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  #1  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:00 AM
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KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BicycleSpokes View Post
How about Black Sox (Cicotte, Gandil)?

Sent from my SM-J510FN using Tapatalk
I actually have Cicotte, Gandil, and Burns. I believe those are the only 3 in the T206 set connected to the Black Sox, with Cicotte and Gandil obviously being more heavily involved.

I should mention what else I have target or completed for subsets.

- Cleveland Team Set
- Hal Chase w/ Trophy, Tinker/Evers/Chance (still need Chance), Fred Merkle (need Throwing pose)
- Horizontals
- Cards w/ Building or Ballparks in the background
- Cards showing Catcher's Gear
- Backs
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- Hall of Famers
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Needs: T207 Anonymous Factory 25 Back, 1914 New York Evening Sun Supplements, 1917 D328 Weil Baking Co., and (possibly) 1917 Merchant's Bakery

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- Cleveland Indians Franchise Hall of Fame

Last edited by KMayUSA6060; 09-08-2017 at 08:00 AM.
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  #2  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KMayUSA6060 View Post
I believe those are the only 3 in the T206 set connected to the Black Sox, with Cicotte and Gandil obviously being more heavily involved.
Don't forget about Heinie Zimmermann...


Zimmerman was suspended from the New York Giants in 1919, along with his friend Hal Chase, for allegedly attempting to convince other players to fix games. Based on testimony by Giants manager John McGraw during the Black Sox Scandal hearings, Zimmerman and Chase were both indicted for bribery. Zimmerman denied McGraw's accusations, and neither he nor Chase was ever proven to be directly connected to the Black Sox, but based on a long-term pattern of corruption both were permanently banned from baseball by Judge Kenesaw Mountain Landis, Commissioner of Baseball. According to some historians, he had been informally banned after the Giants released him. Baseball statistician Bill James has suggested that the Giants' loss to the Chicago White Sox in the 1917 World Series may have been partial motivation for Zimmerman's suspension. Zimmerman batted .120 in the Series.

However, he is best known for an infamous rundown in the decisive game. In the fourth inning, the game was scoreless when Chicago's Eddie Collins was caught between third base and home plate. Catcher Bill Rariden ran up the line to start a rundown, expecting pitcher Rube Benton or first baseman Walter Holke to cover the plate. However, neither of them budged, and Collins blew past Rariden to score what turned out to be the Series-winning run (the White Sox won 4-2). With no one covering the plate, third baseman Zimmerman was forced to chase Collins, pawing helplessly in the air with the ball in a futile attempt to tag him. As pointed out by researcher Richard A. Smiley in SABR's 2006 edition of The National Pastime, Zimmerman was long blamed for losing the game, although McGraw blamed Benton and Holke for failing to cover the plate—a serious fundamental error in baseball. The play was actually quite close, as action photos show Zimmerman leaping over the sliding Collins. A quote often attributed to Zim, but actually invented by writer Ring Lardner some years later, was that when asked about the incident Zim replied, "Who the hell was I supposed to throw to, Klem (umpire Bill Klem, who was working the plate)?"
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Last edited by T206Collector; 09-08-2017 at 08:08 AM.
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  #3  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:10 AM
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KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T206Collector View Post
Don't forget about Heinie Zimmermann...


Zimmerman was suspended from the New York Giants in 1919, along with his friend Hal Chase, for allegedly attempting to convince other players to fix games. Based on testimony by Giants manager John McGraw during the Black Sox Scandal hearings, Zimmerman and Chase were both indicted for bribery. Zimmerman denied McGraw's accusations, and neither he nor Chase was ever proven to be directly connected to the Black Sox, but based on a long-term pattern of corruption both were permanently banned from baseball by Judge Kenesaw Mountain Landis, Commissioner of Baseball. According to some historians, he had been informally banned after the Giants released him. Baseball statistician Bill James has suggested that the Giants' loss to the Chicago White Sox in the 1917 World Series may have been partial motivation for Zimmerman's suspension. Zimmerman batted .120 in the Series.

