Mantle Master Set Variations

[Bestdj777]

Are there any other Mantle Master Set collectors out there? I have a couple of quick questions if you guys don't mind.

Have any of you been able to purchase, or at least seen, the 1962 Post Canadian 163 Hits "4th time" variation? I have yet to see this variation, and it is the last card I need for my Post/Jello subset (I am not looking to buy given a lack of funds right now, but I would love to see a scan or at least get confirmation that it exists).

Was also wondering what your thoughts were on the 1952 Topps variation? Do you view both as required cards for the set? I know it is a personal preference thing, but I am just curious what your arguments are for or against including it. I know I've made some judgment calls myself--don't collect panels or test issues--but have always been on the fence about whether this was needed to complete my Topps Mantle set.

[ALR-bishop]

In the last issue of the SCD Standard Catalog ( 2012)the Mantle variation for the 1952 set was listed, along with the Robinson and Thompson. On all three it lists the variation as the stitching on the back. But there are also front differences on the Mantle, for example a wavy or straight star line, a clipped or full e on the auto, tails or not on the upper borders and pixel or not on left. Here are mine;




I don't think it is included in the PSA master set list

Larry S ( sflayank) may have infor on your other card

[Bestdj777]

Thanks Al. I really appreciate you weighing in given your vast knowledge on the subject. I did not know the variation was included in the latest Collectors Digest. I use an older addition and figured if Bob Lemke wasn't including it, and neither was PSA, maybe I could leave it out and still call my set complete. The addition to the Collectors Digest changes things though.

Beautiful cards by the way. Love the PSA 8 (I have that variation but in significantly lesser grade) and the overall look of the ungraded card. Also like the rarer test issue cards I've seen you post in other threads. Very impressive collection.

[hammer]

Great 52 Mantles Al. Someday I would love to own 1 they are at the top of my list but every time I arrive their something else comes up or low on funds, They sure are beautiful

[tedzan]

I have (or have had) every Bowman, Topps, Bazooka, Dan Dee, and Post Mantle cards. I still have my 1952 Topps....but, this 1969 Mantle (BLUE
background) appears to be "unique".
I acquired this Mantle card back in the 1986. I have searched for another one with this color for 26 years; and, have not seen one.

I'm wondering if anyone else on this forum has seen this Mantle card with the BLUE background ?

.

TED Z

[ALR-bishop]

Ted---I have most of his Topps cards, including the W and Y for 69, but have not seen one like that before

[Bestdj777]

Ted, I have been working on the master set for 5 years now, and I have never seen another card like that. Just took a glance through ebay and nothing there either. Beautiful card. It would be interesting to see what PSA would do with it.

[ALR-bishop]

What are the toughest cards in the Master set ?

[Bestdj777]

I should start with a quick caveat. I am working on a variation of the PSA Mantle Master Set. I added several cards to the checklist and subtract the following: Yellow Base Path Pin; Key Chain Insert; Topps Salesman Sample; Topps Plak Checklist; Topps Punchout; and all "panel" or "complete box variations." So, I cannot really speak as to the availability of the ones I omitted.

I am currently 150 cards into what will be a 197 card set for me. So far, the toughest cards for me have been as follows:

1. 1960 Topps Tattoo Portrait (seen one in the last year, and didn't have the budget for it)
2. 1964 Topps Tatoo Yellow Band (seen one in the last year, and just lost out on it)
3. 1962 Post Canadian 163 hits, "4th time" variation (have not even seen a scan of this)
4. Exhibit Portrait (only one I've seen is the $2,500 dollar one that's been sitting on ebay for the last year)
5. Exhibit Post Card Back (never seen a copy for sale, so eventually deleted this from my list)
6. 1951 Wheaties Premium Photo (I have seen two copies in the last two years. One was a beater, and the other I significantly overpaid for).

[ALR-bishop]

I only have Topps stuff





[IMG]http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj555/Bishop539
/img054.jpg?t=1336665087[/IMG]

[Bestdj777]

Gorgeous cards Al. I particularly like the mask. Once I land my next job, I think I may try to pick up a copy of that as well as his Plak stuff.

