Newbie Needing Some Help

[Mattg]

Hi everyone, love the site and the community! Just getting my feet wet with pre-WWII cards and need some help identifying the attached strip cards. The backs are blank, and the grading company I have never heard of (no surprise there). I have only managed to find one other image/example of the Mathewson card, nothing on the Wagner. The Mathewson card was slabbed by the same ESA company... Provides me more than enough suspicion, but I thought I'd reach out and see if anyone recognized the cards. Thanks

[Snapolit1]

I couldn't run away fast enough from those ESA slabs.

[Leon]

They look like very poor reprints from a bad grading company....sorry to say.

They are Novelty Cutlery postcard knock offs...

[Mattg]

Ha ha ha! Yeah I wasn't convinced of that company either! Thanks Steve

Thanks Leon, just what I needed to hear! Appreciate the help!

[Leon]

Woops, a close but no banana for me. I was thinking the name was in the wrong place...try the series PC796 instead, sorry about that...same conclusion unfortunately.

Originally Posted by Mattg

Ha ha ha! Yeah I wasn't convinced of that company either! Thanks Steve

Thanks Leon, just what I needed to hear! Appreciate the help!

[Mattg]

I see, a crude reprint of a postcard. Wow! Thanks again for the quick help!

[jb217676]

Who is selling these? You should notify the authorities and have them arrested on the spot!

[Mattg]

It's an antique/junk store I frequent. I've been hassling the guy for a year or more to see all his cards. He says he has millions in storage. Says he has stuff from 1900s to today. These were a couple he pulled out for me. But now I have a feeling for what might be buried in storage. Thanks

[Leon]

He probably got them him from his grandfather. It seems grandfathers always collected fakes and reprints. He usually kept them in the attic too.

Originally Posted by Mattg

It's an antique/junk store I frequent. I've been hassling the guy for a year or more to see all his cards. He says he has millions in storage. Says he has stuff from 1900s to today. These were a couple he pulled out for me. But now I have a feeling for what might be buried in storage. Thanks

[Nunzio11]

I'm definitely no expert but I love how the card type on the slab is described as "sepia" as if the photographer/manufacturer had the choice in 1909. "Hey Honus, we'll take the first picture in sepia and the second we'll make into a refractor". 😀

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by Mattg

It's an antique/junk store I frequent. I've been hassling the guy for a year or more to see all his cards. He says he has millions in storage. Says he has stuff from 1900s to today. These were a couple he pulled out for me. But now I have a feeling for what might be buried in storage. Thanks

Odd that he has the balls to charge serious money for these, instead of $5 or $10. Perhaps he doesn't have a clue. But those price stickers aren't from his attic.

[philliesfan]

Should have a decimal point after the 2.

[Jewish-collector]

I would pay $3 - $5 for those. That wouldn't be overpaying would it ?

[ValKehl]

Hate to say it, but my gut feeling is these are cutouts from a magazine or other publication.

[Mattg]

@Nunzio11: HA! So very true. Looking forward to sharing this information with my junk dealer. Probably won't score me any points to see what else he has, he doesn't like to be told that his junk is JUNK.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Mattg

@Nunzio11: HA! So very true. Looking forward to sharing this information with my junk dealer. Probably won't score me any points to see what else he has, he doesn't like to be told that his junk is JUNK.

Just for a different opinion I would NEVER handle it this way. Why antagonize the guy? Just to prove you are smarter? the possibility exists, slim though it may be, that he has real stuff stashed away along with the bogus. He may not even know the difference. I would probably say something like those are cool, but I'm looking for more mainstream stuff like Tobacco, Caramel or Goudey.

Then If he produces another round of fakes maybe go to the cops, at least warn any friends in the area, but why say anything to the seller? At that point you're just alerting him that someone is on to him.

[TUM301]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Just for a different opinion I would NEVER handle it this way. Why antagonize the guy? Just to prove you are smarter? the possibility exists, slim though it may be, that he has real stuff stashed away along with the bogus. He may not even know the difference. I would probably say something like those are cool, but I'm looking for more mainstream stuff like Tobacco, Caramel or Goudey.

Then If he produces another round of fakes maybe go to the cops, at least warn any friends in the area, but why say anything to the seller? At that point you're just alerting him that someone is on to him.

+ 1, Exactly what I was thinking. Not what I was looking for but happy to see the rest of items, etc.

