O/T New Hall of Famers to be announced today

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Posted By: Chris Counts

Here's a list of the candidates: Brady Anderson, Rich Gossage, Dave Parker, Harold Baines, Tommy John, Tim Raines, Rod Beck, David Justice, Jim Rice, Bert Blyleven, Chuck Knoblauch, Jose Rijo, Dave Concepcion, Don Mattingly, Lee Smith, Andre Dawson, Mark McGwire, Todd Stottlemyre, Shawon Dunston, Jack Morris, Alan Trammell, Chuck Finley, Dale Murphy. Travis Fryman and Robb Nen.

The media is pushing the Goose as this year's leading contender and even the HOF has a front page article about him on its website. I'd be thrilled to see him in ... he was a beast, and he was certainly as good as HOF relievers Bruce Sutter, Rollie Fingers or Hoyt Wilhelm.

I'd like to see Gossage, Trammell, Blylevin and Dawson get in. Each of these players is better than many players currently enshrined. Maybe the big steroid mess will push those voting to actually elect somebody. Either way, I'd like to see somebody get in who is not an automatic choice (like Ripken or Gwynn). Baseball certainly needs a little good news right now, and I believe there's no better place to find it than in the game's illustrious past.

I'm of the belief that we need more ... and not less ... HOFers. Still I don't understand why guys like Anderson, Knoblauch, Fryman, Beck and Rijo are even on the ballot, especially when deserving players like Ron Santo can't even make it ...

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Posted By: Dan

I am a huge Dale Murphy fan so I am biased when it comes to him, but I can not believe that Dale and Abdre Dawson do not get more support. Murphy played with some of the worse Atlanta teams ever and put up huge numbers (for the 80's). His career was derailed due to a knee injury that no one was able to come back from except Barry Bonds, and I think we all know how he was able to do it.

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Posted By: Jason L

Gossage: in with 79.9%
Rice: in with 76.4%

Dawson: still out with 71%
Blyleven: still out with 63%
McGwire: still out, with 32%

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Gossage and John might get it, I think. Murphy is a longshot.


As for what I think, Smith should go in, and maybe Gossage.

But the world is safe from what I think, with me doing the selecting there'd be a handful of folks in who are out, such as Kaat and Reulbach; and there'd be a bunch out who found a way in... Puckett and Carter, for example.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Gossage and Rice deserve to get in. But what about Dave Concepcion? No way?

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Posted By: Mark Steinberg

Well, I am apparently one of the few that thinks Concepcion has gotten jobbed. He was an integral part of the Big Red Machine Championship Teams, and a perennial All-Star. The best shortstop in the NL for at least an 8 year span...

He did not speak the language particularly well, and was a very unassuming, quiet fellow. But a great team player, and perfect for what the Reds needed at that time. Unfortunately for Davy, he played alongside Rose, Morgan, Bench, Perez and Foster, who garnered 99% of the limelight.

I doubt that he'll ever make the Hall, but I hope his accomplishments are remembered, as he was truly a great shortstop. He was fixture at shortstop, a terrific fielder, and made himself a .300 hitter through hard work and persistence (in that era, shortstops were not producing offensively, anywhere close to what they do today).

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Posted By: Bob

If Gossage gets in and Blyleven doesn't, it's a travesty.
If Rice gets in and Oliva doesn't some day (veterans committee), it's a joke.

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Posted By: Chris Counts

Mark,

I would love to see Concepcion make it since I'm a Reds fan, but I believe he comes up short. I compared him to Pee Wee Reese and Phil Rizzuto. While Concepcion measures up favorably in many categories, his on base average was a measily .322, not even close to Reese (.366) and Rizzuto (.351). Trammell, on the other hand was a better hitter than any of the three and he was a good enough fielder to win four Gold Gloves. I consider Concepcion to be comparable to four other HOF shortstops, Bobby Wallace, Dave Bancroft, Travis Jackson and Rabbit Maranville, none of whom I believe was deserving of induction. Another shortstop who I believe is truly deserving is Cecil Travis, who I hope is still on the Veteran's Committee ballot ...

