Washington Post article on the altered card scandal

[Peter_Spaeth]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...=.9b528888be93

[chalupacollects]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...=.9b528888be93

Good exposure to the rest of the world!

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...=.9b528888be93

Nice balanced piece. Like most kinds of fraud, it's just a long game of whack a mole. When you figure out how to stop some part of it some sleezebag will figure out a new approach.
If PWCC has an email trail with Moser of anyone else detailing fraud I'd be real concerned. I've seen Brent at a few shows and he don't look like the kind of hale and hearty guy whose going to take a stint in a federal penitentiary particularly well.

[ejharrington]

Good article. I don't know how Moser can deny what he has done in light of the overwhelming evidence against him.

[griffon512]

There's a good likelihood that some or all of the lawyers who regularly post on this Board will read this thread. The question is have you or are you currently giving legal services to PWCC, Brent Huigens, PSA/Collectors Universe, or Gary Moser in any capacity? A simple yes or no would suffice.

[36GoudeyMan]

Within the hobby, within perhaps an even smaller circle, this scandal has been well-read for a few weeks, if not longer. This exposure, in a national publication with very substantial street cred, is going to be read by tens of thousands of people, and word will spread far and fast beyond the readership (as well it should).

How will this impact the hobby? How will it impact the next generation of collectors? Will this get parents scared off of introducing kids to the joy of collecting? Does it crash the market for vintage and semi-vintage cards? I said a while back that this is a scandal of industry-rattling proportions, and I am very worried that the fun and pleasure of collecting is going to get flushed down the crapper by this scandal.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by griffon512

There's a good likelihood that some or all of the lawyers who regularly post on this Board will read this thread. The question is have you or are you currently giving legal services to PWCC, Brent Huigens, PSA/Collectors Universe, or Gary Moser in any capacity? A simple yes or no would suffice.

no

[Millerd33]

Why are SGC holders used for the image yet not mentioned anywhere and no images of PSA holders at all?

[Rhotchkiss]

Excellent!! Well done to those pushing this with the media. Forward!

[ZiggerZagger]

Really nice write up and summarization of the hobby and current issues for the uninitiated lay public.

Very glad this is hitting the larger news environment, and well done to Peter and others.

[BeanTown]

The term that collectors have said for decades comes to mind. Buy the card, and not the holder. For all the others that compete on the registry and invest on what the TPG say.. I hope the rabbit hole doesnt go down too far with this fraud/scandal.

On a side note.. Wasn't there an investigation going on with fake PSA holders coming South of the border? They were using real cards and hard to detect unless the cert number didnt match up.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by griffon512

There's a good likelihood that some or all of the lawyers who regularly post on this Board will read this thread. The question is have you or are you currently giving legal services to PWCC, Brent Huigens, PSA/Collectors Universe, or Gary Moser in any capacity? A simple yes or no would suffice.

Why would they answer that? It may even be unethical to answer.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

no

Or maybe they will, lol

[Peter_Spaeth]

JC there was and I think still is, I don't believe they have apprehended the guy yet.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Or maybe they will, lol

Sorry?

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

In a previous post I had said "why would a lawyer answer that question," then I saw that you did. Kudos.

[darwinbulldog]

One wonders why they went with a stack of SGC graded cards for the photo.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Moser said in a phone interview that he does not alter cards. He said he seeks out cards that he thinks have been “undergraded” by appraisers, breaks them out of their holders and resubmits them to grading companies without alteration hoping for a better value.

“I look for cards that PSA rated 5s and 6s, crack them out and hopefully get a better answer,” he said. “I’ve been buying and selling cards for 20 years. If I’ve been doing this [altering] for that long, I’d be retired. If I was this master alterer, I’d be pretty bad at it. I’d be pretty stupid.”

[griffon512]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Why would they answer that? It may even be unethical to answer.

If they are not giving legal services to these people/entities, why would it be privileged? If they are giving legal services to them, it's the determination of the lawyer whether it's privileged or unethical. If enough lawyers who regularly post respond and one doesn't that alone might reflect something. Not sure why you posted. It should be obvious to you why I did.

[Bicem]

Finally a decent article about all this, David Seideman at Forbes should take notes.

