Is group learning always good? E90 Upp for example

[Archive]

Posted By: robert a

First of all, I want to say that I'm only starting this thread to create what I hope will be an interesting discourse. I happen to be a collector who enjoys sharing observations with others on who is tough in what set, etc.

However, is researching "off the board" sometimes a better idea so that you're still able to afford the card?

For example, now that this card is "outed" as a clear toughie, let's reflect on the price the current example in fair condition brought on ebay today. Wow.

Ok, now be honest. How many of you bidders (that didn't know upp was tough) were willing to pay more after reading the thread here that discussed upp as a tough "common?"

I also agree that there has been a lot more e90s on ebay since the past few network 54 e90 threads.

I guess our board can affect the market almost instantaneously?

robert

[Archive]

Posted By: Seth B.

I saw that Upp, too. Wow, that's a lot for that beat up card, even though it is a great pose. But e-bay often follows this board. I remember a post about the T-206 Rhoades (Arm Extended) being rare, and after that the 20 or so "rare" examples I saw on ebay were commanding higher prices. I guess this shows a few things:

First, that more people read or lurk here than we even give credit for.

Second, that prices for these pieces of cardboard are immensely flexible, and impressions of scarcity often drives prices more than actual scarcity.

Third, I suspect that many people are reluctant to discuss their own collecting projects. I thought about starting a "What set are you working on thread," but I'd rather keep it hush hush until I can post my completed set on the board.

[Archive]

Posted By: Mark Rios

The price on Upp was...insane.
BTW, so was the McLean & Shean.

Seems someone really wanted'em.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jim Manos

I think the tough cards as Trex pointed out in his post are much tougher than earlier thought. Also the fact that the set has so many cards ie... with many easy may detract from the very difficult. I actualy responded to Ted's post on what are the tough cards. I think going forward alot was uncovered as to which cards are the tough one's and will bring a premium. I don't think $220 is a premium for as tough a card as Upp is. I will reiterate that I knew Upp was tough and many didn't before the post of Trex. Great observation, I like the post. I hope this well deserved E90-1 set gets some more attention. Comparing to the E107's is a little chesty but I like it. Regards, Jim

[Archive]

Posted By: Rhys

The E90-1 set is weird because if you ask 100 different people, they will tell you the same 20-30 people are "rare" but in completely different orders of rarity. It is no secret that this card is tougher to find, and it has been known to be such for probably 20-30 years and has been catalogued as a premium in the price guides as a result, but different people will rank it in different rarity. Some people claim Donlin is rare, but I once bought 3 of them at the same card show and have owned probably 4-5 others which makes 7-8 examples in a three year period; Far from rare.

Rare is an overused term for this issue with probably multiple layers of toughness. There are probably a dozen "Rare" cards in this issue and Upp is not one of them. The combination of somewhat tough card to find and an attractive desirable pose make this card what it is, but $220 IS too much for it in that condition.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

Personally, I was very unhappy to see the Upp card outted because this is his only card and I have been looking for it since I start my quest for a player set. Now I am going to have to wait a long time before I will ever get this card at a reasonable price. I just hope the other secret toughies I am looking for don't get outted before I can buy them.

Jay

I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home, I would be arrested. So, I go to baseball games and fit right in.

[Archive]

Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

I bid on these cards, as they were just a good fit for my "junker" E90-1 set.
After they ended, I looked back at the bidding and the Upp and Shean were
won by a former poster on this Forum. He had to contend with several other
bidders at the ending moments of these lots, whose ebay "names" I did not
recognize. I will not reveal the winner, he can reveal himself (I am sure he
still reads this Forum's posts) and tell us why the bidding was so high.

I find it somewhat interesting and sort "strange" that some here think that
by bringing up the subject of the E90-1 set, and in the process enlightening
collectors to the various levels of difficulty in acquiring certain cards in this
set....it is considered "taboo". Furthermore, to attribute a couple of Threads
on this set suddenly affecting ebay listings of E90-1's, I find very laughable.
I have scanned the E90-1 listings on ebay since 1999, and they "come & go".


