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  #1  
Old 10-13-2018, 02:17 PM
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Default Back in the Day & The Future of Pitching

Nineteenth century pitchers frequently pitched the majority of their teams games, many of which were complete games. Four, five or six hundred innings pitched isn’t going to happen again, but ..................

The Brewers “formula” for pitcher usage raises the possibility that a Gio Gonzalez, for example, could be the starting pitcher for an entire 7 game series, while racking up a grand total of 14 innings.

Such a starting pitcher during the regular season could rack up the currently required 162 innings to qualify for the ERA league leadership and the like, but would also have to suffer the indignity of winning exactly “zero” games.

Seemingly meaningful statistics could be rendered obsolete as a result. Reworking the metrics to better accommodate and evaluate such a radical change in pitcher usage could have additional ramifications.

The Cy Young Award could be discontinued and replaced by the “Gio”.
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Last edited by frankbmd; 10-14-2018 at 05:41 PM.
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  #2  
Old 10-14-2018, 01:23 PM
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Frank, you make some interesting points, but IMHO, you used a poor example in Gio Gonzalez. Gio's career has been as a starting pitcher. I think it far more likely that a career relief pitcher becomes the first to start all 7 games of a series.
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Old 10-14-2018, 01:31 PM
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[quote=frankbmd;1819492]Eighteenth century pitchers frequently pitched the majority of their teams games, many of which were complete games. Four, five or six hundred innings pitched isnít going to happen again, but ..................

QUOTE]

Thankfully things changed by the nineteenth century.
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Old 10-14-2018, 05:45 PM
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[quote=Peter_Spaeth;1819685]
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbmd View Post
Eighteenth century pitchers frequently pitched the majority of their teams games, many of which were complete games. Four, five or six hundred innings pitched isnít going to happen again, but ..................

QUOTE]

Thankfully things changed by the nineteenth century.
I attribute my clairvoyance to being one hundred years off in either direction.

My insight in this regard also appears in the current T207 thread.
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Old 10-14-2018, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ValKehl View Post
Frank, you make some interesting points, but IMHO, you used a poor example in Gio Gonzalez. Gio's career has been as a starting pitcher. I think it far more likely that a career relief pitcher becomes the first to start all 7 games of a series.
The premise is based on Counsell, not Gonzalez.
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Old Yesterday, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbmd View Post
The premise is based on Counsell, not Gonzalez.
I know nothing about these players you speak of but it is a shame the way the pitching has gone. Going the whole 9 innings used to be fun to watch (for me, as a pitcher). Everything in baseball has just changed more than I really care for. I know I am probably "1 percenter" and am ok with that. In a current MLB season I might watch the equivalent of 1-2 games so I guess I do watch some. That said, I do like to watch semi pro (Frisco Roughriders are fun to go see), college and younger kids games. Those are fun to watch.
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Old Yesterday, 04:43 PM
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Default The One Batter Start

Another wrinkle today in the future of pitching is presented.

Dodger lineup stacked with right hand batters against the lefty Miley.

Miley walked the first batter and is immediately pulled and replaced with the right handed Woodruff.

Miley will start Game 6.

Remember what I postulated in the original post about back to back starts. Although the scenario is a bit different, I think I deserve a pat on the back.
Even I didnít expect it to happen so soon.
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Old Yesterday, 07:09 PM
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Frank, I believe Stanley "Bucky" Harris, the "Boy Wonder" playing-manager of the 1924 Senators, was the first to employ this "wrinkle," in Game 7 of the 1924 World Series (the game WaJo won in relief in the 12th inning) no less:

"The unheralded Curly Ogden was given the Game 7 start for Washington Ė it was his only World Series appearance. He struck out a batter and walked one, and then was pulled for George Mogridge. It was later revealed that manager Bucky Harris started righthander Ogden so that the Giants would be locked into their "righthanded" lineup, before he switched to the lefthander Mogridge."
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Old Yesterday, 07:17 PM
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Well, they have closers, why not designate openers?
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Old Yesterday, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ValKehl View Post
Frank, I believe Stanley "Bucky" Harris, the "Boy Wonder" playing-manager of the 1924 Senators, was the first to employ this "wrinkle," in Game 7 of the 1924 World Series (the game WaJo won in relief in the 12th inning) no less:

"The unheralded Curly Ogden was given the Game 7 start for Washington – it was his only World Series appearance. He struck out a batter and walked one, and then was pulled for George Mogridge. It was later revealed that manager Bucky Harris started righthander Ogden so that the Giants would be locked into their "righthanded" lineup, before he switched to the lefthander Mogridge."
Your wrinkle applies to a single game “false starter” to flip the mound vs a stacked lineup to create an advantage. (Counsell’s ploy today)

The other wrinkle is having a pitcher start consecutive games, which Miley will do on Friday. Your example would be identical if Ogden started Game 8, which of course didn’t exist.
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All my cards are centered, some are just cut incorrectly.

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Last edited by frankbmd; Yesterday at 07:45 PM.
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