? Unless the card was buried inside of a sealed container of some kind I'm afraid the card and pack would not have survived even 50 years of having been buried and exposed to environmental elements. <br /> If I had one wish I would wish that all these reprints would disappear forever. I'll be going to the turtle Creek fleamarket this sunday, and if I remember to take my camera I'll take pics of all the fake Wagners for sale there.

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Posted By: <b>Eric B</b><p>Guys, we all know that this card is fake. But if Jessika is real and actually found this item, you would do the same thing she is doing. There is no way any of you would throw away a "find" because someone said that ink color should be a kinda brown, not black. Or the "P" should be a little larger. An uninformed person would not realize that these aren't judgements and would never take it at face value.<br /><br />Think of this as you finding an old box in your granma's attic with a colorful lamp and a Tiffany & Co tag on it. Would you junk it if someone said the base should be slightly oval, not round? Even if they told you all Tiffany lamps of that color had oval bases?<br /><br />That being said, I think she is a Troll and doing a very good job of it.

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I've been off the board for a few hours and didn't realize the owner came on to discuss her great find.<br /><br />Jesika, should you decide to come back on and read some further posts, let me say that the people on this board are among the most knowledgeable baseball card collectors in the country. When every last one of them tells you it is fake, and you disagree with them (and I am guessing this is the first time you have ever seen a vintage baseball card), maybe it's time to pack it up and just admit it's not what you hoped it is.<br /><br />Over the years we have seen this same story played out many times, and every time the card in question is an undeniable fake. Any effort or expense you put into this trying to prove otherwise is money and time wasted.<br /><br />Sincerely,<br />Barry Sloate

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Posted By: <b>t206museum.com</b><p><br />This is not new to us at all since we received "Wagner found" email at least once a week. No more excitement when you hear this kind of "found" anymore. <br /><br />Trae. R, you will get used to it. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14><br /><br />Yes, that Wagner is a reprint.<br /><br /><a href="http://www.t206museum.com/page/forgery.html" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.t206museum.com/page/forgery.html</a>

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Posted By: <b>Joe Pelaez</b><p>It reminds me of the 1990 Dr Koos exposure.<br />Who BTW was an artistic Doctor in comparison to this amateur Wagner fake.<br /><br />After I got my money back, I spent more time at the 1990 Texas national educating the dealers about Danny D, and telling them what to look for.<br /><br />Because of my research, and because I didn't want to tell them EVERYTHING, ... I left out a couple of clues.<br /><br />Knowing that Bob Lemke would have something about the doctoring in SCD, my thinking was why educate the bandito on how to improve his art work.<br /><br />It's almost like the artistic doctor saying: "Please tell me, and point out where I've errored, so that I can improve my art."<br /><br />It was my intention to alert the dealers in Texas, and protect my hobby.<br />At the same time, it would have defeated my purpose by telling all, and improving the enemies of my hobby.<br /><br />A fun thread indeed. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14><br /><br />Joe P. <br /><br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>shane</b><p>Dave,<br />She just emailed me a pic of the 1989 Salem light pack of cigarettes that housed the Wagner. I think the pack is fake too.<br /><br />Shane

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Posted By: <b>Max Weder</b><p>Barry<br /><br />I'm disappointed that you didn't correct her/his/their grammar and punctuation. <br /><br />May I suggest<br /><br /><img src="http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/0192813897.01._PIlitb-dp-500-arrow,TopRight,45,-64_OU01_AA240_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg">

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Posted By: <b>Rob Dewolf</b><p><img src="http://members.aol.com/wolfie51sb/style">

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Posted By: <b>dmcd</b><p><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/March07/MeTalk1.JPG">

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Posted By: <b>mark</b><p>You just made me spit my beer all over the place, what a waste of good beer. I will have to get another. Funny stuff!!!

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I only correct spelling and grammar for board members. Strangers don't get my free services <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>Cat</b><p>Jessica:<br /><br />Don't believe these guys. There are a couple of gentlemen from Cincinnati that can authenticate this card. They know a lot about T206s too. I don't have their number, but their names are Cobb and Edwards and if you run across them at a card show they look like this ---&gt;<br /><br /><br /><img src="http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/9919/honusgg3.jpg"><br /><br />Good luck

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>You know there is a lesson to be learned from those two guys. They taught us how you can become famous for absolutely no reason at all!

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Posted By: <b>Cat</b><p>Barry:<br /><br />I'll never get tired of laughing at those guys!!! <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I wonder what they are up to these days? Have they given up the fight, or are they still looking for that magic buyer?

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Posted By: <b>mark</b><p>if they ever let PSA grade it in private. As many of you know, they will let PSA grade this card only if they are allowed in the room with the graders. PSA says NO.

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>PSA has graded a million cards, including multiple Wagners. Do they think PSA will slip out the back door with their card?<br /><br />Or maybe they are afraid PSA will steal their fake and switch it with a real one! <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>girl in tn</b><p>now look i am 20 years old of course i dont know anything about this card i didnt intend this to become a chat room where you all could make fun of me i said i was sorry for saying that you all were wrong but its not fare for you to say these things about me i have no reason to lie to any of you and i didnt send anyone that pack of ciggs my grandfather is looking for it right now i could really care less if its real or not i could live my life with or without any of the money and if it was real i wasnt going to sell it anyway i just got on here for some advise and instead i got put down by a bunch of so called professionals who act more like a bunch of kids in a chat room except those of you who tried to give me advise that i am going with i am going to send it off i am waiting on the package right now and i am sorry that it turned into a big comedy show and yes i do live in tenn chattanooga so i dont know how you got buffalo

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Posted By: <b>Steve M.</b><p>that you have not read the majority of these posts. Otherwise you wouldn't come back insulting us. We tried to help. Guess you just won't listen. <br /><br />I hereby ask that the moderator lock this loser out.