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Posted By: Chris Counts

Bob,

I agree with you about both Blylevin and Oliva. I watched each of them play extensively when I was a kid. Oliva was a true superstar who was derailed by injuries and played in one of the most offensively-challenged eras. can you imagine the stats he would have put up in the 1920s? He might have put up numbers like Chuck Klein or George Sisler. Of the players not enshrined in Cooperstown, I consider him and Minnie Minoso to be the greatest ommissions. As for Blylevin, I love watching him break off the devasting curve. He lived near where I grew up in Orange County, and one day he made an signing appearance at a store across the street from the local mall. The same day, Steve Garvey was making a signing appearance in the mall. There was a huge line of kids waiting for Garvey, so I walked across the street to meet Blylevin. Much to my surprise, I was the only kid in the place! Bert was friendly, takative and down-to-earth. What strikes me now is that even though he had arguably the best curve in the game, he never received too much respect, even when he was playing. But he was certainly as good as a dozen HOF pitchers (Haines, Rixey, Marquard, Sutton, Pennock, etc.) ...

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Posted By: Anthony S.

How many children did Garvey conceive at the signing that day?

Would love to see Dawson make it. I agree that ten years of greatest (Dawson, Murphy, Rice) is too often trumped by 18-20 years of very goodness in Hall voting.

And it's too bad Frankie Frisch never played with Gossage, Rice, Murphy and Dawson. When he headed up the Veterans Committee he treated induction in the Hall like invitations to a poker game he was hosting (cough...Jesse Haines).

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

I think Concepcion is deserving -- especially when judged against Mazeroski. Concepcion was a huge part of that team.

As for Blyleven...same argument as for Sutton: longevity paid off. Probably he and Tommy John deserve induction.

When I think of whether or not a player who played in my generation should get in I think of how dominant they were perceived to be in their era. With that in mind, Rice yes, Gossage yes, Concepcion yes, Garvey maybe yes (though I know his numbers pale) and Dawson (probably yes). These players really led their generation.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

I recall a time when Concepcion and Bowa were going along through a season, and both had good error free streaks going. I think Concepcion finally makes one. A few weeks later, the Phillies and Reds are playing. During warmups, Bowa says "Hey Elmer, how's it going?", and "Good hit last night, Elmer" to Concepcion. After a few minutes of it Davey asks Larry why he's calling him Elmer, his name isn't Elmer, it is David... Larry Bowa replies, "I'm sorry, I thought it was Elmer. I just know I saw 'E CONCEPCION' in a box score the other day."

If you put in Concepcion, then Bowa goes in, then Wills, and on and on. They'd have to go back and put in Marty Marion, who didn't get in after Rizzuto and Reese did (some sort of toomanyshortstop logic at work there)... Let 'em all in, anytime they buy a ticket for admission, just like us.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Well, Frank, that's true I suppose. Concepcion was a leader at his position...but was he truly great? Probably not.

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Posted By: PC

Gossage - 86% of the vote

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Posted By: Andrew S.

Reading through them, the only player that jumps out is Concepcion. He's the only one deserving of induction from that list.

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Posted By: Marty Ogelvie

I was a huge Dodger fan growing up and Garvey was my favorite player. That being said, he's no Hall of Famer.. He was a very steady player, All Star numbers for two different teams but if you start letting Garvey type players in then it will eventually take a full week just to go through the Hall of Fame.

There are obviously 2 tiers of players in the Hall. 1st ballot no brainers like Ruth, Gehrig, Aaron, Mays, Mantle, Cobb, etc. and then there are the ones that got in but were not obvious hall of famers to everyone.

Lets not add a 3rd tier please.. Garvey to me, falls in that 3rd tier.

martyOgelvie
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