1907-1910 Weiser Wonder - Walter Johnson PC, new to the hobby

[bcbgcbrcb]

Stamp box makes it 1910 or later.

[rjackson44]

very pretty p.c enjoy leon

[Rich Klein]

But I could have sworn I entered this postcard back in the day into the Beckett Data Base

Rich

[h2oya311]

White border looks like one that sold a few years ago w/ 1918 postmark for $2,400. I would say it's c1915-1920...and I bet the seller was floored! I would have been happy wih it at the $1200+ range, not $2k+ range...but you certainly don't see these very often!!

Perhaps a member purchased this card and we can put the "photo of photo" vs. RPPC debate to rest w/ up-close scan!

[VintageBall]

Yesterday's card was sold by a seller with other Weiser and Idaho postcards that were postmarked 1920 and 1921 and were identical in style of front and back (white border real photo cards with same photo paper).

The real shocker here is the price for a card that was issued late in Johnson's career and is a low quality reproduction of the image on the original postcard which likely was issued c.1909-1911. When these real photo copy cards first hit the market in a couple of auctions, they were stand-alone lots. Here, this one was auctioned alongside others that depicted scenes and/or postmarks indicating a c. 1920 issue date.

So...while it is a really scarce postcard, it is, in essence, an early reprint of a card of a HOFer in a town team uniform!

What does this mean for the price of a Barr-Farnham Walter Johnson postcard, which was issued in 1909 as part of the set depicting individual Washington major league players on each card? And no I don't own one -- wish I did!

Here are what the Barr-Farnham cards look like:






Robert S

[Jaybird]

Originally Posted by VintageBall

Yesterday's card was sold by a seller with other Weiser and Idaho postcards that were postmarked 1920 and 1921 and were identical in style of front and back (white border real photo cards with same photo paper).

The real shocker here is the price for a card that was issued late in Johnson's career and is a low quality reproduction of the image on the original postcard which likely was issued c.1909-1911. When these real photo copy cards first hit the market in a couple of auctions, they were stand-alone lots. Here, this one was auctioned alongside others that depicted scenes and/or postmarks indicating a c. 1920 issue date.

So...while it is a really scarce postcard, it is, in essence, an early reprint of a card of a HOFer in a town team uniform!

What does this mean for the price of a Barr-Farnham Walter Johnson postcard, which was issued in 1909 as part of the set depicting individual Washington major league players on each card? And no I don't own one -- wish I did!

Robert S

I agree with everything you said, Robert. In my experience, that stampbox, while possible to have 1910 is "usually" a 1918 or later piece. I can tell you that everytime I have come across that stampbox it is on something later than 1918. I know Playle's has it as 1910-1930 but that isn't my experience or the experience of many other PC collectors. So even without the other PCs that it sold with, I would peg it to 1920s anyway.

I also think that the buyer might have gotten a little excited just by the subject matter and not looked deeper into the card itself. I think this is a photo of the Cabinet photo and not of the other postcard. The Cabinet photo which sold in Legendary 2006 is also sepia and you can see where this PC was cropped in from that image.

[WillowGrove]

Originally Posted by VintageBall

Yesterday's card was sold by a seller with other Weiser and Idaho postcards that were postmarked 1920 and 1921 and were identical in style of front and back (white border real photo cards with same photo paper).

The real shocker here is the price for a card that was issued late in Johnson's career and is a low quality reproduction of the image on the original postcard which likely was issued c.1909-1911. When these real photo copy cards first hit the market in a couple of auctions, they were stand-alone lots. Here, this one was auctioned alongside others that depicted scenes and/or postmarks indicating a c. 1920 issue date.

So...while it is a really scarce postcard, it is, in essence, an early reprint of a card of a HOFer in a town team uniform!

What does this mean for the price of a Barr-Farnham Walter Johnson postcard, which was issued in 1909 as part of the set depicting individual Washington major league players on each card? And no I don't own one -- wish I did!

Here are what the Barr-Farnham cards look like:




Robert S

I too agree 100% with you Rob. I was interested, did my research (thanks to our wonderful forum) and decided I'd save my money towards 'the older' version of this card - should it ever come up again. Still a cool, rare card.