However, he is best known for an infamous rundown in the decisive game. In the fourth inning, the game was scoreless when Chicago's Eddie Collins was caught between third base and home plate. Catcher Bill Rariden ran up the line to start a rundown, expecting pitcher Rube Benton or first baseman Walter Holke to cover the plate. However, neither of them budged, and Collins blew past Rariden to score what turned out to be the Series-winning run (the White Sox won 4-2). With no one covering the plate, third baseman Zimmerman was forced to chase Collins, pawing helplessly in the air with the ball in a futile attempt to tag him. As pointed out by researcher Richard A. Smiley in SABR's 2006 edition of The National Pastime, Zimmerman was long blamed for losing the game, although McGraw blamed Benton and Holke for failing to cover the plate—a serious fundamental error in baseball. The play was actually quite close, as action photos show Zimmerman leaping over the sliding Collins. A quote often attributed to Zim, but actually invented by writer Ring Lardner some years later, was that when asked about the incident Zim replied, "Who the hell was I supposed to throw to, Klem (umpire Bill Klem, who was working the plate)?"
Fantastic stuff. This is what I'm looking for. I will add the rest of the Chase poses and Zimmerman to my Black Sox list. Thank you!
__________________
Need a spreadsheet to help track your set, player run, or collection? Check out Sheets4Collectors on Etsy.
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- Hall of Famers
Progress: 318/340 (93.53%)

- Grover Hartley PC
Needs: T207 Anonymous Factory 25 Back, 1914 New York Evening Sun Supplements, 1917 D328 Weil Baking Co., and (possibly) 1917 Merchant's Bakery

- Jim Thome PC

- Cleveland Indians Franchise Hall of Fame
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  #4  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:33 AM
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Rhotchkiss Rhotchkiss is offline
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What about color variations on portrait backgrounds, or just portrait backgrounds (all the green, all the red, all the yellow, etc.).
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  #5  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:41 AM
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KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss View Post
What about color variations on portrait backgrounds, or just portrait backgrounds (all the green, all the red, all the yellow, etc.).
I actually only like a few of the portraits in the set, 1 of which (Green Cobb) isn't affordable to me anymore, and the other (Cy Young) is becoming increasingly difficult to afford.
__________________
Need a spreadsheet to help track your set, player run, or collection? Check out Sheets4Collectors on Etsy.
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- Hall of Famers
Progress: 318/340 (93.53%)

- Grover Hartley PC
Needs: T207 Anonymous Factory 25 Back, 1914 New York Evening Sun Supplements, 1917 D328 Weil Baking Co., and (possibly) 1917 Merchant's Bakery

- Jim Thome PC

- Cleveland Indians Franchise Hall of Fame
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  #6  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:48 AM
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trdcrdkid trdcrdkid is offline
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How about minor league Hall of Famers (Beckley, Jimmy Collins, Kelley, McGinnity)?
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  #7  
Old 09-08-2017, 08:56 AM
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KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trdcrdkid View Post
How about minor league Hall of Famers (Beckley, Jimmy Collins, Kelley, McGinnity)?
I didn't include that in my list, but I'm also targeting all Hall of Famers.
__________________
Need a spreadsheet to help track your set, player run, or collection? Check out Sheets4Collectors on Etsy.
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- Hall of Famers
Progress: 318/340 (93.53%)

- Grover Hartley PC
Needs: T207 Anonymous Factory 25 Back, 1914 New York Evening Sun Supplements, 1917 D328 Weil Baking Co., and (possibly) 1917 Merchant's Bakery

- Jim Thome PC

- Cleveland Indians Franchise Hall of Fame
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  #8  
Old 09-11-2017, 07:57 PM
bbcard1 bbcard1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KMayUSA6060 View Post
Fantastic stuff. This is what I'm looking for. I will add the rest of the Chase poses and Zimmerman to my Black Sox list. Thank you!
Also add Peaches Graham (known as Billy Maharg, Graham spelled backwards) in his role in the scandal:

1919 Chicago Black Sox scandal[edit]
Maharg's third connection with major league baseball came in 1919 as he conspired to fix the 1919 World Series—the infamous Black Sox Scandal. Several White Sox players, including Eddie Cicotte, Chick Gandil, and Swede Risberg, conspired with Sleepy Bill Burns, a former big-league pitcher, to throw the World Series in exchange for $100,000. Billy Maharg worked with Burns to find financing. Maharg and Burns approached New York gambler Arnold Rothstein to raise the money for the players. Other gamblers soon entered the picture, whereupon the players, Maharg and Burns suffered multiple double-crosses. The White Sox did in fact lose the Series.

