Lionel Carter's Collection

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Posted By: Dave Hornish

The new SCD (3/30) has a huge article on Lionel Carter's collection, which is going to be auctioned by Mastronet in April and August. Apparently Carter's collection was stolen last year and ultimately recovered, which led to his decision to sell. I won't spoil it for those who still get SCD (not many, I know) but it was an interesting piece.

Dave

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Posted By: Jason L

was this the theft that Leon had maintained a long post about late last year, I think it was?

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Posted By: Dave Hornish

I was not a board member last year so do not know. I am slowly going back through the historical posts but do not specifically recall that thread. Carter was home alone and lured outside by a person pretending to be a contractor while his house was ransacked.

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Posted By: Jason L

Hope he is well taken care of during the auction process.
From what Leon shared in that thread, Carter sounds like he was a hobby pioneer, and it will be good to see him benefit from his collection being re-introduced/circulated into the hobby...looking forward to seeing what was in it

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

CJs for sure

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Posted By: Steve Dawson

From what I've read previously (SCD had a series of articles on Mr. Carter's collection 1-2 years ago), if this is a sale/auction of his entire collection, it would IMHO, be up there with Halper and Copeland in significance!

I remember one of the statements in the articles was that he collected '33 Goudeys as a child, and that he meticulously cared for all his cards!



Steve

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Posted By: Dave Hornish

The article stated most cards would be graded by SGC and be designated as from the Lionel Carter collection. A few cards are going to be graded by PSA, apparently with no provenance. According to the story, with the exception of his CJ's and some 60's cards, the condition on the cards is superb. He seems to have a NM 33 Goudey Lajoie, a mint 38 Goudey DiMaggio and some nice E92 Nadja's and Diamond Stars among (many) other things. Everything was kept out of the light and properly stored.

Carter did not use sheets or slabs but rather designed his own archival storage system. Doug Allen mentions they may keep all the T206's in the original album and sell it as one lot but that was not definite. Everything else is boing slabbed and sold solo it looks like. This should generate some serious money if the condition holds up on the grading.

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Posted By: boxingcardman

Is whether he'd have been robbed if his collection hadn't been featured in SCD. I think it is kind of sad that he feels it necessary to break up a life's work and joy because of security concerns.

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Posted By: barrysloate

He's not too far from his 90th birthday, I think. Maybe it's just time to sell.

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Posted By: Pcelli60

I read the article. SCD comes up with some nice pieces. In that same issue some good baseball pin info..This publication still has something to offer our hobby..
That Carter collection is really something!!

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Posted By: Paul

I haven't even gotten my 3/23 SCD yet, and you folks are already reading 3/30. I think this is one of many reasons why so few subscribe.

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Posted By: dennis

this is copied from the old baseball cards site an article about hobby publications by george verchek. "Lionel Carter, now twenty years old, had been searching for other hobbyists. Carter found collector Edward Golden in 1936 and Golden let him know about Jefferson Burdick’s publication. Carter was delighted in finding Burdick and a handful of other subscribers including future trading buddies Harry Lilien and John Wagner. Carter is most likely the only subscriber from the 1930s still alive today. Carter quickly subscribed to the Bulletin and obtained the five prior issues, the very issues on durable 8½ by 11 yellowish paper that I have read to research this article. Carter discontinued his efforts on the Kaw Chief Stamp Journal and began contributing information to Burdick’s Card Collectors Bulletin. (Carter struck out on his own with a small publication in 1940. He got out four issues before being called off to World War II.)"

wouldn't we all love to talk about cards with with this man?

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Posted By: Dave Hornish

George Vrechek has written some top notch hobby articles over the years. I know him from OBC and have corresponded by e-mail with him for many years. I belive his wife is a librarian and between them both they do some heavy-duty research. He has a number of articles at oldbaseball.com that are worth seeking out.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Hey Dave,

We need to get Mr. Vrechek to start posting here...

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Posted By: JimB

Just got my SCD today. Great article. How many people can remember passing on a T206 Wagner because $150 seemed like too much to spend on a baseball card? Or getting a '33 Lajoie for free from Burdwick because he had 8-10 of them?
JimB

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Posted By: Marc S.

one of the collectors who seemed to focus on centering about 30 years before anyone else noticed anything besides miscuts?

