Joseph M Pankiewicz, you are a disgrace to this hobby!

[vintagetoppsguy]

Thread created for future Google searches...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=155402

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=174512

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=174534

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Thread created for future Google searches...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=155402

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=174512

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=174534

Well, THAT was some interesting morning reading!!

And more than a tad depressing.

[nsaddict]

Seems like this Joseph guy has some nice items at auction, click on auction links. Darn I missed bidding on that 1961 Topps complete set. I used to love watching Groucho on You Bet Your Life, today's phrase is "screen capture". I was a decent cross country runner in high school living in Passiac. I was dating this girl from Cedar Grove and my best time for the 8 mile run was 44:48, anyone impressed?

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Josep...18125758251089

[Peter_Spaeth]

It just goes to show that even low grade cards can be altered, improved, whatever word you like.

[D.P.Johnson]

One of you old school Jersey guy's needs to "Go find Joey and do him up"...

[t206fix]

Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson

One of you old school Jersey guy's needs to "Go find Joey and do him up"...

I think that "Joey" is the old school Jersey guy.... I think this thing runs deep - maybe even Tony Soprano has his hand in it...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It just goes to show that even low grade cards can be altered, improved, whatever word you like.

I am not sure anyone ever said they can't be. I think the term I have used is something like "more prevalent"... in high grade cards. Even that is debateable but that would be my assumption due to many factors.

[nsaddict]

This guy must have a passion for the hobby, according to his facebook page he is a grader at SGC!

https://www.facebook.com/joe.pankiewicz

[4815162342]

Increasing grading fees was mentioned earlier. I believe that a new pricing structure is in order. The fee to grade one of my Ryne Sandberg rookies should not be equal to the fee charged to grade one of my E105s. CPAs (are supposed to) charge tax preparation fees based upon the difficulty of the return. Insurance cost is determined by several factors. Why is grading not priced similarly?

[tribefan]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

Increasing grading fees was mentioned earlier. I believe that a new pricing structure is in order. The fee to grade one of my Ryne Sandberg rookies should not be equal to the fee charged to grade one of my E105s. CPAs (are supposed to) charge tax preparation fees based upon the difficulty of the return. Insurance cost is determined by several factors. Why is grading not priced similarly?

It is, to a degree. PSA charges more to grade a $1000 card than a $100 card. The $5 grading fees being referenced are only for sub $100 cards, or so they state. Maybe the big guys get a different break.

The card doctors will always be one step ahead of the authenticator, much like the PED users are one step ahead of the enforcers.

[conor912]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

Increasing grading fees was mentioned earlier. I believe that a new pricing structure is in order. The fee to grade one of my Ryne Sandberg rookies should not be equal to the fee charged to grade one of my E105s. CPAs (are supposed to) charge tax preparation fees based upon the difficulty of the return. Insurance cost is determined by several factors. Why is grading not priced similarly?

Because, in theory, they spend as much time grading and authenticating a $5 cards as they do a $500. In their minds, same amount of work for each card = same grading fee for each card.

[WhenItWasAHobby]

From PSA's website:

The Advantages of PSA Grading

PSA provides expert analysis and protection for your collectibles. Using state-of-the-art, proprietary methods, the hobby's most astute and knowledgeable grading experts render carefully considered, unbiased third-party opinions of grade. When you see a card/ticket in a holder displaying the PSA logo, you can be confident that the card/ticket has been properly authenticated and graded by the experts at Professional Sports Authenticator (PSA). These are some of the attributes that have made PSA the largest and most respected third-party grading and authentication service in the world.

http://www.psacard.com/About/WhyPSA

I highlighted the word "confident" because the foundation of any con game is confidence. When people like myself have openly complained about doctored cards getting past the graders with credible proof, PSA has taken a very aggressive adversarial position against myself and others such as banning us from their message boards and club memberships and nothing has obviously been done to address the problem.

At what point does proven incompetence with no diligent attempt fix the problem encroach actions of fraud? What about causes of action such as gross negligence for failing to fix a problem that you are aware of or unjust enrichment which is unjustly profiting from fraud? As I've said many times before, you don't have to have purchased a doctored card to be a victim; card doctoring devalues good cards by artificially inflating the supply of the same cards.