[Mattg]

Gentlemen, I agree, if he was rational, but he isn't. Everything is covered in gold in his shop. I'm taking the approach of wearing him down and by appearing as the expert. If I come across something fantastic and amazing that doesn't interest me, I want to be able to tell him that it is something special ... be the trusted advisor/expert. Get him to ASK me to see his stuff. I'm not trying to antagonize him, but rather enlighten him with the truth. But as I said, he's a delicate flower, he doesn't appreciate cards or collectors - thinks they are all out to steal a piece of his gold. I'm not brazen enough to walk in and tell him he has newspaper clippings, but I do want him to recognize my expertise and his unfounded belief that everything old and baseball is worth the US Mint.

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by Mattg

Gentlemen, I agree, if he was rational, but he isn't. Everything is covered in gold in his shop. I'm taking the approach of wearing him down and by appearing as the expert. If I come across something fantastic and amazing that doesn't interest me, I want to be able to tell him that it is something special ... be the trusted advisor/expert. Get him to ASK me to see his stuff. I'm not trying to antagonize him, but rather enlighten him with the truth. But as I said, he's a delicate flower, he doesn't appreciate cards or collectors - thinks they are all out to steal a piece of his gold. I'm not brazen enough to walk in and tell him he has newspaper clippings, but I do want him to recognize my expertise and his unfounded belief that everything old and baseball is worth the US Mint.

I think you are leaving out the other option, that he is purposefully throwing these cards out looking for a rube and hoping to set the hook on a bite at these prices. He has not had these cards long at all as they are ESA crap and there is a holo flipped PSA card underneath. I would not try to play the expert card when in all likelihood he bought those for less than 5 bucks and put them out to test you. By even acting interested enough to take a photo and ask questions about a three dollar bill, you have already shown your cards. Walking up and playing the expert is now not going to help.

Just look at what he has and don't buy without researching because in selling these cards he has shown his hand also...he's waiting for a sucker.

Don't take this the wrong way, I am just trying to help.

[Mattg]

Yes, Justin, I suppose that's a possibility, but the few cards that I have bought (modern filler cards) is an exploration of the current highest eBay asking price. This guy claims to know all but insists on looking up every single card: common, star, garbage... And condition is meaningless. He is afraid that he is giving something away. I'm not trying to scam the guy, just want to see what he has. Maybe it's a losing battle, but if I can get a peek at what he claims and there is one box full of goodies, it will all be worth it

[Jewish-collector]

Matt,
Let's say you wanted them at a few dollars a piece just to have as reprints. What would he say if you went in there and said, "You and I both know they're fake, but I'll tell you what I'm going to do. I'm going to pay you what you paid, because sometimes you gotta say WTF"

What would he honestly do ?

[nat]

People who are selling things are not usually quick to hide their goods. The junk shop dealer selling crap for $300 and who is hesitant to show you the rest of the cards that he has for sale? Something here is fishy, and at the very least it is more trouble than it's worth. I'd stay away. If you're looking for nice vintage cards, you can get them on BST here, and if you know what you're doing you can head over to eBay. But not going back to a junk shop selling junk sounds like a pretty smart move.

[Mattg]

Originally Posted by Jewish-collector

Matt,
Let's say you wanted them at a few dollars a piece just to have as reprints. What would he say if you went in there and said, "You and I both know they're fake, but I'll tell you what I'm going to do. I'm going to pay you what you paid, because sometimes you gotta say WTF"

What would he honestly do ?

I'm not sure... I'll give it a shot and see what happens. The shop doesn't open again until Thursday. I'll give you (and everyone else) an update then.

[Mattg]

Originally Posted by nat

People who are selling things are not usually quick to hide their goods. The junk shop dealer selling crap for $300 and who is hesitant to show you the rest of the cards that he has for sale? Something here is fishy, and at the very least it is more trouble than it's worth. I'd stay away. If you're looking for nice vintage cards, you can get them on BST here, and if you know what you're doing you can head over to eBay. But not going back to a junk shop selling junk sounds like a pretty smart move.

I guess I'm a glutton for the punishment. I can't help but think what could be hidden away in the 10(!) storage lockers he has. Says he has over 4.5 million cards. I have seen one locker, I did get to explore the first ten feet or so of it. It was a 40 foot deep unit. Cards as far back as 1971 (both baseball and football only, no other sport...) were uncovered. They were not in the most desirable condition however.

His main store has stuff piled on top of other stuff. If he has as many cards as he says, he just has no room to show them. I'll take a picture of the place to share.