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Hey Dan P and Jim R
"Wow, what dealer list with the Barnings, Lipset, Lerner and Halls Nostalgia...."
It certainly sounds like a "Who's Who" list in the hobby, back in the 1970's and 1980's. The hobby was very new in 1981, and if I were to detail all the various "walk-ins" that we saw (and acquired), it would take 100's of posts on this thread. Dan, I am sure you'll recall this one. A guy comes in with a brown bag full of sports cards (1950 - 1959). I looked at them, there were several 100's of Bowman and Topps BB & FB cards. I gave him and offer and told him to walk around and get the "best offer" for them. Four hours later, he returned to our table and I bought them. I kept the BB cards and Dan took the FB cards. Back then FB cards were not selling at equivalent prices with BB cards. Danny stashed away the FB cards for several years; and, when FB cards began to increase in value, Dan started selling these FB cards. He did better than I did with the BB cards. He still gloats about this, when he feels in the mood to "rub it in" to me. TED Z |
Marco Rol
I just read your offer in your post #38......
"I would also like to extend an invitation to Ted Z to come out of retirement, especially if he would be so kind as to accept the offer of a free booth at Oaks." I have already signed up for your April 1911 show in Oaks, PA. Levi B. has my contract. I signed up for an "L" shaped (corner) booth. Please email me directly regarding your offer at........ tedzan11@comcast.net And please, no PM's. Thanks much, TED Z |
Ted....I know its hard to end a tradition, but as you & I have discussed many times , there have been many changes since we met at Willow Grove in the early 80's, and not all of them are positive...... As you recall I stopped coming East after the first Fort Washington show in the early 90's, when the first round of changes were happening..... I know that it wasn't the facility (GW Lodge), as I could write a book on my experiences with the facility , but something about the cramped conditions gave the place a sense of excitement, unless of course you were located on the aisle with Rich Altman & Lou Avon on either side of you... The Chilean miners are about the only ones who could relate to you in that case..... The roof of the place had 'old swiss cheese' shingles, and if you didn't have a leak over your table, the smell of musty, heavily trafficked carpet competed with the greasy, St Patrick's Day style (Green) hot dogs that stayed on the grill until they sold, or disintegrated, whichever came first..... Of course, if I could go to a show like those great ones ('82-'86) and pick up what I did buy in the day, the smell of moldy carpet, the teacup saucer mattresses, the mystery meat covered with lumpy gray gravy served at Martha's Restaurant (until the health department shut it down), the irregular hot water, or running water at all, nor the non insulated rooms without heat for the December and March show.... none of these.... would stand in my way from going back there again, although this time I'd be better prepared with a fully insulated haz-mat suit, and a box of granola bars to cover me for a few days..... Great to hear that you're doing the 'new' show, and don't be surprised if you see someone from 3000 miles away pop in...:)
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I think Ted means April 2011, not 1911.;)
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This is a great thread!
Thanks for the stories guys! Jeff |
Barry S
"April 1911"......
was that a slip of my finger on the keyboard, or was it a Freudian slip ? You didn't know that built in my mind is a "Time Machine". Consider this....if we could go back to the Spring of 1911, and know what we know now....we would be opening up LENOX and UZIT cigarette packs and cornering the market on the last run of T206 cards. Just think how many Cobb (bat off shoulder) cards you would find ? Or, Lajoie (batting) cards you could hoard away ? <img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt113/zanted86/batoffshouldercobb.jpg" alt="[linked image]"><img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt113/zanted86/uzitschaefer.jpg" alt="[linked image]"> No, that wasn't a "typo", Barry.....I was dreaming away. Best regards ole friend, TED Z |
I miss amongst other things
The "Boston Sea Party" which was just down the road from the GW. An all you can eat seafood buffet -- Leon, you would have LOVED that place, and they even had one in Houston -- so you might have been in one before you ventured up to the DFW area
Rich |
And doing my David Rudd imitation
One of my favorite memories was going to dinner with Frank Barning, the late Rich Hawksley, and a few other hobby heavyweights. We went to a diner-like element for dinner with an 20 page menu so I figured out what I wanted and gave a specific order -- Rich H was so tired from the show's hours, etc that all he told the waitress was -- whatever he (me) just ordered -- was fine for his order as well
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Rich K.
