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  #1  
Old 02-24-2011, 11:55 AM
shelly shelly is offline
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Default Ted Wiliams

I saw this ball and other items in Iconic Memorabilia Auction all the pieces that I questioned where authenticated by Justin Priddy. This is why third party opinions drive me crazy. Would love to know what you think.


ted williams.jpg
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  #2  
Old 02-24-2011, 12:04 PM
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Default Ted Williams

Open "D" and open "A" what a dead giveaway.
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  #3  
Old 02-24-2011, 01:20 PM
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Agree
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  #4  
Old 02-24-2011, 06:19 PM
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The T & the s are also very suspect
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  #5  
Old 02-24-2011, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenAge50s View Post
The T & the s are also very suspect
This ball is authentic. Don't let these clowns tell you otherwise. I am an expert in Ted Williams autographs and memorabilia. It's impossible to replicate that "T" and the D to W transition like that. This opened A nonsense is laughable. The guy can't sign his name exactly the same way every time. Regardless, Ted signed this ball. It's the Green Diamond photos you need to be wary of. John Henry Williams was a known forger of his father's signature and it's very difficult to pull it off on a ball as opposed to a flat photo.
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  #6  
Old 02-24-2011, 06:31 PM
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The auto looks fake to me as well....
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  #7  
Old 02-24-2011, 06:54 PM
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I like the first "i" in "Williams."

The second "i" I'm not so sure.

(Tongue firmly planted in cheek.)

Last edited by Rob D.; 02-24-2011 at 06:55 PM.
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  #8  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:25 PM
murphusa murphusa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquire View Post
This ball is authentic. Don't let these clowns tell you otherwise. I am an expert in Ted Williams autographs and memorabilia. It's impossible to replicate that "T" and the D to W transition like that. This opened A nonsense is laughable. The guy can't sign his name exactly the same way every time. Regardless, Ted signed this ball. It's the Green Diamond photos you need to be wary of. John Henry Williams was a known forger of his father's signature and it's very difficult to pull it off on a ball as opposed to a flat photo.

If I was a crook I would offer you a great deal on 3 baseballs just like the pictured one
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  #9  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
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If I was a crook I would offer you a great deal on 3 baseballs just like the pictured one
Prove it's a fake. You can't.

And yes, point taken. I can't prove the opposite.
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  #10  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:32 PM
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My max bid for this ball is five cents.
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  #11  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:43 PM
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Default I wouldn't buy it

I would have to agree with the "clowns" on this. Looks terrible IMO.
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  #12  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:46 PM
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He might be right, the "ball" may be authentic.
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  #13  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:50 PM
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Default pm sent

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquire View Post
Prove it's a fake. You can't.

And yes, point taken. I can't prove the opposite.
Pm sent....
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  #14  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:52 PM
murphusa murphusa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquire View Post
Prove it's a fake. You can't.

And yes, point taken. I can't prove the opposite.

I can express an opinion, from my experience with Ted Williams items I have seen, owned etc in over 50 years of collecting.

Mr. Williams signature, even after his strokes had a very natural flow to it. He did not use points as shown on the pictured example.

While this signer followed the structure of Mr. Williams flow in the bottom part of the signature, he did not do the same at the top of each letter.

This is due in part to hesitation in ones writting skills and in the split second that he had to think about what he was doing.

You can do the same at home, take a pen and paper and have someone give you a difficult word to write. One that you have to think about how it is spelled while you write it. Even in your own handwritting, you will hesitate when you have to think about it thus causing the same minipulation as in the signature pictured above. Sorry it's human nature


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Last edited by murphusa; 02-24-2011 at 07:54 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:55 PM
TheSquire TheSquire is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murphusa View Post
I can express an opinion, from my experience with Ted Williams items I have seen, owned etc in over 50 years of collecting.

Mr. Williams signature, even after his strokes had a very natural flow to it. He did not use points as shown on the pictured example.

While this signer followed the structure of Mr. Williams flow in the bottom part of the signature, he did not do the same at the top of each letter.

This is due in part to hesitation in ones writting skills and in the split second that he had to think about what he was doing.

You can do the same at home, take a pen and paper and have someone give you a difficult word to write. One that you have to think about how it is spelled. Even in your own handwritting, you will hesitate when you have to think about it thus causing the same minipulation as in the signature pictured above. Sorry it's human nature
With all due respect, there is nothing in the above statement that gives your opinion any credibilty. All you're telling me is how a person can forge a signature. So what? The T and the S are impeccable exemplars of an authentic Ted sig. Again, everyone wants a player to sign exactly the same way every single time and it's impossible. That's human nature.
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  #16  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murphusa View Post
I can express an opinion, from my experience with Mr. Williams signature, even after his strokes had a very natural flow to it. He did not use points as shown on the pictured example.