I see you have a copy of his "Who am I" issue. Do you by any chance know what PSA's "re-issue with caption" variation is? I purchased a copy of each, and the fronts and backs look identical. I know that certain cards were issued without the coating on the front and the writing in the bubble on the back, like your Ruth, but this does not seem to be the case with this variation. It's had me confused since I picked mine up.

[ALR-bishop]

Not sure what you are referring to on the variation. I have a scratched and unscratched Ruth from the Who Am I set, and the Ruth from the 1954 Look and See set, which using the same photo, but with different front captions, backs ( and slightly different size).

I am unfamiliar with any "re-issue with caption" variation, and would like to know more

[ALR-bishop]

I do notice that my clean Ruth has no instructions in the bottom of the ? on the back ( it is blank), which differs from the disguised version which does have the instructions

[jakeinge]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

I only have Topps stuff





[IMG]http://i1267.photobucket.com/albums/jj555/Bishop539
/img054.jpg?t=1336665087[/IMG]

Showoff! Did you rob Woody Gelman or something?

[ALR-bishop]

No, that was Larry

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Not sure what you are referring to on the variation. I have a scratched and unscratched Ruth from the Who Am I set, and the Ruth from the 1954 Look and See set, which using the same photo, but with different front captions, backs ( and slightly different size).

I am unfamiliar with any "re-issue with caption" variation, and would like to know more

I have scans of the regular next to the "re-issue with caption," but the scans are over the 19.5 KBs permitted by the site. Unfortunately, my computer won't allow me to crop the scans or otherwise reduce them. If you'd like to see them, feel free to PM me your email address and I can send them that way.

[sflayank]

thats absolutely ridiculous
thats a who am i thats been scratched off
only half the set was reissued without the covering and mantle is not one of them

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by sflayank

thats absolutely ridiculous
thats a who am i thats been scratched off
only half the set was reissued without the covering and mantle is not one of them

I didn't think it had been re-issued. The card always mystified me a bit though, given that you could clearly see part of the disguise on it. I could not understand how they had made that mistake. I called them to ask about it and was told something to the extent of, "it must have been a later issue of this card." Kind of surprising. That said, I got a good deal on the card (didn't pay a premium of any kind for the label), and it fits nicely into my collection.

[ALR-bishop]

Larry--other than the Ruth---were any of the other 3 baseball subjects reissued without a disguise ?

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by sflayank

thats absolutely ridiculous
thats a who am i thats been scratched off
only half the set was reissued without the covering and mantle is not one of them

I skimmed eBay and noticed two uncoated Ruth's, both of which had been graded by PSA. Neither of them has the "re-issue" designation. It makes me wonder even further why PSA gave my card the "re-issue" designation, if it is not marking clear re-issues this way.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1967-TOPPS-W...item19d6a06d9d

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1967-TOPPS-W...item19d6a06bbb

[ALR-bishop]

We should ask Doug G. He often says PSA has good reasons for all the stuff it does

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

I should start with a quick caveat. I am working on a variation of the PSA Mantle Master Set. I added several cards to the checklist and subtract the following: Yellow Base Path Pin; Key Chain Insert; Topps Salesman Sample; Topps Plak Checklist; Topps Punchout; and all "panel" or "complete box variations." So, I cannot really speak as to the availability of the ones I omitted.

I am currently 150 cards into what will be a 197 card set for me. So far, the toughest cards for me have been as follows:

1. 1960 Topps Tattoo Portrait (seen one in the last year, and didn't have the budget for it)
2. 1964 Topps Tatoo Yellow Band (seen one in the last year, and just lost out on it)
3. 1962 Post Canadian 163 hits, "4th time" variation (have not even seen a scan of this)
4. Exhibit Portrait (only one I've seen is the $2,500 dollar one that's been sitting on ebay for the last year)
5. Exhibit Post Card Back (never seen a copy for sale, so eventually deleted this from my list)
6. 1951 Wheaties Premium Photo (I have seen two copies in the last two years. One was a beater, and the other I significantly overpaid for).