Thanks for the memories........
Hey guys, I have to elaborate on what Rich just brought up......The Boston Sea Party restaurant. It was just a short walk away up the hill from the Willow Grove Show. It was a fabulous seafood buffet-style place. Many of the dealers would get together there on Saturday nite. For those unfamiliar with this seafood restaurant, it was franchised across the country during the mid-1970's. The quality of its seafood was consistently good. I have eaten at the Boston Sea Party in Denver, Carol Stream (south of Chicago), Cherry Hill (NJ), and Willow Grove, PA. It was an adventure to dine there. The set up was 3 long buffet "Piers" full of delicious goodies to select from. Pier 1 contained the seafood appetizers, Pier 2 was stocked with the main entrees, and Pier 3 had a huge selection of desserts. In the 1970's, for about $20, you could eat all you wanted till you dropped. By the mid-'80s the price went up to $25 (still a bargain). Then, by the early 1990's this chain of restaurants abruptly closed down. Never understood why. Oh well, if you were a seafood lover, the Boston Sea Party was a really great place to eat.....while it lasted. TED Z |
Houston too
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If you like seafood........
Living outside of Boston means we have the greatest seafood.
My wife and I love Legal Seafood which is 1/2 mile from us. Theres nothing like eating a lobster caught several hours earlier! Back to the Grove eating places: I loved it when we all went to the Seaparty, and there was a great deli up that hill where you could find guys like Josh Evans and myself getting those great sandwiches. As for the "Gentlemans Clubs", I think one was called Cheata's and can't recall the other one! We closed them up many a Saturday night back then! |
First "Willow Grove" Convention Program Scans
I just saw this thread and enjoyed reading the posts about the “good old days” at the great old Willow Grove show. I was very lucky that I happened to live just a few minutes from Willow Grove and as a kid this really helped me a lot. I couldn’t have lived in a better place. In the early days, even when I wasn’t old enough to drive, it was so close that it was still no problem to get to the show. I never missed it. For me it was as if everyone in the country had packed up all their old cards and agreed to come to my hometown just to make deals with me! When it was over, I counted the days until the next one. They were very exciting times and I think anyone who was there can remember the magic of those early shows. I’m glad to see I’m not the only one who looks back and says “Wow, THAT was amazing.”
I thought some collectors would appreciate seeing this link to an old REA lot that includes scans of the program for the first “Willow Grove” show (which was actually held at Spring Garden College in Chestnut Hill, PA). It’s not obvious it’s there - you have to go to the very bottom of the auction page, clicking on each page image scrolling to the right to see all the pages. I made sure to scan and post this when it was sold just in case anyone wanted to see it in the future. http://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/...x?itemid=11429 I’m feeling really old now! Sincerely, Robert Lifson |
Rob.....One of the interesting facts is that there were "only" 28 tables at that first show, but you could probably remember where everyone's table was located and the dimensions of the room......... On the West Coast we had quarterly shows in Northern California, the Labor Day (& later Memorial Day) show in Southern California during the 1970's, and the annual Seattle show (which is still running and is the longest running annual show in the hobby). Although part of the hobby's "history" these are fondly remembered by those who attended them, and are the fodder of many stories considered 'urban myth' or 'hobby legend' to the generations that follow...It's amazing that the sign survived... I know of a few people who collect ephemera from the pre-1985 shows, but that has to be one of the coolest survivors...
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west Coast Shows
Hi Marc,
I enjoyed your post. Was it Bob Lee that ran the Labor Day show? I got friendly with Randy Thyberg (was he related to Bob Lee?) in the 80's, as we were both young promoters with much in common. My conversations with these fine gentlemen were always pleasant. Randy promoted a nice event in Valley Forge at the Sheraton's Expo center with hundreds and hundreds of tables. I was in the front row and saw EVERYONE and EVERYTHING! The line-up of autograph signers was perhaps the greatest in the hobbys history. It was a huge show run 4-5 days around the 4th of July. My best memory of the event was Sunday morning when Randy charged the media big money to cover the show. The place erupted in applause as Pete Rose walked in with Michael Bertolini! I later went to my room and Whitey Ford was in the elevator with us. It's hard to believe that Randy has been gone so long. He was always a class act and we shared some very good stories about life as young promoters. Thanks for the posts, Marc. |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
Great stuff Rob......thanks much for sharing the Spring Garden show sign and program with us.
