Why Mantle ??
 

The year was 1964, the first year I began to collect baseball cards. Being a paper boy after receiving my large salary of $3.00 I would race to the local drug store to spend all my hard earned money --loved the Gum, and the little metal coins storing them for safe keeping inside a brown grocery bag. Around this time upon visiting my older cousin I advised my passion--Donnie advised he had a bag full and trotted up into the attic to retrieve those hundred or so little pieces of cardboard gold--upon opening the sack he began to sort them--when he came upon a double he would hand it to me, saying you can have it---WOW--never before had I seen those type of baseball cards, turned out they were all mint 1957 Topps. After completing his task at hand, I mentioned, you have two Mantles--can I have one, you have two? NO he
replied in a rather stern youthful voice--No way that's Mickey Mantle---

So the first Mantle I pulled was the the same year, 1964 so to protect my rare find, with a nickel I purchase a holder from a vending machine and laminated my prize!!

Awesome!
 

Thanks for sharing. My 1st packs were 1976. 7 for $1.05. I had a reverse trade story, my "friend" offered me a stack of 30 cards for just 1 of my cards. I'm like who the heck is Henry Aaron? I was young and not too into the game but that start got me into it so bad that it is a large part of my life today. Live, breathe, sleep collectibles! Thanks again for sharing!

Peace, Mike

PS Quick related trivia....what HOF player started in the same city that he retired in BUT played there for 2 separate teams? .............Henry "Hank" Aaron, Milwaukee Braves and Milwaukee Brewers! Love that trivia question! :)

Nice!
 

MVSNYC,

I'm a Red Sox fan but a lover of baseball and this really sums Jeter up perfectly. The fact that he stayed with 1 team (loyalty) also makes me like him. So rare this day and age!

Peace, Mike

With Mantle, I've always felt a big part of it was being a fixture in baseball's main event year after year after year.
He spent a whole lot of time in a whole lot of people's living rooms, in glorious black & white.

He's the Bobby Orr of baseball.

Also Willie Mays (NY Giants and Mets)

Also Babe Ruth (1914 Boston Red sox, 1935 Boston Braves

Ron Santo Chicago Cubs and White Sox.

Hornsby -- St. Louis Cardinals and Browns.

Mickey Mantle was a great ballplayer. I think his position as face of the modern hobby comes from a few factors beyond his on field play. First, as a member of the Yankees, he was in the World Series virtually every year between 1950 and 1964, the years when baby boomers grew up. At that time, there was very little national baseball coverage. You saw your local team, the all star game, and the World Series. Mickey got to be seen all around the country, not just his local market(albeit the biggest in the country and the media center). The color barrier in baseball had just been broken. Many teams early in Mantle’s career had not yet been integrated. In fact, the Yankees did not bring up Elston Howard until 1955. I think Mantle’s popularity at that time over Mays reflected racial views more so than talent. Also, Mantle got a pass from the press on his off field activities. This pass lasted throughout most of his life, decades after he stopped playing. He was an alcoholic and a philanderer, yet the press portrayed him as an All American boy.
Why have his cards become the face of the post war hobby? I think it is boomer memories and a concerted effort, initially by dealers and now by collectors with vested interests, to hype his cards. What mystifies me the most is how, years after Mantle and DiMaggio have retired, that suddenly Mantle is viewed as the better of the two. When I was growing up in the 1950s and early 1960s, DiMaggio was always thought of as the superior player. Even in 1999, when the fans chose the all century team, DiMaggio received more votes than Mantle. They were comparable hitters, but DiMaggio was a much superior fielder.

Put Simply, his accent occurred at the same time Televisions became more common in the average household. Thus, he became the hero of hoards of 'Baby-Boomers'.

I thought he had a pretty regular voice.

I see what you did there...;)

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

Oops! Very Funny.

At least I didn't say ass scent...whew, now that would have been worse.

What is the obsession with Mantle? Let's see....He was only 5'10 170 lbs., and could hit a baseball 500 feet. He was also the fastest player in the game, and lived a lifestyle that people only dreamed about.....Yea, what's the big deal?:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Oh, by the way, he could get any woman he wanted!!

One of the highlights, IMO, in the Ken Burn's Doc. was an infield play where Mickey was flying down the first base line...faster than I could imagine! A REAL WOW! moment!

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LOL-He was 5'11'' and 195lbs, but don't let that get in the way of a good story. He had all the talent in the world. However, as great as he was, he could have been better if he only took care of himself. That is the real tragedy of Mantle. I hired Mantle for a customer dinner in 1992. Till he got a few drinks in him he was a sullen guy. After a few drinks he was great.

As he supposedly said, if I had known I would live this long, I would have taken better care of myself.

Wonder what Ruth would have done then?? 900 HR's?? Jimmie Foxx, 700 HR's?

So you would trade Mantle even for Robinson with both players being the same age??

Funny, I'm feeling the same way these days.


But, I'm a year younger (than he was) and my knees are still good...

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Let us also not fail to acknowledge perhaps the most important factor in the popularity of Mickey Mantle. Tony Basil's record about him. We know it's about him because he is singing "Oh, Mickey, you're so fine, you blow my mind, hey Mickey!" And the name of the song is also called "Mickey" so there is no ambiguity. THAT is the real reason why Mickey Mantle is so beloved to this day.

