Trimming issue....lessons learned

[Archive]

Posted By: cmoking

Recently I posted a 1934 Goudey Frankie Frisch card that I was confused about whether it was trimmed or not. It was originally in a PRO 7.5 holder. When I cracked it out and sent it to PSA, they rejected it as trimmed. Then I sent it to SGC and they graded it as SGC 80. Here is the scan of the card:



So I was confused. The fact that it was originally in a PRO holder made me think there was a good chance it was trimmed. I bought it because I wanted to get a good idea of what a trimmed card may look like. When I cracked it out of the PRO case, everything looked perfect to my naked eye. It measured correctly, and I could not see anything that resembled trimming. So I thought 'hmm...maybe a non-trimmed card actually slipped by PRO!'. When PSA sent it back to me as trimmed, I wasn't that surprised since it was in a PRO holder originally. But I still didnt' see what they saw...and wondered why they thought it was trimmed. I've had other cards that they've said were trimmed and that I had sent back to them that afterwards they graded...so I know they are inconsistent with that. I'm not going to speculate on their motives, but I know it's very possible.

Then I sent it to SGC to see what they would say. If it came back as trimmed from them, then I would be fairly sure I'm missing something and I had to learn a lot more about why this card was trimmed. But to my surprise, they graded it SGC 80 (undergraded IMO if it wasn't trimmed :0 ). But now this confused me even more...and I started a thread asking those questions.

My concern isn't in obvious trim-jobs that one can easily spot in a scan. My concern was with good trim-jobs that isn't identifiable in a scan, and may even get past the grading companies. That thread unfortunately didn't help that much. Many people responded, but no one really had any useful insight. I sent a few emails, and some of them basically said "just look at the card and you can tell"...which weren't helpful at all. One person who helped me out was David Vargha. I emailed him because I respected his impartiality and thought he knew what he was talking about. In turn, he put me in touch with Kevin Saucier. Fortunately for me, I was going to the area where Kevin lives, so I asked him if I could meet him in person and bring the card with me. It would be more difficult to convey his thoughts in writing versus showing me what he saw.

Kevin took 2.5 hours of his time to go over how a card looks when it is trimmed and otherwise altered. He trimmed a couple of cards and showed me the telltale signs of how it would look and feel. This was incredibly educational! He looked at this Frisch card carefully and in his opinion, it wasn't trimmed. From learning from him, I too am comfortable knowing that it isn't trimmed. I also learned other issues about trimming which will make me a much smarter consumer in the future. I wasn't expecting this much great info from a stranger, and I am grateful for Kevin's generosity with his time!

Thanks guys. Happy New Year.