Mark Macrae was a regular visitor to the Willow Grove show during the 1980's. We met at my table in March 1983. I was selling a 1949 Bowman set, and Mark was a buyer. I recall, we agreed to me keeping the Phillies and Yankees cards; and, the rookie cards of Bob Lemon, Satchel Paige, Preacher Roe, and Duke Snider (autographed). So, Mark purchased 200 (of the 240) cards in this set. Subsequently, I sold him 5 more 1949 sets. This story of Mark and I is best summed up by quoting Claude Raines famous words to Humphrey Bogart in the final scene of Casablanca...... "I think Ricky, this is the start of a beautiful friendship" One more comment on Mark....that day in March 1983, the snow was falling in Willow Grove, yet Mark was in his Summer shorts. He always wore his short pants to the show, regardless of the weather. As they say......You can take Mark out of California....but, you can't take that California style out of Mark. Best regards, Mark and Rob, TED Z |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
Bob Schmerier and Ted Taylor created a 49-card set of 1948 Bowman-like cards that were available at the 1976 show at Spring Garden.
Shown here is part of a complete uncut sheet of this 49-card set . They were very professionally done with very informative bios on the backs of them. This series of BB cards featured...... Connie Mack Babe Ruth Jimmy Foxx Mel Ott Musial Ted Williams Joe DiMaggio Johnny Mize Bob Feller Jackie Robinson Yogi Berra Gil Hodges Hal Newhouser http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...owmansheet.jpg At the 1977 show Bob and Ted issued a 2nd series of 64 cards that were very similar in design as the 1st series. They advertised these cards as a 1947 series. TED Z |
Bill..... The 'original' West Coast Labor Day shows were held in Southern California (Jim Nowell,later Steve Brunner, Gavin Riley & Mike Berkus)... Bob Lee started promoting small 'hotel-style' shows here in Northern California around 1982. Within 3 years, he'd created a huge show circuit throughout the West and promoted a spectacular National in San Francisco in 1987. Following the National, Bob began running a San Francisco Labor Day weekend show in 1988. Around the same time, Bob's son-in-law (Randy Thyberg) started running a second show circuit in south-central California with Will Davis. The circuits promoted 12-14 shows per week in this region (Almost every day was a different city) .... No promoter today has the energy or drive that Bob Lee had during the 1980's (Two or 3 people like him in government would revive the economy in 3 months !!).... Ted, wearing shorts at Willow Grove in March & December was the only way to go.... It might be 28 degrees outside, but inside was more densely packed than the Calcutta street markets....:)
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Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
Here are a couple of interesting BB player stories at the Willow Grove show.
Featured guest at Willow Grove (circa 1990) was Gus Zernial. I gave Gus his famous 1952 Topps card to sign. Gus asked me....... " Do you really want me to sign this card, isn't it quite valuable ? " I told him that I had 4 more of these cards back home. He smiled and autographed it. What impressed me about Gus was....at 67 years old, Gus looked like he could go to the ballpark and hit many more HR's. <img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt113/zanted86/autoguszernialjimpiersall.jpg" alt="[linked image]"> Bill Hedin, you'll appreciate this story...... Jimmy Piersall was the guest at Willow Grove in the early 1990's. I was in line to meet him and get his autograph. The guy (dealer) in front of me presented Jimmy an egg-crate type of box containing 24 balls for Jimmy to sign. Jimmy looks up at him, and asked.... "do I have to sign all of these ?" The dealer responded...."Why yes, I paid for all of them." Obviously, Jimmy was not that happy about this. Piersall signs the first ball, and reaches over the table and places it in one of the slots in this 24-slot grid. Then Jim signs the 2nd ball and tosses it into this crate...."swish"....it lands in a slot. Jim appeared quite pleased with himself. So, as he signed the remaining 22 balls, Jim would toss them into the crate. All the rest of the balls bounced off the crate, and were rolling all over the floor. Needless to say, the dealer was very "ticked-off".....while Jimmy was laughing. TED Z |
Reisshead
Bob
Regarding your post...... " It was nice to finally meet you at this last show, Ted. My first Philly show was as a teen in the early 80's when my father sold his shoebox of 51 Bowman dupes. I think he had 3 Mantles and 2 Mays in that box. Paid for the family vacation, and got me hooked. Had some great memories at the GW. It's been a long time since I can remember a show where you could hardly move in the aisles....." I enjoyed our conversation last weekend, great meeting you. Back in the 1980's at Willow Grove, I bought a large collection of 1951 Bowman's. Could they have been your Dad's ? Best regards, TED Z |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