:D

(Just engaging in a little verbal misbehavior with y'all. I know that song has nothing to do with Mickey Mantle. And I know the singer's name is Toni, not Tony, and Toni is a woman and not a man. Just a few more hi-jinks and zany antics to brighten your day. :) )

I think I would do a little sabermetric research, Steve. Mantle is one of just 7 players in the history of the game to produce more than 200% of league average runs created (credit to Bill James, who ranks Mantle as the 5th best major league player of all time). His 215% in that category, going by recollection, is tied for third with Lou Gehrig, behind only Ruth, at 240%, and Williams, at 250%. His OBPS+ of 172 is fifth best of all time, I believe (behind, going by memory, only Ruth at 204; Williams at 190; Hornsby at 175; and Gehrig at 174), considerably ahead of Mays (156) and Aaron (155). His on base percentage alone--.421--is among the very best of all time, far beyond Mays and Aaron, who were each in the .380 range. Per James in the early 2000's, his 1961 season--54 HR's, 128 RBI, .317 BA, 126 walks, .448 OBP--although great stats, and ranked by James as the 15th best season of all time, is MERELY MANTLE'S THIRD BEST SEASON (both his 1956 triple crown year and his 1957 season were better)!. Add in 12 pennants in his first 14 seasons to go with 7 world championships = Mantle don't give up nothin' to nobody (or at least very, very little!). In short, objectively, there is absolutely no OBJECTIVE dispute that he does indeed rank with the greatest to ever play the game.

James also wrote that although Mantle and Mays appeared to have similar production in their peak years, Mays was actually making about 60 or more outs per year than Mantle, based on the fact that the Mick walked, much, much more often (hence the higher OBP) and grounded into roughly just half as many double plays.

I haven't read through every previous post at this somewhat late hour, but if your first post was in jest, as the objective stats indicate that it might well have been, please excuse the above dissertation. I do agree, however, that his '52 Topps, although iconic, is overpriced. A near mint example, for instance, was priced at around $30,000 in 1991, and hence has only increased in value in the 5 to 6% compounded annually range, having had its ups and downs, as one would expect, considering its' ready availability. A really good collectible should be at least 10% or better compounded annually through the last 25 years or so if purchased for investment purposes.

Best wishes,

Larry

Batting third for the Yankees, Mantle’s most important job was to knock in runs. In his 18 seasons he finished with 1509 RBIs. In less seasons those all time greats Carlos Delgado, Jeff Kent, Jeff Bagwell and Harry Hellmann had more RBIs. Lou Gehrig had 473 more RBIs in two less seasons. DiMaggio had more RBIs than Mantle and he played five fewer years.

Nice try, but all of those pure counting numbers are context dependent, i.e. directly related to the conditions under which the game in those respective eras was being played, and the relative ease or difficulty in scoring runs. A proper comparison, entails the use of statistics which control for the difference in those conditions. Those that I have used above perform exactly that function.

Sincerely,

Larry

Larry, I repeat, Mantle’s job batting third for the Yankees was to drive in runs. I took a look at one of the players I mentioned, Harry Hellmann, and compared his impact on his team to the impact of Mantle on his. What I compared was, over the course of their careers what percentage of their teams runs did the knock in. Interestingly, Mantle knocked in 12% of the Yankees runs. Hellmann, hardly the face of the hobby, knocked in 14% of his team’s runs.
In 1961, after he had left the Yankees, Casey Stengel put together a list of the greatest players he had seen, by league, at each position. He listed three American League center fielders: Tris Speaker, Ty Cobb and Joe DiMaggio. Mantle didn’t even get an honorable mention.

Mantle
 

Interesting that you brought up Harry Heilmann. One of the most underrated hitters of all-time. In the 1920s, he had one .403 season and batted over .390 three other seasons to the tune of a .342 lifetime average. 5 separate seasons exceeded a 1.000 OPS. Hornsby & Cobb-like figures. Incredible numbers. One could easily argue that along with Hornsby, Foxx, Aaron, Ramirez, Pujols and Cabrera, he resides as one of baseball’s greatest all-time right-handed hitters.

Bill James has Mantle 6th. He has Mays 3rd behind only Ruth and Wagner. So why isn't Willie Mays the face of post-war baseball cards? It is a valid question.

Maybe 400 or 500 posts from now someone will get close to the actual reason. I will stay tuned.

Bob Costas explained it in post #22.

Plenty of posts in this thread have mentioned the myriad reasons why Mantle occupies the lofty perch he does in the Post War card world. If you’re looking for one mathematical reason, you won’t be getting that kind of answer. It is a confluence of many factors, many of which involve what some call the intangibles. With a modicum of effort it’s not so hard to grasp.

He didn't play for the Yankees, he wasn't in the WS every year, he didn't have the mystique of overcoming handicapping pain, and he wasn't blonde with folk hero looks.

The obsession is money, bottom line period. His cards hold value everyone wants them. Beautiful ones sell, ones that have been ran over buy a tuck sell....it’s crazy but we all know it’s true. Mantle and Ruth are two names that will always be the last card a collector wants to sell.