[Kenny Cole]

Originally Posted by griffon512

There's a good likelihood that some or all of the lawyers who regularly post on this Board will read this thread. The question is have you or are you currently giving legal services to PWCC, Brent Huigens, PSA/Collectors Universe, or Gary Moser in any capacity? A simple yes or no would suffice.

No.

[Johnny630]

Why are they Picturing SGC Cards and Not PSA ????

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Why are they Picturing SGC Cards and Not PSA ????

Likely an image they already had on file. There's another image from the 2010 National.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Likely an image they already had on file. There's another image from the 2010 National.

Thanks Scott....hope they change it..

[Rich Klein]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Likely an image they already had on file. There's another image from the 2010 National.

They probably covered the 2010 Baltimore National because of the proximity to Washington and had those photos on file. And because they don't have hobby knowledge we do, they used what they had.

Rich

[griffon512]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

No.

see title

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by griffon512

If they are not giving legal services to these people/entities, why would it be privileged? If they are giving legal services to them, it's the determination of the lawyer whether it's privileged or unethical. If enough lawyers who regularly post respond and one doesn't that alone might reflect something. Not sure why you posted. It should be obvious to you why I did.

The question, at least as I read it, was whether disclosure would be unethical, which is not limited to whether the information is privileged. Confidential information, privileged or not, may not be disclosed without client consent, with very limited exceptions.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

The question, at least as I read it, was whether disclosure would be unethical, which is not limited to whether the information is privileged. Confidential information, privileged or not, may not be disclosed without client consent, with very limited exceptions.

As Much as it Pains me to say this....I despise it but believe to be truth....
I think it’s going to Very Very difficult to prove Anyone allegedly Altered Any Cards....

Sad long term all the facts and exposure being brought to like will be good for the Industry...temporary pain hurts be will get much better

[h2oya311]

Very good article. Well-written and explains the baseball card industry pretty well for those outside of the hobby. The comments after the article make me sad, but I guess it's to be expected. Many of us are fools with our money.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Millerd33

Why are SGC holders used for the image yet not mentioned anywhere and no images of PSA holders at all?

This aspect annoyed me as well....

But finally a well-written article, overall. I thought the reporter covered most of the high points in an efficient and concise fashion.

[Millerd33]

I contacted SGC to let them know. We shall see if the image is changed.

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

They probably covered the 2010 Baltimore National because of the proximity to Washington and had those photos on file. And because they don't have hobby knowledge we do, they used what they had.

Rich

Either that or because SGC slabs are just objectively more attractive and photogenic than the others... :P

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

As Much as it Pains me to say this....I despise it but believe to be truth....
I think it’s going to Very Very difficult to prove Anyone allegedly Altered Any Cards....

Sad long term all the facts and exposure being brought to like will be good for the Industry...temporary pain hurts be will get much better

If there is an investigation, then I think whatever entity is in charge will have more tools in the toolbox to get at evidence than the BODA people do. And in that case, I believe that it won't be as difficult to prove the alterations/conspiracy/etc.

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by Millerd33

I contacted SGC to let them know. We shall see if the image is changed.

The bigger question is why didn't the Washington Post run before and after photos of a doctored card. I can't imagine they wouldn't have permission from the BODA people to do so.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by AGuinness

If there is an investigation, then I think whatever entity is in charge will have more tools in the toolbox to get at evidence than the BODA people do. And in that case, I believe that it won't be as difficult to prove the alterations/conspiracy/etc.

I’m just addressing the altering of cards.....how are they going to able to prove that anyone did alleged alterations, meaning specific persons..... PSA can’t determine anything...that’s one thing that’s been shown by them, they’re good at not stopping them.. They’re laughing knowing They’re safe.....probably just not gonna be as bold about it...using same account to buy and same auction houses...it’s going to be more targeted and hidden....I take solace in knowing the more arrogant and brash they get the more likely they will be to get caught. Fingers crossed

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

I’m just addressing the altering of cards.....how are they going to able to prove that anyone did anything, meaning specific persons..... PSA can’t determine anything...that’s one thing that’s been proven. They’re laughing knowing They’re safe.....probably just not gonna be as bold about it...using same account to buy and same auction houses...it’s going to be more targeted and hidden....I take solace in knowing the more arrogant and brash they get the more likely they will be to get caught. Fingers crossed

The way I believe it could work is that investigators could get warrants to obtain documents, etc. that would really pull back the curtain on what was going on.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by AGuinness

The way I believe it could work is that investigators could get warrants to obtain documents, etc. that would really pull back the curtain on what was going on.