Hey guys, it looks like a lot of Ner54er's are reading this thread. Let's continue to reminisce over some more Philly Show experiences
before this thread vanishes off the page. If I can find my scan, I'll chime in with my Richie Ashburn story. TED Z |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
At one Philly Seashore show, I had a nice conversation with Richie Ashburn. While he was signing this photo for me, I asked him if his 3.0 seconds to 1st
base was the fastest of any player in the Leagues ? He said...."No, Mickey Mantle (batting lefty) and I were clocked by the sports media at the start of each season, and we were tied at 3.0 seconds, year after year." Then we talked BB trivia for about 20 minutes. Richie was one of the greatest guys to talk with. <img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt113/zanted86/ashburnbunt.jpg" alt="[linked image]"> TED Z |
Who won the piece of carpeting from the Motor Lodge after the last show? I'm not sure if black mold was included or not...
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I promoted shows in suburban Chicago back in the 80's and 90's and since Piersall lived close by I had him signing at a card show one weekend. Piersall had everyone laughing as he was telling stories about his past and about some of the players that he knew and played with. A young girl, about 16 years old came up to him and said she loved playing baseball and softball and asked if he had any advice for her. Piersall looked directly into her eyes and said, "yeah I have advice...stay outta back seats." He signed her autograph, laughed hysterically as she walked away while the rest of us were just stunned that he would say something like that!! I still shake my head at that memory! |
Andrew
There is one thing you can bet on....that Jimmy Piersall's presence at a BB card show will be an interesting experience.
Regards, TED Z |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
There are many more Willow Grove stories to be told, here is one that I recall from the mid-1980's.
My table was next to John Broggi (who at that time operated two BB card shops and a monthly live auction in NJ). A guy came to my table first with a "walk-in" of 100's of really sharp Goudey's & Play Ball cards. I went thru every card and gave him a fair market value of his large collection. It was a lot of $$$$, and I really didn't want to pass this collection off to someone else. So, I turned to John Broggi, and we came to a joint agreement of an offer to this guy for his collection. The guy was happy with it. And, John and I spent the rest of the day dividing up the cards. We haggled over the Ruth's, Gehrig's, Joe DiMaggio's, and Ted William's....but, after several hours, we arrived at a mutually happy compromise. Hey guys, if you have anymore fond memories of this fantastic show....please share them here with us ? TED Z |
I never went to the show, so I have no memories, but you guys are certainly painting a fine image here!
It seems like it was a lot of fun. Thanks! |
Me too...
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As for the show, I didn't set up at it, didn't find anything to buy, but did see a lot of folks I knew so that was a plus. I would have liked to have been to it when Bob S was running it. Now, I do have one external type memory. Several years ago I got a call from Bob Schmeirer (sp?), the promoter, and he quizzed me about someone selling a table on this board. Mum was the word as it was a good friend that just couldn't make it and he wanted me to help. I hear Bob was a real stickler for his tables. I also heard he would walk around the room and say hi to the dealers and collectors and see how things were going. Maybe the new regime has a different agenda as I certainly didn't see any of that at the one show I went to. I guess the old times are a passin'? In today's new society it seems like most of the "service" is left out of "customer service". :( |
I also set up next to Ted Z (I live 15 mimutes from the GW Lodge in Willow Grove Lodge). In the 80's Chris Short of Wilmington, DE, and former Phillie pitcher in the 60's was a regular attendee of the show (he collected Phillies cards). At one of the shows he was talking of the GREAT PHILLIE FOLDUP IF 1964. Short's openion was the fold was entirely the fault of manager Gene Mauch (he pitched the staff's 2 aces Short and Jim Bunning so much during the last 2 weeks of the season that their arms were ready to fall off).