In September 1920, a disgruntled Maharg gave the full details of the plot to a Philadelphia writer. Eight White Sox players were indicted for throwing the Series. When Maharg was called as a witness in the criminal trial, someone noted, “He flashed enough diamonds on his fingers to buy a flock of autos.” Maharg was asked, “Are you a ballplayer named “Peaches Graham?” The answer was, “No! I have never been anything but Billy Maharg. I know Graham, but I am not he.” (It has long been believed that Maharg's real name was Graham, or Maharg spelled backwards.)

The Chicago jury found the eight players not guilty, and Maharg celebrated with the players afterward. All eight were subsequently banned from baseball for life by Commissioner Kenesaw Mountain Landis.

Three of the former players implicated in the Black Sox Scandal were members of the 1912 Detroit Tigers: Sleepy Bill Burns and Jean Dubuc were both pitchers for the 1912 Tigers, and Maharg was one of the 1912 replacement Tigers.

Actor Richard Edson played the part of Maharg in John Sayles' 1988 film Eight Men Out.
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  #9  
Old 09-11-2017, 09:12 PM
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rats60 rats60 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbcard1 View Post
Also add Peaches Graham (known as Billy Maharg, Graham spelled backwards) in his role in the scandal:

1919 Chicago Black Sox scandal[edit]
Maharg's third connection with major league baseball came in 1919 as he conspired to fix the 1919 World Series—the infamous Black Sox Scandal. Several White Sox players, including Eddie Cicotte, Chick Gandil, and Swede Risberg, conspired with Sleepy Bill Burns, a former big-league pitcher, to throw the World Series in exchange for $100,000. Billy Maharg worked with Burns to find financing. Maharg and Burns approached New York gambler Arnold Rothstein to raise the money for the players. Other gamblers soon entered the picture, whereupon the players, Maharg and Burns suffered multiple double-crosses. The White Sox did in fact lose the Series.

In September 1920, a disgruntled Maharg gave the full details of the plot to a Philadelphia writer. Eight White Sox players were indicted for throwing the Series. When Maharg was called as a witness in the criminal trial, someone noted, “He flashed enough diamonds on his fingers to buy a flock of autos.” Maharg was asked, “Are you a ballplayer named “Peaches Graham?” The answer was, “No! I have never been anything but Billy Maharg. I know Graham, but I am not he.” (It has long been believed that Maharg's real name was Graham, or Maharg spelled backwards.)

The Chicago jury found the eight players not guilty, and Maharg celebrated with the players afterward. All eight were subsequently banned from baseball for life by Commissioner Kenesaw Mountain Landis.

Three of the former players implicated in the Black Sox Scandal were members of the 1912 Detroit Tigers: Sleepy Bill Burns and Jean Dubuc were both pitchers for the 1912 Tigers, and Maharg was one of the 1912 replacement Tigers.

Actor Richard Edson played the part of Maharg in John Sayles' 1988 film Eight Men Out.

George "Peaches" Graham and Billy Graham aka Maharg were two different people.
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  #10  
Old 09-12-2017, 08:43 AM
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mybuddyinc mybuddyinc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rats60 View Post
George "Peaches" Graham and Billy Graham aka Maharg were two different people.
Correct, two different people.

Peaches Graham played Baseball 1902-1912.

Billy Maharg (Graham) was a "local club boxer" 1901-1907.

He is Maharg's boxing record:

http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/125064

Officially he was 4-1-4. But if you add up all his fights he was 45-11-8. Any fight with NWS after result means "Newspaper decision." Basically some newspaper reporter would render a decision in his paper the morning after fight (mainly for the appeasement of bets). As you can see, he mainly fought in local Philadelphia Athletic Clubs.

He was pretty much a bum.
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  #11  
Old 09-12-2017, 09:46 AM
glenv glenv is offline
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Lena Blackburne - found a mud (Lena Blackburne Rubbing Mud) used to treat baseballs that continues to be used to this day.
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