Jim Murphy
Philadelphia Bat Company
Jim, I'm sorry, but this is a ludicrous statement. I personally saw Ted sign photographs, flat items after his stroke and I saw nothing that would represent a signature anywhere close to a 6 or 7 in grade.
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  #17  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:58 PM
murphusa murphusa is offline
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you are right no one can do the same one everytime but the sturcture remain constant

And the structure is not consistant with an authentic Ted Williams signature in my opinion

Jim Murphy
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  #18  
Old 02-24-2011, 07:59 PM
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Ted Williams Autograph.jpg

Real or fake?
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  #19  
Old 02-24-2011, 08:03 PM
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Pm sent....
You can disregard my PM now......thanks
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  #20  
Old 02-24-2011, 08:11 PM
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I would stay clear of the ball as it full of differences from known true samples in my collection.
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  #21  
Old 02-24-2011, 08:16 PM
murphusa murphusa is offline
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Is it fake or real,



I'll follow up as if I were you.

Did you see Ted sign the item?

Or are you relying on someones opinion?
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  #22  
Old 02-24-2011, 08:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murphusa View Post
Is it fake or real,



I'll follow up as if I were you.

Did you see Ted sign the item?

Or are you relying on someones opinion?
You're right. We're ALL relying on someone's opinion. Unless you saw the guy sign it, you cannot lay your head on your pillow at night with 100% certainty. You just can't.
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  #23  
Old 02-24-2011, 08:23 PM
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Default TheSquire

TheSquire won't be posting anymore in this thread per having to have a full name out in public. He would rather not have his name in lights so it's his choice. No one can have debates and (even friendly) arguments on the board without having their name by their post. For the record I am done asking folks to cooperate and am putting their names in their sig lines when they don't adhere to the privacy rules. Forewarned is fair warned. regards
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  #24  
Old 02-24-2011, 09:27 PM
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I think the WU telegram is real--just an earlier Ted. Much better flow than the fake baseball!
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Last edited by GoldenAge50s; 02-24-2011 at 09:31 PM.
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  #25  
Old 02-24-2011, 10:12 PM
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I gotta say I have to laugh at a self proclaimed "expert on Ted Williams" guy who won't even put his name out there.
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  #26  
Old 02-25-2011, 08:35 PM
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http://cgi.ebay.com/TED-WILLIAMS-Sig...item1c19b0be6d

So, this one has been authenticated, but all the armchair experts here are calling the one in question fake? This is the number one reason I do not collect autographs. No one knows what they're talking about.
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  #27  
Old 02-25-2011, 09:39 PM
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I hate to let steam out of your engine Squire, but I do not see any similarities to the ball the was shown by the OP. The points that were made about the open ended "d" and "a" in the suspected forgery, bears no similarities to the JSA Certed Williams you referenced amongst a couple of other points that even I can tell.

I don't claim to be an “armchair expert”, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn once.

BTW, squire, why the need to remain anonymous, who cares, post your name already... this is a great discussion and maybe we can all learn something. FUDD

Last edited by Fuddjcal; 02-25-2011 at 09:40 PM.
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  #28  
Old 02-26-2011, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuddjcal View Post

BTW, squire, why the need to remain anonymous, who cares, post your name already... this is a great discussion and maybe we can all learn something. FUDD
At one point he had it on there, don't know why he removed it unless it was fake?
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  #29  
Old 02-26-2011, 05:45 AM
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Quote:
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I hate to let steam out of your engine Squire, but I do not see any similarities to the ball the was shown by the OP. The points that were made about the open ended "d" and "a" in the suspected forgery, bears no similarities to the JSA Certed Williams you referenced amongst a couple of other points that even I can tell.
. FUDD
And The "T" and "s" of the one in question are perfect in comparison to other authentic Ted autographs, but you're going to base it off of an opened "d" and "a"?? Then we're even, I guess !! What you're saying is that it was impossible for Williams to have ever once signed a ball like that and I contend that his autograph can look very different in many different examples. I do agree that the flow in "Williams is not fluid, but again, it's not a guilty verdict by any stretch. There a thousand bogus Williams auto's all over ebay that a dead person could spot a mile away, but this one is not an example.
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  #30  
Old 02-26-2011, 06:33 AM
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Default Open Ended