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teddy's collection
Leon,
great story. i bet ole TRex had some cards that would make the rest of us salivate!! Eating at the restaurant where you had your own key to let yourselves in and feast on home cooking makes me salivate even now! Reminds me of when i took a trip through Mayberry,NC and had an amazing feast of those yummy fried potatoes, as you so accurately describe them. Many thanks for sharing the Leon--Ted baseball card picnic! and Merry Christmas to you and to Ted and Charlotte as well. all the best, ole friends barry |
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This action reminds me of two memories in my past. I went to Penn State and played a lot of pick-up basketball with some football players. When talk would turn to Joe Paterno, I remember one player telling me this. Joe told them that whenever a person stops to talk or ask you for an autograph, stop and be very cordial. To you it may not be a big deal. To them, it may be the biggest deal that he or she could ever want. Piersall should have heard this. Also, I had the pleasure of talking with Kenny Stabler at the Chantilly show. He stopped, saw my name tag and addressed me by name and chatted with me for 10-15 minutes. The next time he came to Chantilly, I went up to him and told him the story and thanked him for being so nice. The Snake grabbed my arm and, in his southern drawl, said, "It isn't difficult to be nice." Jimmy Piersall should have done the same. I am sad to hear the Piersall story because so many other people have been wonderful. Brooks Robinson, Stan Musial and others come to mind. These are the people that I will recall in my memories. Cy |
Barry A and Leon L
Hey Leon
They still ask me at Fred's breakfast nook along the Delaware...."where is that friend of your's who orders Texas-size breakfasts ? " Wishing you, your wife, and daughter a very MERRY CHRISTMAS. Hey Barry Trust me, you don't want to compete with Leon in an eating contest :) Wishing you and Margaret a very MERRY CHRISTMAS. TED Z |
Although I never made it to the show, I am absolutely in love with this thread. The stories and memories are great and bring back memories of Holiday Inn shows in and around Cleveland when I was a kid.
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Hey Ted
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If I ever come back that way, and I guess I will in the future, we have to go there again. I think I am still full from that breakfast. I believe I had one of everything on the menu. The hospitality was as good, or better, than the food too!!! take care |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
Leon
You are always welcome to stay at the Hotel Zanidakis. The hotel rates are very reasonable. Needless to say, we will breakfast at Fred's diner. Many have chimed in here with some great stories. In 30 years of great experiences doing the Philly Show, I have only two regrets to tell you of. 1st....circa 1985 at Willow Grove, a customer of mine tells me to hurry over to table #154. The dealer there has six T206 cards with DRUM backs, and is selling them for only $100 apiece. It was Friday nite, things were quite busy. So, I did not get over to table #154 until Saturday morning. Sure enough, there were still 4 cards with DRUM backs. All 4 were Minor Lgrs. and the cards were VgEx. So, I offered the dealer $350 for all four. He said "no go". I deliberated for a few moments, then I walked back to my table. I remember rationalizing in my mind as I walked away...."no big deal, I already had a DRUM back". ......BIG, BIG MISTAKE...... 2nd....circa 1986 at Willow Grove, I always checked out Ron Oser's stuff. Ron would always show up with interesting and rare items. This time he had two 1948 Bowman George Mikan cards in Ex to ExMt condition. Mikan was the last card I needed to complete my 1948 Basket Ball set of 72 cards. Ron had each card priced at $40. So, I bought one. Ron offered me the 2nd Mikan for $35. Foolishly, I said...."let me think about it, Ron". The next day, I went back to Ron's table, but the 2nd Mikan was gone. ......VERY, VERY BIG MISTAKE...... Hey guys....what other investment in the past 25 years could you invest $40 in a colorful little piece of cardboard depicting a sports HOFer, that would now be worth $4000 ? Fortunately, those are my only two regrets at Philly. Unfortunately (in retrospect), in order to save $85 between these two deals, I lost big time. Anyone out there have similar stories ? If so, tell us of your "regret moments" ? ? TED Z |
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I am sure most people will not consider the failed CSA venture a Philly show, but I went to two, sold a bunch of stuff, and made some big trades with Ted. Will probably always regret trading the AB Gandil to him, but I know it make it to a nice home and I am proud to have contributed a card to Teds collection as he contributed quite a few to mine.