[D.P.Johnson]

I wonder if the people who've recently bought these altered cards are aware they've been altered??? If not, it wouldn't be too difficult to let them know.
I'm sure some of them won't be too happy knowing the card they just spent thousands of dollars on was recently altered by "Joe", and if they ever attempt to resell it knowing it's been altered, they could be also be held liable. I also think if PSA and/or SGC keeps letting "Joe" submit cards after knowing he has purposely altered them in the past, and another one of them "accidently" slips by their graders...well...let's just say I hope they have good attorneys. Perhaps a class action lawsuit is in order...

[Peter_Spaeth]

A class action lawsuit sounds like a great idea. I just have four questions for you and I'll get right to work on it. Who should be our named plaintiff? How should we define the class? Who should we sue? And what should we sue them for?

[thehoodedcoder]

are you an attorney?

kevin

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

A class action lawsuit sounds like a great idea. I just have four questions for you and I'll get right to work on it. Who should be our named plaintiff? How should we define the class? Who should we sue? And what should we sue them for?

Peter,

The similarly situated plaintiffs should be lining up.

Best,

Eric

[pepis]

Originally Posted by WhenItWasAHobby

From PSA's website:

The Advantages of PSA Grading

PSA provides expert analysis and protection for your collectibles. Using state-of-the-art, proprietary methods, the hobby's most astute and knowledgeable grading experts render carefully considered, unbiased third-party opinions of grade. When you see a card/ticket in a holder displaying the PSA logo, you can be confident that the card/ticket has been properly authenticated and graded by the experts at Professional Sports Authenticator (PSA). These are some of the attributes that have made PSA the largest and most respected third-party grading and authentication service in the world.

http://www.psacard.com/About/WhyPSA

I highlighted the word "confident" because the foundation of any con game is confidence. When people like myself have openly complained about doctored cards getting past the graders with credible proof, PSA has taken a very aggressive adversarial position against myself and others such as banning us from their message boards and club memberships and nothing has obviously been done to address the problem.

At what point does proven incompetence with no diligent attempt fix the problem encroach actions of fraud? What about causes of action such as gross negligence for failing to fix a problem that you are aware of or unjust enrichment which is unjustly profiting from fraud? As I've said many times before, you don't have to have purchased a doctored card to be a victim; card doctoring devalues good cards by artificially inflating the supply of the same cards.

Hello Dan,
good points! here is a thread from early this year making similar points
on the problem.
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=161528&page=2

[atx840]

Originally Posted by PolarBear

I doubt the "authorities" consider ripping off a few G's from some collector's disposable income worth their time.

I've had the Department of Homeland Security pm & email about questionable cards I've spotted on here...it happens.

[PolarBear]

Originally Posted by atx840

I've had the Department of Homeland Security pm & email about questionable cards I've spotted on here...it happens.

I'm not saying that didn't happen but wow, really? Sports cards are a matter of "homeland security?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by atx840

I've had the Department of Homeland Security pm & email about questionable cards I've spotted on here...it happens.

Do they collect scrap and freaks?

[atx840]

I am Canadian after all...they have to keep a close eye on us.

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by atx840

I am Canadian after all...they have to keep a close eye on us.

Yes, we wouldn't want the Whitehouse to accidentally burn down again now would we?

[byrone]

Originally Posted by auggiedoggy

Yes, we wouldn't want the Whitehouse to accidentally burn down again now would we?

For those of you keeping score at home, that's Canada 1 USA 0.

[pepis]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Thread created for future Google searches...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=155402

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=174512

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=174534

David,
i think this thread just passed the (fake packs & an FBI investigation) thread
as the most viewed post of 2013 people love controversy NICE!!!

[atx840]

Greg hasn't hear back as of the 16th, suggested we reach out to SGC.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by atx840

Greg hasn't hear back as of the 16th, suggested we reach out to SGC.

SGC is going to disclose the result of a private submssion? How likely is that? If hypothetically they decertified it would that show up in a pop report though?

[coco]

If the man that admitted to trimming the highest graded t206 Wagoner card had to spend a long vacation in prison (for mail fraud), shouldn't the company that encapsulated it as if it were in original condition be convicted of fraud as well?
Yet, the card continues to be showcased worldwide as if it was legit, you know, kind of like the story of the "kings New Clothes" if enough people pretend its fact, it will be? Its as you say, just a big club. Most of us are not members of it. And if your not in lock step you might be banned, like I was.