I wonder if he signs his own name open ended as well. Ban him, and move on. Kyle Barniak, member
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  #31  
Old 02-26-2011, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
TheSquire won't be posting anymore in this thread per having to have a full name out in public. He would rather not have his name in lights so it's his choice. No one can have debates and (even friendly) arguments on the board without having their name by their post. For the record I am done asking folks to cooperate and am putting their names in their sig lines when they don't adhere to the privacy rules. Forewarned is fair warned. regards
I thought Leon already banned him from this thread???
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  #32  
Old 02-26-2011, 08:18 AM
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Default Me Too

+1, with open ended letters...LOL
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  #33  
Old 02-26-2011, 09:53 AM
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When I saw the ball I imediately thought fake. I thought of a book I have
that had a pic of 12 ted signed baseballs with half being fake. The ball in the first post looks identical to the fake BB's in that photograph.

As far as 3rd party stuff goes, what works well for me is not declaring something as good or bad, but asking myself the question,"would I feel comfortable spending my money on this item?"

bottom line- DO YOUR HOMEWORK!
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  #34  
Old 02-26-2011, 09:57 AM
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I have often wondered about the authenticity of my Ted Williams photo. What do you guys think?
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File Type: jpg TedWilliamsSignedPhotograph.jpg (59.8 KB, 339 views)
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  #35  
Old 02-26-2011, 10:20 AM
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Here is as good as you can get for Ted Williams,,, after a friend and I spent one amazing hour with him in Florida, he signed two photos for me.
Here is one of them.
Listening to the stories he told us were the highlight of all my years in this hobby.
I should not fail to mention that on this trip we spent about eight hours with Monte Irvin, taking him to lunch and dinner. He signed about 20 original news photographs for me and told me the story behind each one of them.
To this day it is still one of the best days of my life.
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Last edited by RichardSimon; 02-26-2011 at 10:32 AM.
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  #36  
Old 02-26-2011, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jb217676 View Post
I have often wondered about the authenticity of my Ted Williams photo. What do you guys think?
I know I was banned, but I'm sorry to say that this is fake. Leon, go ahead and put my name back up if you want.
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  #37  
Old 02-26-2011, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardSimon View Post
Here is as good as you can get for Ted Williams,,, after a friend and I spent one amazing hour with him in Florida, he signed two photos for me.
Here is one of them.
The stories he told us were the highlight of all my years in this hobby.
This is fantastic.
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  #38  
Old 02-26-2011, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardSimon View Post
Here is as good as you can get for Ted Williams,,, after a friend and I spent one amazing hour with him in Florida, he signed two photos for me.
Here is one of them.
The stories he told us were the highlight of all my years in this hobby.
Although not personally, Ted Williams had an influence on my hobby experience. My Uncle had the opportunity to interview him and spend a weekend fishing with him at his Canadian camp in the mid 80s. In the off camera footage he opened up about baseball and made fun of my Uncles O's hat-a great treasure for our family......
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  #39  
Old 02-27-2011, 11:37 AM
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The open D and open A where part of thousands of balls sold on shop at home. I can tell you that B and J supplied them along with Howards and Madison Sports. The ball sold for $133 nice deal for someone. The shame of it all is that it was not authentic.
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  #40  
Old 02-27-2011, 07:17 PM
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Default You weren't banned....

Quote:
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I know I was banned, but I'm sorry to say that this is fake. Leon, go ahead and put my name back up if you want.
You weren't banned. You were asked to either put your name by your posts or not get into hot debates. That is all. It was not personal at all. It is just the rule. You would want to know who you are arguing with (even if just a friendly argument) so others would too. Thanks for putting your name up there. I really don't care what people (or you) say, too much, they just need to be known. take care and thanks again....
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  #41  
Old 02-28-2011, 10:18 PM
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Auction co. uses primarily JSA and PSA/DNA, so then why did ACE authenticate this?

I wonder what JSA and/or PSA/DNA thought of it? :-)

Hmmm...

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  #42  
Old 05-07-2011, 07:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquire View Post
It's the Green Diamond photos you need to be wary of. John Henry Williams was a known forger of his father's signature and it's very difficult to pull it off on a ball as opposed to a flat photo.
Sorry to dredge up this old thread, but I was wondering if anyone had any more info on the Green Diamond photos as mentioned above.

I've heard this rumor as well, but I have no idea if that's all it is or has anyone ever uncovered any actual evidence showing John Henry forged his father's signature?

Last edited by Mr. Zipper; 05-07-2011 at 07:16 PM.
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