It should be a phenomenal run of auctions through Mastro. I'm very excited.

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Posted By: Brian

"It should be a phenomenal run of auctions"

I would guess you are right....

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Posted By: Anonymous

Does anyone know here whether his focus on 1930s and newer far out weighs his interest in T, E, or even N cards? Curious as to what we might be treated to.

Best Regards,
Joe Gonsowski

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Posted By: JimB

The article said he did not collect 19th century stuff, so no N cards.
JimB

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Posted By: leon

I did speak with Doug a while back about the collection as he told me he had received it. As I recall Doug went over for a normal visit, as they are in the same proximity, and he and Doug are friends (not sure for how long). He said that he was giving a card back to him (I think he might have gotten it graded) and Lionel told him to take "them". When Doug inquired about taking "the" card to auction Lionel told him "no, the whole collection". Doug was floored. My understanding is that there isn't much obscure type stuff but sets of Goudey's, and E cards in really nice condition......Not sure how many "n"'s or other stuff there is. Nothing like opening packs of Goudeys and taking the cards out and preserving them !!......All you high grade collectors should be salivating. I don't think it's a security issue, as much as it's just time, though I guess it could be. Hint- I bet we see some really big borders.....regards

ps....maybe Doug will chime in for us ....

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Posted By: Brian

"Hint- I bet we see some really big borders"

I bet you're right.

It also will be interesting to see on the E and T cards, what high grade really was before WWII.

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Posted By: barrysloate

I think he has some nice tobacco cards too.

What is noteworthy about his Goudeys is they may be the last single owner group in existence. He got most or all of them from packs as a kid, and he is the only person who has owned them since (not counting the thief who had them for a short time).

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Posted By: Bill

How did they catch the guy who took them? Any links to articles on this?

Change your socks, drink water, and drive on.

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Posted By: barrysloate

I'm not sure if he or they were caught, but if so, I would guess they were trying to sell the cards. That usually clinches it.

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Posted By: Doug Allen

I am happy to chime in.....let me start by saying this is the most gratifying deal I have ever had the opportunity to participate in since I have been in the Hobby. Infortunately when I went to pick up the Nagy both he an his wife had passed away. Lionel and Irma are great people and so easy to work with. Someone recently indicated to me that there was a rumor that we purchased the collection. Nothing could be further from the truth. Lionel and Irma consigned the collection to us.

The offering is primarily mainstream sets from the turn of the century through Topps sets in the 1970's. What marks the collection was the incredible condition. He collected everything from Delongs to the present right out of the packs. Although his Delongs and 33/34 Goudeys are in mixed condition everything from the mid 30s to the present is really spectacular. He went back in the 50's and picked up the Early Tobacco and E card sets. Overall the condition of these is much better than you typically see. For instance we have a complete E106 set in the auction that provably averages SGC 50...the set looks like it has been together forever. The collection will be run in auctions throughout the remainder of this year.

A couple things of note. (1)We are producing a 30 minute video that includes an interview with Lionel and his wife. I will make sure everyone who wants a copy gets one. (2) Substantially all of the cards were graded by SGC and Carter provenance is noted.

Hope that answers some questions. Thanks for showing interest. Bidding on the auction starts April 9th. Catalogs are shipped in about a week.

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Posted By: Josh Adams

I saw some of these cards in the Mastro showcase at the Sun-Times show this weekend. WOW. AMazing cards, there was a Cobb E101 (I think) in an SGC 80. Very cool to see.

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Posted By: Bob

Doug- I'd love to get a copy of that video. It sure would be nice if Mr. Carter could attend the National in Cleveland and speak about his collecting of cards back in the day.
Leon- I'm sure we'd chip in if he wanted to attend the Net54 dinner.

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Posted By: leon

I would take money out of the banner fees and pay for Mr.Carter and his wife round trip tickets, hotel and meals, and expenses, if he would come to the Net54 dinner......and be more than happy to do it.....best regards