Need ID help, 1867 Harvard Baseball Nine

[Republicaninmass]

What would this be refered to as, is it just torn out of some book? Also, any idea of value as it doesnt really fit in my collection will most likely be going up for sale

Thanks in advance

[ctownboy]

I will have to check my copy but this could have come out of a book called the "H Book of Harvard Athletics" which, I think, was published in 1923.

David

[CarltonHendricks]

That would be 1867 as opposed to 97'....CTown will let you know for sure but without checking myself it certainly looks like it's from the "H" Book Of Harvard Athletics published in 1923 if I recall. That's a good question what it's worth...I don't think too many of those pictures get loose from the book...The picture was produced in 1923 so it's not like it's an albumen...

I think the whole book conservatively goes for $200-$300...depending on printing edition and so forth...so one little picture....who knows...You may want to put it on eBay once you know for sure what it is....disclose all and see what happens...Would be a good starter piece for a level 1 collector...See the bound cuff of the player on the far right?....that's classic 1860's....It's good to have 1860's baseball represented in a collection.

[thecatspajamas]

That photo does appear in The H Book of Harvard Athletics on page 153, but in a different configuration (turned 90 degrees on the page) and with text above and below the photo. Unless it appears elsewhere in the book that I'm not aware of, or the contents are arranged differently in subsequent printings (the copy that I have is copyright 1923), that page is not from the H Book.

[thecatspajamas]

Scan of the photo in The H Book of Harvard Athletics:

[barrysloate]

It's probably a plate from "Old Boston Boys and the Games They Played", a 1906 book written by James Lovett.

[GaryPassamonte]

Here's the Harvard team in 1866, with most of the same players.

[Republicaninmass]

Thanks guys for the insight, I think it would look great ina frame, just not something that would fit on my wall!

[bmarlowe1]

Really nice scans of the '67 team and others can be found at:

http://oasis.lib.harvard.edu/oasis/d...eadid=hua20004

[19cbb]

Beautiful Gary!

Originally Posted by bmarlowe1

Really nice scans of the '67 team and others can be found at...

'65 here: http://thenewyorkclipper.com/harvards-gray/

[GaryPassamonte]

This 1866 harvard CdV is interesting. The reverse lists the players, year, and "property of the TH Murname family."

[baseballart]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

Thanks guys for the insight, I think it would look great in a frame, just not something that would fit on my wall!

As Barry notes, it's probably from Old Boston Boys. Can you let me know the size of the page? There were two editions of this book, 1906 and 1908, and one edition is larger in size.

The book is also available from the LOC on-line, so in case anyone wants to go through to see if the photo is indeed from there, here's the link http://archive.org/details/oldbostonboysgam00love

Max

[barrysloate]

Max- based on the oversized margins, it's probably the larger format plate, which would date the edition to 1908.

[CarltonHendricks]

Originally Posted by GaryPassamonte

Here's the Harvard team in 1866, with most of the same players.

Can't recall ever seeing a CDV of a Harvard team like that or any college team...pretty impressive. Gary is that yours?

[GaryPassamonte]

Carlton- There are a few CdVs picturing the 1866 team as well as a couple picturing the 1867 team shown on this thread. There may be others of the Harvard team, but these are the only two teams I'm familiar with. This Harvard CdV is mine. I have one other college CdV that pictures the Agallians of Wesleyan University in Middletown, CT circa 1868. This CdV is significant in that it shows the three bases as well as both the pitchers plate and home plate. This team is posted here.

[benjulmag]

One of the pages in the 1867 Harvard yearbook shows that very image. In those days, each yearbook page was a separate albumen photo. Some years back that original albumen image taken directly from an 1867 yearbook was auctioned by Lew Lipset.

EDITED to add that there is also extant a Cdv of the 1867 Harvard team. Inasmuch as it is blank-backed, it is likely a pirate Cdv, possibly made by taking a photo of the yearbook page. As I recall it is the cover photo on Mark Rucker's Cdv book on the first baseball cards (i.e., Cdvs).

[CarltonHendricks]

Originally Posted by GaryPassamonte

Carlton- There are a few CdVs picturing the 1866 team as well as a couple picturing the 1867 team shown on this thread. There may be others of the Harvard team, but these are the only two teams I'm familiar with. This Harvard CdV is mine. I have one other college CdV that pictures the Agallians of Wesleyan University in Middletown, CT circa 1868. This CdV is significant in that it shows the three bases as well as both the pitchers plate and home plate. This team is posted here.

Very nice Gary...I would guess those are in the "exotic" baseball category...How often do those surface?....looks like something you'd see in the booth of Terry and Nathan Knouse of Tik Tik & Nik....Are there any college team photo cdv's of football? Rowing?...

You'll laugh but, other than I knew they were some kind of photo, I didn't even know exactly what a CDV was until about four years ago when I bought the two below...my interest was that they were sports sculpture....I was disappointed they were so small, and not as big as a cabinet photos....a friend had to explain to me they were essentially "better" and earlier than cabinet photos...although I think the genera's overlap...As I recall I believe these came out of the Rucker collection and are in some book...which I don't think I've seen.

[GaryPassamonte]

Carlton-I have a copy of the CdV on the left in your post. I'd be interested in the one on the right should you ever sell it. I strictly collect baseball CdVs and know nothing about examples from other sports. CdVs are much scarcer than cabinets and, I believe, less plentiful than tintypes. I would say that somewhere between 15 and 20 become available at auction or through ebay annually. I've discussed the total baseball CdV population with others on this board. Estimates vary between 200 and 300 pieces. I'd be interested in the opionions of others.
Corey-The 1867 Harvards on the cover of Rucker's CdV book always looked odd. I never heard your theory on its origin. It sounds possible.

[Runscott]

This might sound odd, but I believe I remember seeing this picture in one of the old Spalding or Reach guides. Some of the ones from the 1880's and 1890's had a lot of old team photos that had nothing to do with the current guide.