T-Rex Ted

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

I'm not opposed to sharing info. I just prefer to keep some info under the radar until I can get the card first. Information is power and can make you money, especially in this hobby if you have knowledge that isn't generally known. There is also a coralary to info being provided here and added interest in those cards when they appear on eBay. Talk about things isn't going to bring new cards out of the woodwork, but it will spur interest in cards that people would otherwise overlook.

Jay

I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home, I would be arrested. So, I go to baseball games and fit right in.

[Archive]

Posted By: robert a

Hi Ted,

Again, I don't want to make this small thread specifically about the upp card or your e90 thread, because I'm aware of the fact that e90 collectors have been going after this card for a while and the e90 thread was really what this board should be about in my opinion.

However, I'm a little surprised that you think it's strange that this board could have an impact on ebay listings. You said you didn't recognize the ebay names except the winner, but all of the bidders are network 54ians.

I would assume MOST folks (if not all) that are actively buying rare candy cards on ebay have found this board by now.


Robert

[Archive]

Posted By: Bob

One good thing about this board is that it gives the opportunity for collectors to gain knowledge that they might not have been able to access elsewhere. As far as the price for the Shean card, if I hadn't been able to find one years ago I would have bid more than the winning bid in this week's auction because it is that rare. Only guys who build the E90-1 set card by card might have this knowledge. Shean rarely if ever appears for sale. Because the Shean has the same front as the E92 Dockman and many other sets, you see that front on ebay from time to time, but you don't see the E90-1. Upp is tough but Shean, IMHO, is still the toughest E-90-1 around. I know other collectors may disagree but try building the set and see how tough it is. I found the Mitchell early on and McLean, Duffy, Walsh and Speaker, although all tough, were no match.

[Archive]

Posted By: Anonymous

The rare players in the N172 Old Judge set are...<bang><bang>

<body falls to the floor>

<the dark silhouetted figure pulls his cap down over his eyes, shakes his head and steps over the body on his way out of the scene>

[Archive]

Posted By: Lee Behrens

I have seen this trend before when there is a thread aboout certain set or card. Give it 2 or 3 months and things will settle back to normal.

Lee

[Archive]

Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Robert A

We enjoy Talking BaseBall, "flaunting" our cards, and sharing our collective
experiences and our expertise on this Forum. A mere 15 years ago we could not
conveniently do this on a natiowide basis. Now, I'm still sort of a "newbie" on
here (< 1 year) so I don't recognize most of this Forum's ebay user names; so,
cut me a break.

Rhys' post pretty well "hits the nail on the head" regarding the Upp card in
the E90-1 set. His only year in the Majors, Jerry Upp pitched in only 7 games
in 1909. Because of this, I'm sure his card was one of the 20 (or so) added
cards to this set that were short-printed in the last Series by Am. Caramel.

And Robert, way before this Forum, or the advent of the Internet, many older
set collectors were well aware of the "tougher" cards; not only in this set,
but across most of the vintage sets. Even though Price Guide listings did not
reflect some of these tougher cards. This was so, because we were generous in
sharing our information at card shows or over the telephone.

Bob M....relates his experience in collecting the E90-1 set which parallels mine
quite closely. I started with M Mitchell, Speaker, Clarke (Pitt) & the Horiz. cards.
However, I found out quickly that "sleepers" like Shean, Upp, etc. were really
difficult to find in any condition. And,mind you, I was doing this during the
early 1980's. Then E-type cards were no where near as popular as they are now;
therefore, they were certainly more available.

Well, here I go again......embarking on a 2nd set of E90-1 cards. This time I
have started with both cards of Honus Wagner, Duffy, Karger, Keeler, Shean,
Tris Speaker, and yes.....Jerry Upp.