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Jesika- Steve is correct. I made the statement that there is no possibility that your card is genuine. That was not an insult but a professional opinion. I have handled vintage cards for 25 years, and many board members are equally knowledgeable, if not more so. You mention in your last post you will "send the card off." Does that mean you still harbor hopes of it being genuine? If that is the case, you are bypassing the advice of all the experts here who are telling you to not even waste your time, as it is 100% guaranteed to come back labelled "reprint."

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Posted By: <b>David Smith</b><p>Barry, you are being too humble.<br /><br />Jessika, not only are a lot of board members knowledgable about old baseball cards, they make their living (or at least a part of it) selling and dealing in them. There are also some members who own (or have owned) a REAL T206 Honus Wagner.<br /><br />Me? I own some T206's and have held a REAL Wagner in my hand once. I have not been in the hobby as long as some and I don't make my living in it but even I can tell your Wagner is fake and I have nothing to gain by saying it. If you want to keep wasting time and money, that is your decision. But insulting board members who are trying to help you is not the right thing to do.<br /><br />Also, a little punctuation in your posts might help.

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Posted By: <b>Cobby33</b><p>Just drive the thing to SGC and have them look at it. That way, you don't have to deal with anyone's opinions on here. It's really that simple.

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Posted By: <b>Dylan</b><p>How can anyone expect to sell a T206 Wagner not graded these days? I will only let PSA grade it if i can stand in the room??? Sounds like they know its fake and are trying to come up with every excuse possible to justify not having it in a slab. For one thing any high resolution picture of a card shows its one of a kind marks and creases. No one could possibly switch a card out and replicate those, and certainly not a card as publicized as a wagner. How ridiculous, and all the press these idiots have drummed up for another reprint.

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Posted By: <b>David Smith</b><p>Here is my wish for the hobby.<br /><br />I wish there were a very wealthy collector who would buy advertising time on National TV, radio, magazines and large newspapers. I wish they would have a standing offer to buy all REAL T206 Honus Wagners. The only stipulation being if the cards are fakes or reprints that he/she gets to tear up or burn the card right in front of the owner.<br /><br />Doing this might bring out another REAL Wagner or two and also get rid of a bunch of fakes.<br /><br />David

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I bet they would be all fakes. In 25 years I probably have gotten 50 phone calls from people outside the hobby who think they have a real Wagner.<br /><br />I'm still waiting for my first one, and not holding my breath.

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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Jesika, is there a funny looking guy playing a banjo on your porch right now? Did Ned Beatty just run past your house squealing like a pig?

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Posted By: <b>David Smith</b><p>Barry (or anyone else), what was the last honest to goodness REAL Wagner that was found and when? Was it the one that the kid discovered in the foundation of the torn down house?<br /><br /><br />On a different note, has anyone ever traced the history of the known REAL Wagners? The person who owns the only REAL Wagner I have ever seen is an older collector who was born in Pennsylvania. He said he got it from his Dad, who once owned TWO Wagners at the same time. The reason he had two was because he was a Minor League ballplayer who lived in Pennsylvania and Wagner was his baseball idol while growing up.<br /><br />Since there are less than 100 known Wagners, could it be they were only distributed regionally, like, possibly, the Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb back and Eddie Plank?? <br /><br />David

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Jeff- I think we have a heckler in the audience!

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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Barry, I hate to hijack Jesika's thread but I had a flashback to the Seinfeld episode when George tries to give himself a nickname -- T Bone -- and I nearly laughed out loud. Has nothing to do with the fake Wagner but it still made me laugh...

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>But they didn't call him T-Bone...they called him Koko the Monkey!

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Posted By: <b>Art Vandelay</b><p>Quintessential George Costanza.<br /><a href="http://www.seinfeldscripts.com/TheMaid.htm" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.seinfeldscripts.com/TheMaid.htm</a>

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Dave- like your Art Vandelay moniker. You know, George invented that alter ego as far back as episode #2?

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Posted By: <b>DMcD</b><p>I am supposed to have my tax records ready for my accountant by tomorrow and I am reading Seinfeld scripts at <a href="http://www.seinfeldscripts.com/" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.seinfeldscripts.com/</a> and Net54 posts instead. (Off to read episode #2).

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Posted By: <b>jesika</b><p>I AM TROUGH WITH ALL OF YOU I BET YOU WILL REGRET ALL OF THIS WHEN I SEND IT OFF<br />

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>What will we regret when you send this off? That it will come back real and we will all be eating our words? Why do you feel the need to be rude and hostile?

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Posted By: <b>mark</b><p>Send it off to get graded, but please show us the results. If we don't hear from you we all know what they said. <br /><br />If we do hear from you then it will look like you have a T206 Wagner.

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Posted By: <b>Dave</b><p>Go Away.

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Posted By: <b>Dylan</b><p>If that Wagner is real, a lot of people here would be eating their words... sorry to dissapoint but it wont happen. I will offer one last critical piece of advice... spelling and grammer go a long way.

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Dylan- "grammer" is spelled "grammar." Sorry, I couldn't resist <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>MVSNYC</b><p>the only "real" thing to come out of this thread, is the seinfeld script link, it is awesome!