Proving authenticty of game used bats vs uniforms

[markf31]

I have yet to get into or add anything to my collection that is "Game Used". I've explored and researched bats as well as jerseys. The Grey Flannel auction ending tonight has really got me interested in jerseys and I've done as much reading and research into the area as I can find.

With bats we can prove that a particular bat was issued to a player and comparing player characteristics on the bat we can make an educated guess as to if the bat was/was not used in a game.

It seems that with vintage jerseys, where photo matching is near impossible in most cases, proving that a particular jersey was game used is at best more obscure and at worse impossible to determine without provenance. It seems to me that there is more room for fakes and unauthentic in jerseys, so what steps can be taken to ensure authenticity?

[ksfarmboy]

Just as with cards or anything else yes jerseys can be faked. Most of the problem jerseys out there can be spotted with research and knowing what you are buying. I've been collecting Orioles knit jerseys for 10+ years now and I'm still learning although the curve is getting much smaller. Just like everything else the more valuable the item the more careful you have to be. You need to learn styles, manufacturers, tagging, and sizes for starters.

For example: If you wanted a 1975, home, Brooks Robinson jersey there would be a few things to look for. First it needs to be white of course to be a home jersey. Next it would have to be made by Rawlings and have the correct Rawlings tag for that year. It needs to be a size 42 as that was the only size Brooks wore his entire career. It needs a year flag tag that has the set #, #8P, and the year 1975. The team name, player name and numbers must be made of the specified material and color in the proper location. The name on the back needs individual letters sewed on in the correct arch pattern for this maker instead of the nameplate that was used on later jerseys.

These are just a few examples when looking at the jersey. Next you must check to see if any of the aforementioned items have been added or restored to take the jersey back to it's original state or to deceive. Restorations of jerseys are ok as long as they are mentioned. These jerseys will sell less than all original.

This is just what you need for starters and you can get much deeper into it than that.

My recommendation would be to try and find someone that specializes in what you are after. Ask them questions and many will steer you in the right direction.

I will now post a Brooks Robinson jersey and see what you can tell me about it with the information I just posted.

[MVSNYC]

wrong size?

ksfarmboy- very informative post, BTW.

[perezfan]

No Flag Tag either...

[ksfarmboy]

Both correct. Wrong size and no flag tag. Plus this Rawlings tag was first used in 1972. Brooks was the only Robinson on the team at the time as Frank moved on to the Dodgers in December of 71 I believe. So no need for the B. This jersey could have been made at the end of 1971 but it would have been after the season was over. It's difficult to notice but there is a tag in the neck area that gives all the material and composition of the jersey. This particular jersey is a salesman sample that is exactly like what the players wore. If someone wanted to fake this as a game used jersey they would have a hell of a time doing it. Removing the sample tag would leave a mark, removing the old tag and putting the correct tag would leave stitch marks also. This is why research of rosters, numbers and other factors mentioned in my other post are a must. If you want an Orioles jersey talk to an Orioles collector. If you want a George Brett jersey talk to a Brett collector. I guarantee you they will know the little nuances that help make a jersey authentic. Sometimes the difference is just the placement of the tag itself. I would also note that just because a jersey is missing a tag doesn't make it a fake either as sometimes stitching comes loose and the tags were lost. You just have to be extra cautious with these.

I'll post another example on Sunday of something I should have known a long time ago but just figured out. Luckily I never got burned because of it.

[travrosty]

you do your best, you do your homework and know exactly what to look for, and after all that, you might only be able to conclusively rule out items, not rule them in.

[karamaxjoe]

Originally Posted by travrosty

you do your best, you do your homework and know exactly what to look for, and after all that, you might only be able to conclusively rule out items, not rule them in.

After everything Travis said, it comes down to three words.

Leap of faith.

[Duluth Eskimo]

I believe I was offered this jersey or one just like it along with a couple of others from that same era. Can I ask where you were offered this?

[ksfarmboy]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

I believe I was offered this jersey or one just like it along with a couple of others from that same era. Can I ask where you were offered this?

I bought it on ebay and it was listed correctly as a salesman sample. Chances of me owning a B. Robby jersey isn't very good due to price restrictions. This is the next best thing for me.

Yes, buying a "game used" jersey requires a leap of faith but you can shorten the fall by doing your homework.

[Gmrson]

The O's also used a "reverse block" lettering (at least in '76) around that time.