Dealers at the national

[bbcard1]

If a bank were robbed of $100,000+ in cash, it would be the lead on the news. Between the two mantles and the Ott bat that have been mentioned here, the take at the national was much more than that. Worst of all, many of the items will never see the light of day.

Why haven't the dealers simply insisted on the National providing video security and additional manpower? Were I a dealer at the national, I would make my voice heard pretty loudly on that...because sooner or later, the theft is going to kill the show.

The promoters make a pretty nice payday out of the national. I would think they would have a responsibility to take care of you dealers...while it's nice to see the Topps display and such, the real draw is the cards.

[ullmandds]

I don't think putting the onus on the promotors is totally fair?! If I had hundreds of thousands of dollars of card inventory I'd feel obliged to protect it!

[x2drich2000]

I don't think the onus on the promoters/venue is appropriate either. I kind of equate it to the mall. Each store (dealer) needs to have their own security and method of monitorying their inventory. The mall security (the venue) provides assistance once they are notified, but they can't be expected to catch all or even most of the shoplifters in the act.

DJ

[ReefBlue]

They're not going to install what would amount to thousands of cameras for a 3 day event.

You'd have to install a camera system that rivals a vegas casino. How would they accomplish that?


If their inventory is important to them, dealers should provide their own security.

Bring people with the sole job of watching, not interacting with customers.

[Edwolf1963]

Originally Posted by ReefBlue

Bring people with the sole job of watching, not interacting with customers.

.. as opposed to bringing people (and yourself) in for the sole job of socializing w/each other, eating and generally ignoring the customers .. Seriously - I like the idea of a designated watcher.

The question of security cameras came into my mind as well - the Donald E. Stephens hosts shows and conventions all the time, so not just for a one-time, 3 day event - I can see the feasibility of doing this on their part overall as I'm sure theft is a regular, unfortunate occurrence. I thought the Schaumburg Convention Center at the Renaissance (not far and where some shows have been held) has this, but I could be wrong.

Quick add-on: I agree in that not about onus of responsibility being on venue, it's on the individual vendor - - I just think security cameras might act as some sort of deterrent and at least give the party at loss/police something to go on.

[bbcard1]

I think there is a fiduciary responsibility of the promoter to provide an appropriate level of security to their dealers. It seems the level of theft and, apparently, the sophistication has risen to a level that transcends petty shoplifting. I think the promoter needs to do more of the show will suffer...how many $40,000 bats do you have to lose to decide you aren't going back any more?

[batsballsbases]

Hello,
Just to set the record straight the ott bat wasnt taken from this years national. It was taken from the national the year before and returned a few months ago. And as for security I to believe that it cant be up to the venue to supply that type of security system. It is really up to the dealer himself to police his own inventory.

[ReefBlue]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

I think there is a fiduciary responsibility of the promoter to provide an appropriate level of security to their dealers. It seems the level of theft and, apparently, the sophistication has risen to a level that transcends petty shoplifting. I think the promoter needs to do more of the show will suffer...how many $40,000 bats do you have to lose to decide you aren't going back any more?

If someone is caught stealing, they have security on site to deal with detention until the police arrive.

But to monitor every individual for the duration of their visit is beyond the scope of a venue that isn't in the security business.

If you bring several million dollars in inventory to a trade show, it is worth spending a couple thousand on security. It doesn't even have to be a uniformed guard, just a friend of yours who would be willing to stand there. Just keep tossing pizza and burger king over the tables at him and he'll be happy . . . .

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

I don't think putting the onus on the promotors is totally fair?! If I had hundreds of thousands of dollars of card inventory I'd feel obliged to protect it!

Yep, and having now gone through this once, I feel comfortable that there are enough safe techniques for doing this. Leon schooled me pretty good on things and even slapped my wrists once when I was being a fool. Seriously, thanks Leon for the help and advice.

Memorabilia is a different issue - stuff just laying around all over the place, unprotected, has to be tough to keep an eye on. If I ever bring such items to a show, I'll definitely share a booth so that there are multiple eyes on things.

[Texxxx]

I told my son about the stolen cards and he said he wasn't surprised. He said probably 50-60% of the dealers didn't keep there cases locked.

[rainier2004]

I think this crowd is waaaay too honest. I have never stolen from the show, nor would I ever, but there are way to many ways to get away with cards from a dealer. What about asking to see a "stack" of cards, someone distracts the dealer, and you just take a couple from the pile? I mean Ive waiting several minutes just to hand backs thousands of dollars worth of cards to a dealer b/c he isn't paying attention.
First and foremost, the dealers need to take responsibility. Secondly, there does need to be some sort of police presence at the show and maybe that's 2 cops each walking around all day. Third, why aren't there are a few guys in plain clothes that simply watch...Id love to do that and for free, just give me a walkie. Lastly, we as collectors should watch out for everyone, when I was a kid I caught someone stealing a Bench rookie and that dealer got in his face very quickly as the card was gone...I watched him slip into his book. This is our hobby and thievery just sucks. No thief could ever be sure that no eyes are on them. I am very shocked that six-figures worth of cards don't come up missing every year.

[travrosty]

t-206 guardian angels, berets and all patrolling next years convention.

[murcerfan]

First and foremost, the dealers need to take responsibility.

or buy a security camera.

[ReefBlue]

Originally Posted by rainier2004

I am very shocked that six-figures worth of cards don't come up missing every year.

Overall, at a big show, I bet it happens.

When you go past a dealer that has a case with 50 rubber banded stacks inside, there is zero point zero chance he knows what are in those stacks. Then multiply that by half a dozen cases on his table.

When he gets home, he doesn't know if anything is missing.

[travrosty]

the pickpockets and thieves congregate whether valuable and a lot of people congregate, its what they do. super bowl, wherever. they all look like nice guys but you dont know who is the crook. that is what they count on. some are alone but some work in teams, they misdirect, get your attention elsewhere, then palm and gone.

[vintagecpa]

Perhaps stealing the idea from Bait Car or Catch a Predator would help reduce the issue. security should set up a dealer table with tempting high-dollar items that are relatively easy to steal. The table would be monitored with hidden cameras and security ready to apprehend anyone stealing. All it would take is one very public arrest to make every other thief think twice about stealing at the show.

[olrac44]

I don't think the promoters can be responsible for how a dealer conducts himself/herself and how they handle the inventory at their table.

How does a dealer lose a 52 Mantle, anyway? If it's in a showcase, the showcase should be locked. If the dealer shows someone the card, why would they take their eyes off of that card?

[Jewish-collector]

Probably someone opened the case while he was distracted. Dealers' cases should always be locked.

[rainier2004]

I heard of a scam a couple years ago at the National used to steal entire binder/sets. The thief is carrying around what appears to be large count box of cards, with a false bottom and nothing inside. At some point the thief places the box down over a binder/set of cards. When they pick it back up the box has the binder in it and off they go. I like bait table idea...

[olrac44]

Perhaps Leon or someone else knows.....Does the National offer Safe Rentals to dealers? I thought many of the dealers who had safes had a similar company's label on their safes.

[thehoodedcoder]

Originally Posted by batsballsbases

Hello,
Just to set the record straight the ott bat wasnt taken from this years national. It was taken from the national the year before and returned a few months ago. And as for security I to believe that it cant be up to the venue to supply that type of security system. It is really up to the dealer himself to police his own inventory.

just get a spy cam from ebay with a 32 gig disk drive on it. stuff that puppy in a teddy bear and sit it behind your chair in your booth. total cost....45 bucks.

kevin