E104-1 Blanke Wenneker Candy Co- Nadja.. versions

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Posted By: leon

Recently I upgraded to a "Champions" front 104-1 from a bare one/blank back combo...Just for fun, if you had to put a multiplier on the degree of difficulty, where would you put the 3 varieties of E104-1? Since the no caption/blank back variety will be the most common we can use it as a x1 multiplier....so where would you put the other 2 in relation?

No Caption/Blank back..1x
Champions caption/Blank Back..xx
Nadja back...xx

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Posted By: Wesley

All of the E104-1 cards are very hard to find. Neither PSA or SGC have graded all 18 players in any of the three variations.

There was a large group of World's Champions front in the last Goodwin auction. There was an even larger group of World's Champions front cards in a Hunts auction about one year ago. Not sure whether these were the same cards, but it seems cards with the World's Champions front come up quite often.

Nadja back has been the toughest for me to find.

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Posted By: Marc S.

I have nothing specific to add...I do wonder, on a somewhat related tangent, the relative scarcity of E104-1s, vs. the E104-II's and E104-IIIs.

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Posted By: Wesley

I don't know how far back VCP goes, but if you look at their pricing history, they show pricing history for 17 of 18 E104-1s with World's Champions front.

For the other two E104-1 variations, VCP does not have history for Baker, Dygert, Lapp, Livingstone, Lord, Plank, and Strunk. I am sure some of these have changed hands privately, but only 11 of 18 E104-1s with no World's Champions text on the front have sold on ebay or at auction in the past few years.

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Posted By: leon

One of the reasons I posted this was to see how many of us have E104-1's with the Nadja ad on back? I think they are very scarce....maybe 30x-40x more scarce than the Champions ones and 100x more scarce than the blank ones. At least that is about the numbers I think I have seen with respect to each other....Thoughts?

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Posted By: Mark Tylicki

I have just one...



------------------------------
MY COLLECTION: http://www.rustywilly.com/MYCOLLECTION.htm

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Posted By: Richard

Leon - wow, those numbers seem high.



For your Plank with Nadja back, you think that there are 30-40 scripts and 100 blank backs? I don't think I have seen more than a handful of script and blank back Planks.



I would guess, for any particular card, the ratio is more like:



nadja:script:blank

1:5:5



The Nadja is clearly the toughest of the 3. I would agree with that.

edited to add: I think all E104s are tough, regardless of back, as shown in all of the caramel difficulty rankings.

The ratio of any backed E104 Plank to an E93 or E90-1 Plank has to be something like 1:100 or more.

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Posted By: leon

I wasn't referring to only Planks....I was referring to total population. So, yes, I think I have seen 100 blank backs and 30-40 script ones for every Nadja back......take care (I have only seen a handful of PLanks in total)

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Posted By: Richard

Leon -

Statistically, the ratio of any one card should be equivalent to the ratio of the whole set.

This is, of course, unless there are specific cards from each set that are much easier or much more difficult than normal.

So assuming that your ratio is correct for the set, then either your Nadja Plank is more common than normal or the script and blank backed Planks are much tougher than normal.

Of course, all of this is just to yank your chain :D

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Posted By: Dave Hornish

Now what about World Champions where the wording is not atop the player's head? Am I wrong or was there a thread on that a while back?

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Posted By: leon

Hey Richard
This is all in fun.....

Ok...with your last analysis the fact I have a Plank with Nadja back, and as stated I have only seen approx. 5 Planks, then that would mean 20% of the total of all cards (not just Planks) have Nadja backs.....? Have you seen 20% with the Nadja back? take care......and again, this is all in fun..

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Posted By: Richard

As with any experiment, you would want to apply your theory to the largest test subject (the set) and then extrapolate your hypothesis down to the smaller samples (single card), rather than the other way around. This would give you the least amount of error.

Why do I feel like I will not be getting my free drink coupons at the next National dinner? gulp.

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Posted By: Elliot

I would think the Nadja back is about 15-20 times as scarce as the regular blank back, which is pretty damn scarce considering how few e104-1's that you see in the first place.

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Posted By: leon

I agree with your last statement and is in fact the last point I made..I don't think, since I have a Plank with the Nadja back and have only seen about 5 in total, that we can extrapolate the data that way. Depending on the economy and funding the drink tickets should still be flowing...Our debate would only help in that effort for tickets for you....though, as I remember, no one has ever been without the tickets....

E- at 15x-20x as difficult I think we are close in our thinking...I could go somewhere between 3%-7% that have the Nadja backs....take care

[Rickyy]

Went back to reading this thread since I was trying to find E104-1 with the 3 different variations...and wondering why I can't seem to find one with a Najda back. I was lucky to pickup a Topsy Hartsel with Nadja back a few years ago..though its SGC10 poor. I've been looking for another better one since..with no luck...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Rickyy

Went back to reading this thread since I was trying to find E104-1 with the 3 different variations...and wondering why I can't seem to find one with a Najda back. I was lucky to pickup a Topsy Hartsel with Nadja back a few years ago..though its SGC10 poor. I've been looking for another better one since..with no luck...

E104's with Nadja backs are still very scarce. They are one of the cards that have not had "finds" of them. Any of the E104 series with Nadja backs are super tough. That's why I upgraded my type 2 when I saw this one. I couldn't believe there was no premium attached to it (that I could tell). regards

[Matt]

Leon - have you been contacted by The Group? That thing is blazing for an E104!

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Matt

Leon - have you been contacted by The Group? That thing is blazing for an E104!

I think they called but my switchboard only handles up to 5 callers at a time .

[Rickyy]

Nice Clarke Leon! I imagine E104-2 with Nadja takes the toughness level up another notch from the E104-1 Nadja back.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Rickyy

Nice Clarke Leon! I imagine E104-2 with Nadja takes the toughness level up another notch from the E104-1 Nadja back.

Hey Ricky
I am not sure but I can only say I have seen far fewer type 2's with Nadja backs than type 1's, and I have only seen a handful of type 1's in the last several years (w/the printed back). Now, if I can only find a type 3 with Nadja back I will be complete.

[philliesphan]

Originally Posted by Leon

Hey Ricky
I am not sure but I can only say I have seen far fewer type 2's with Nadja backs than type 1's, and I have only seen a handful of type 1's in the last several years (w/the printed back). Now, if I can only find a type 3 with Nadja back I will be complete.

I have a few E104-IIIs in my collection, and a fair number of them have Nadja backs. I'm pretty sure that I have at least two E104-IIIs of Dooin, but send me a note and I'll double check for you this weekend.

Marc