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Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
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We had a great time at those two Oaks (PA) shows....talkin' baseball, and doing two monster trades to help you complete your "Monster" set. I recall there were about 150 - T206's that I traded you, including Dahlen (Brooklyn). I will certainly miss that show. Incidently, that's a really neat site you have there regarding your 1941 Double Play cards. Best wishes good buddy, TED Z |
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Please email me. TED Z |
Philly Seashore Show
Hey guys,
How many of you set-up or attended the Ocean City Philly shows back in the 1980's (or early 1990's) ? Although it was a smaller show, it featured many of the quality dealers that set-up at the Willow Grove show. Furthermore, we were treated to a great Classic Car show that weekend. Model "A" Ford's to 1970's "heavy metal" machines paraded on Ocean City's huge boardwalk. I would pack my goodies into my 1960 T-Bird and drive to Ocean City for this affair and for setting-up at the show. Unfortunately, BB card shows are gradually vanishing into the sunset. But, it's always fun to reminisce. So, tell us some more of your Philly show experiences. http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/...ShowsTbird.jpg TED Z |
I'll try to get up scans
I have the admittance tickets to the second and third Epscc shows at spring garden college and the 4th show which was the first at the old George Washington. :) I have them currently in hand just need to scan at work tomorrow. I was lucky enough to have set up at a couple of those ocean city shows as well as the last 2 shows at George Washington, I was 18-19 at the time. Loved it back then loved it at the fort and when it came to my hometown of Reading. I hate it at valley forge and am not to fond of the new owner.
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Furthermore, has anyone here noticed ? Those were the days when Autographs were FREE. I'm surprised this has not been commented on. Hey Glyn I absolutely agree with you regarding the Willow Grove, Ocean City, Ft. Washington, and Reading Philly shows. TED Z |
Hello Theodore--
Do you remember when ex-fillie pitcher chris short would come to the EPSCC shows at the George Washington Lodge in Willow Grove as a collector? He told us the story of how he got back into card collecting as an adult. The house he lived in as a child in Wilmington, DE, was continuously family owned (his brother was living in the house). The brother called chris one day and said "I found our childhood card collection in the house. Do you want the cards or should I give them to the trashman?" Chris recovered the cards and resumed collecting. As an adult coming to card shows (by this time he was retired as a player) he was trying to collect all fillie cards (mostly from the 1950's) and we were able to help him reach his goal. One time chris had signed on to be an autograph guest at an EPSCC show on Saturday afternoon starting at 2 PM. He showed up first thing in the morning and the promoter thought there was a screw-up until chris said "I collect cards also and want to check out the inventory of your dealers before I'm scheduled to start signing the autographs." |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
Hey guys,
I thought that reviving this 4 year old thread in which many of us reminisced over the good ole Philly Shows would be a nice tribute to Bob Schmierer. And, for the newer Net54 collectors to gain an appreciation of one of the great BB card Shows ever in this hobby during the 1975 - 2008 era. Do chime in with any of your stories regarding the Spring Garden, Willow Grove, Fort Washington, Reading, and the Ocean City Philly shows. TED Z . |
Reflections on 30 years of the Philly Show
The site of the Willow Grove BB card Show......the George Washington Motor Lodge and Conference Center.
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...torLodgeVF.jpg TED Z . |
minor share
1) missing Bob Bostoff for the laughs and a couple of friends I met there.
2) miss the assortment of good cards (pre-1920) and obscure baseball "stuff". There are quite a few people from those days still involved in the hobby - some of whom are respected today ;)..... It was after not sleeping for 24 hours I drove myself to the show to consign an allen and ginter Indians banner (still one of the few items I haven't been able to replace) to Lifson. I carried another banner with me of Ginter's world decorations that I subsequently decided to give myself as a present instead of consigning. When I went outside I started to talk to someone and left the FRAMED banner on my trunk (quite a large sign). As I pulled out of the lot I heard a noise - turned around - didn't see anything and drove back to Brooklyn. No-one turned it in :-( |
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