Now those Barr-Farnham cards. Whoa. Thanks for posting - I never heard of them and I love them. -peter

[Jlighter]

Originally Posted by WillowGrove

Now those Barr-Farnham cards. Whoa. Thanks for posting

Woah Indeed.

http://www.goodwinandco.com/LotDetai...ventoryid=9089

[nsaddict]

The seller has already left feedback for the buyer. For those inquiring minds

[bcbgcbrcb]

I would also agree with the post-1918 production date. There was an earlier version of an AZO rppc that ended in 1918 so that would be a logical starting point for this one.

[VintageBall]

I agree with you, Jason, on the photo -- probably the cabinet.

And I also agree with you, Phil. These Johnson cards were clearly kept in print for many, many years in different iterations.

By the way, the Barr-Farnham cards were also issued in presentation albums, like the Goodwin link you posted, Jake. The interesting thing is that the ones in the albums all may not have been postcards, but real photos without the postcard back.

I have one that was actually a page from the album that was given to Jim Delehanty and it doesn't have the postcard paper backing. The stand-alone cards, of course, have been seen only with the real photo postcard paper backs.

Here's the Delahanty one:



The Barr-Farnham company also issued a 1909 postcard of the Baltimore Orioles. Here's the image from the Library of Congress:

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Eric72

Would that issue simply be a reprint? Granted, quite an old reprint, but a reprint nonetheless...interesting to ponder.

Just curious...is this a reprint? Specifically, was it a RPPC of the original? If so, what would that do to the value?

Best,

Eric

[VintageBall]

Good question. It's definitely not a reprint in the classic sense of the term, in that it isn't an exact replica of the earlier card. It just uses the same image as the original PC and cabinet, and all evidence seems to it being issued much, much later.

It's worth what someone will pay for it. And in this case at least two bidders really wanted it. Of course, the question is did they get all amped up because of subject matter; or because of the original postcard showing the same image; or even because of the prices this card has realized before when sold in big auctions without the other Idaho postcards readily reviewable by clicking "see other items" form the same seller.

Here's an example of an early real photo postcard reproducing a famous photograph from the 1880s. What's it worth? Who knows? But if the purchaser of yesterday's Walter Johnson is interested, it will happily be available :

[Bicem]

A Robert S. sighting! This makes me happy.

[Bicem]

Bumping one of my favorite threads...

Another chance to grab a sepia one (is this the same one that sold on ebay?)...

Many mistakes/assumptions made in the description but what really baffles me is the PSA label. Did they really make the same date mistake again? Walter Johnson's postcard? Did he own this one too?

http://goodwinandco.com/Extremely-Ra...-LOT27844.aspx

[Baseball Rarities]

Yes, that is the same one that was on ebay. I remember the writing on the back.

[Hankphenom]

This did not belong to Johnson, and if that's what they intend by "Walter Johnson's Postcard," it's another of the many mistakes in the slabbing and hyperventilated description of this card.

[ValKehl]

I know next to nothing about dating PCs, however, per this source http://www.playle.com/realphoto/photoall.php the style of the AZO stamp box on the back dates the Weiser Wonder WaJo PC in Goodwin's current auction to the years 1910 - 1930.
Val

[Bicem]

Agreed Val, all the evidence strongly suggests that this is a post-1910 card...

The stamp box w/ divided back, the post-WW1 style borders, the graininess and cropping of the original photo, the other example found with a 1918 cancellation date, etc.

Big price already, hope the winner has done his homework and is not relying on the auction description (which maybe applies to the Blue version, not this one).

[btcarfagno]

They were proud of the Weiser Wonder and printed that for a long time most likely. Wonder there aren't more out there. Whatever the case may be I love the postcard.

Tom C

[seattlerainiers]

Jeff...your thread bump inspired me to post this one.

[Hankphenom]

Any provenance to go with this one? The hills are similar to those in that part of the country, but the games were a bigger deal than this scene suggests, and I think the ballparks all had stands and probably fences, too.

[packs]

Those look like Model T's in the background and if they are then Walter Johnson could not have been pitching.

Johnson made his debut with the Senators in 1907. The first Model T was not produced until 1908.

[seattlerainiers]

No provenance, Hank. All I have to go on is that the writing on the back strongly appears to be period. Of course, it could've been incorrectly identified back then, but not with intent to deceive for $.

I think I can find out conclusively if the Weiser ballpark had stands, and will try and do so.