Right I hear you man....but here is the thing.......what prof do you have to say specific person or persons did this? Did you see such and such trim bleach or re color a card? Where is the physical evidence? It’s all circumstantial.....still can hold same weight in court but I’m banking it won’t make it there...at least not to the specific alleged doctor or doctors...they’re gonna be very very difficult to pinch

[bobbyw8469]

I can't read it. It says I have run out of "free stories". And I refuse to pay The Washington Post a copper penny. If someone can post it here somehow, or a link I can read, that would be AWESOME!!!!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

I can't read it. It says I have run out of "free stories". And I refuse to pay The Washington Post a copper penny. If someone can post it here somehow, or a link I can read, that would be AWESOME!!!!

It is copied in full, without pictures, on BO.

[samosa4u]

Funniest part of the article:

“I look for cards that PSA rated 5s and 6s, crack them out and hopefully get a better answer,” he said. “I’ve been buying and selling cards for 20 years. If I’ve been doing this [altering] for that long, I’d be retired. If I was this master alterer, I’d be pretty bad at it. I’d be pretty stupid.”

Almost every single altered card that was posted on the Blowout forum was purchased by Gary Moser. How can he just flat out deny it with all that evidence against him? He's f*cked and he knows it.

[RedsFan1941]

yes

[drcy]

Originally Posted by Millerd33

I contacted SGC to let them know. We shall see if the image is changed.

The pic is small, and the label text even smaller and essentially impossible to read. Few to none of the WaPo readers are going to be trying to read that label and I don't think will be able to read what it says if they do. They'll see it as a generic photo the type that accompanies articles.

[HasselhoffsCheeseburger]

At this point, what defense is there for people that continue to do business with or associate with PWCC?

Arthur

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by HasselhoffsCheeseburger

At this point, what defense is there for people that continue to do business with or associate with PWCC?

Arthur

They offer a level of service that no one else provides in the hobby.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

They offer a level of service that no one else provides in the hobby.

meaning they "enhance" the physical appearance of cards without dislosing their alterations and have them authenticated as unaltered and then sell them at inflated prices to the sheeple?

This service?

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

meaning they "enhance" the physical appearance of cards without dislosing their alterations and authenticate them as unaltered and then sell them at inflated prices to the sheeple?

This service?

Nope. As far as I’m aware, they’re the only seller that has a user friendly consignment portal that charges fees under 4%.

Selling stuff on eBay isn’t enjoyable. I am happy to send my consignments elsewhere, but right now PWCC seems like the best option. I’m happy to give them their 1-4% cut if they want to do all the work for me.

[Millerd33]

Originally Posted by drcy

The pic is small, and the label text even smaller and essentially impossible to read. Few to none of the WaPo readers are going to be trying to read that label and I don't think will be able to read what it says if they do. They'll see it as a generic photo the type that accompanies articles.

This has been shared on many facebook card groups as well as anyone who goes to their website. It is very clear they are SGC in the image not PSA on those platforms.

[tschock]

What? No mention of all the class action lawsuits?

[Bicem]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Nope. As far as I’m aware, they’re the only seller that has a user friendly consignment portal that charges fees under 4%.

Selling stuff on eBay isn’t enjoyable. I am happy to send my consignments elsewhere, but right now PWCC seems like the best option. I’m happy to give them their 1-4% cut if they want to do all the work for me.

Good point, I mean what's a little fraud between friends?

[cubsguy1969]

The bigger question is why didn't the Washington Post run before and after photos of a doctored card. I can't imagine they wouldn't have permission from the BODA people to do so.

Because whoever took those photos owns the rights to those photos and would have to get paid for their use, or grant permission for their use. And I imagine they aren't too eager to do that.

I work at a big newspaper and the rules for photo usage have gotten insane. Even star publicity photos, which ostensibly were taken for PUBLICITY, require permission for use. Otherwise the photographer wants paid.

I agree using the SGC photo is bad. That's just lazy. Someone not paying attention.