Not according To Ebay

https://www.ebay.com/sch/212/i.html?...mantle&_sop=16

Mantle was the right player at the right time on the right team and had that intangible- charisma, agreeing with Adam. King Kelly wasn't the best player of his time, but was probably the most popular and his card values reflect that fact. His Four Base Hit card may be the "King" of 19th century issues, with mention to the Old Judge Anson in uniform and the Just So Young. Charisma.

What's interesting to me is that even Mantle himself couldn't answer the question posed by the O.P. (Costas mentions that in the eulogy at the link in post #22). I think the reason for the difficulty in finding an answer, at least in part, is that everyone is looking just at Mantle. But, I think it's not just about Mantle and all of his abilities and accomplishments as great as they were. It's that and way more. For all of the various reasons mentioned in this thread, America (and New York, especially, for obvious reasons) in the '50's and '60's, projected themselves onto him. He was one of them, in a way. They made him their hero and rallied around him. They chose him. He became the glue that bound them together as a community. And he's the shared memory of the '50's and '60's for many. There's absolutely value in that. Those who lived it will pay to buy into that "community" and memory again. Those who didn't but have families members who did, will also pay into that "community." Those who have heard the stories will do the same. And up the price goes. It's all good in that sense. Kind of reminds me of the movie "Field of Dreams" a bit. Same thing. Just my opinion, of course.

The Best
 

It's 2018, I don't need a reason. He's the best.

When a non-collecting friend hears I collect cards, normally the first question
asked is "Do you got any Mantles?" If you feel, his cards aren't worth owning
this is fine. I'm sure there are a couple others that would agree. Most that
think his cards are worth having may not have seen him play except on
film.

Maybe fifty years from now, no one will care. But I'm betting if Mantle
cards aren't chased after and are worth much less, then all the other
Mays, Aarons, Robinsons, Clementes, etc will be worth less too.

'nuff said'

Awards
Hall Of Fame
Year Team League
1974 NY Yankees

Uniform number retired
Year Team League
1969 NY Yankees

AL MVP
Year Team League
1956 NY Yankees
1957 NY Yankees
1962 NY Yankees

World Series Championship
Year Team League
1951 NY Yankees
1952 NY Yankees
1953 NY Yankees
1956 NY Yankees
1958 NY Yankees
1961 NY Yankees
1962 NY Yankees

AL All-Star
Year Team League
1952 NY Yankees
1953 NY Yankees
1954 NY Yankees
1955 NY Yankees
1956 NY Yankees
1957 NY Yankees
1958 NY Yankees
1959 NY Yankees
1959 NY Yankees
1960 NY Yankees
1960 NY Yankees
1961 NY Yankees
1961 NY Yankees
1962 NY Yankees
1962 NY Yankees
1963 NY Yankees
1964 NY Yankees
1965 NY Yankees
1967 NY Yankees
1968 NY Yankees

Rawlings AL Gold Glove
Year Team League
1962 NY Yankees

Just wanted to acknowledge the props for HH

http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibit...e/Heilmann.jpg

Most people have no idea who this guy is.

Most collectors know the name Scott Hileman of SGC better than Harry
(not here of course).

So you can't be surprised why Harry and most other players take a major
back seat when it comes to card prices of Mick.

Al, I’m pretty sure you collect Mantle and then just fill out the rest of the sets so you don’t put yourself as a closet fan of his :)

I agree with your last sentiment. Fingers crossed the market continues to climb now that I have everything I could find/afford.

Arguably the best HOFer that your average fan has never heard of. Not a lot of Slug cards out there.

delete

I found this in a 1950's scrapbook I picked up this week, thought it was pretty cool:

Mickey only received 88.2% of the BBWAA votes. How good could have really been? :eek:

just so I don't get flamed, yes that was sarcasm. ;) Crazy he only 88.2% of the vote.

RACE, my friend, RACE

Excellent post and a very interesting take on the discussion.

Then why aren't Jackie Robinson and Roberto Clemente cards cheap? They are black and their cards are worth more than Ted Williams.

Mays
 

It may have to do with race with certain individuals, but I wouldn’t collect anything Mays because, in my experience, he’s just not a nice person. I couldn’t collect someone that I didn’t like off the field as well as on. That’s just me though.

Although Mantle struggled early in his career, he was known for hitting prodigious home runs, most famously the 565-foot blast at Griffith Stadium in 1953, and the ball that nearly went out of Yankee Stadium, just missing when it hit the top of the facade in right field. These blasts help cement his Paul Bunyon reputation, but it was just one factor of many.

He was a blue-eyed blonde-haired kid from the hardscrabble town of Commerce, Oklahoma, who came to the big city and became its hero; he played for the best team in baseball, which won the World Series nearly every year; he played in the 1950's, arguably one of the Golden Ages of baseball; and he won back-to-back MVP's, including the Triple Crown in 1956. All of these things, including others, cemented his legendary status.

If you grew up in the 1950's and 60's and followed baseball, you would understand why Mantle was so beloved. Just looking at his stats today only tells a part of the story.