I have the 1955 Exhibit Postcard Back, and it is the only one I have ever seen in an auction or otherwise. Picked it up for a relative song in a Huggins and Scott auction several years ago, where it was buried near the back of the catalogue (probably because it was "only" SGC Ex+, and the investor crowd would therefore have had little interest). It is, however, a very interesting card.
'55 Exhibit Postcard Backs, per the Standard Catalog, were cards from previous years that were reissued in very limited quantities. Mine has the "Made in USA" legend in the lower right corner, indicating it was originally printed during the 1951-1953 time period, i.e., quite possibly in his rookie year (the photo on the card was taken during the Mick's rookie year). The rarest rookie era Mantle? All in all a keeper, that I likely wouldn't sell for one hundred times what I paid for it!

Good thread and best to all,

Larry

[Bestdj777]

Hi Larry,

That's awesome that you were able to find one and get it so cheap! Do you recall by any chance what variation it was? (Mutoscope, no mutoscope line). I read in another post that there were two variations made. Unfortunately, I have not come across either.

I keep hoping I will find one on eBay that is improperly labeled. I think that will be the only way I get an affordable copy. I lucked out and got one of my OPC mantle team cards that way. For some reason, only one of the two team cards is readily available. Finally found this one when it was incorrectly listed as a topps card. I ended up buying it now at a fair price and felt very fortunate to add it to my collection.

I guess I'll have to start watching Huggins and Scott!

[ls7plus]

Hi, guys. Mine has no mutoscope line. I am looking for the Vern Stephens if anyone has one for sale--his stats with Boston (particularly the 39 HR, 159 RBI year) always impressed me.

Good luck with your collecting. Its finally finding the most challenging cards you're seeking which bring the most pleasure to the collector.

Best regards,

Larry

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Have any of you been able to purchase, or at least seen, the 1962 Post Canadian 163 Hits "4th time" variation? I have yet to see this variation, and it is the last card I need for my Post/Jello subset (I am not looking to buy given a lack of funds right now, but I would love to see a scan or at least get confirmation that it exists).

Just wanted to follow up quickly to confirm that this variation does exist. I finally came across one on ebay. Unfortunately, the seller is asking $3,000 for it, which is probably $2,800 more than the card is worth.

[whiteymet]

Hi All:

Mantle does come with both the the MUTOSCOPE and plain line versions on the Exhibit Postcard Backs. See below.

PSA or the submitter (is that a word??) did not know enough or chose not to list it as a postcard back for some reason.

In any event I am always looking for these PC backs. My wants and those available to trade are:

EXHIBIT POSTCARD BACK WANTLIST EITHER BACK:

Ritchie Ashburn MADE IN U.S.A., Campanella, Hodgers, Kaline, Kluzewski, Mathews, Musial, Reese, Robinson, Sauer, Snider

NEED W/MUTOSCOPE BACK: Adcock, Atwell, Banks, Baumholtz, Berra, Feller, Gromek, Kellner, Lockman, Mays, McDougald, Mele, Pafko, Porterfield, Schoendienst, Trucks, Waitkus, Woodling, Zernial, Indians Team card


NEED W/O MUTOSCOPE: Baker, Bilko, Doby, Hegan, Irvin, Maglie, Minoso, Mitchell, Stephens,

DUPES: Dropo, Fain (Muto) , Goodman, Groth, Hermanski, Lockman, Schmitz, Trucks, Vernon, Wertz (Muto), Zernial.

[baldeaglefan]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Just wanted to follow up quickly to confirm that this variation does exist. I finally came across one on ebay. Unfortunately, the seller is asking $3,000 for it, which is probably $2,800 more than the card is worth.

Yes, it does exist. I have one and I know of another collector who has one. According to Dan W. Mabey's Northern Exposure book it was printed on the back of Post Grape Nuts.

[MW1]

.

[MW1]

.

[Bestdj777]

MW1,

Thank you for your reply. I am assuming that this card belongs to you? If so, I hope I did not offend you with my assessment of the price. The card is obviously worth whatever someone is willing to pay you for it, and I wish you all the best with your sale.

I am curious as to what makes you think that this is a newly discovered variation though? I've spoken with other collectors on the board with extensive post collections who are certain there are only three variations: 1) 153 hits, 2) 163 hits, 4th time in, and 3) 163 hits, 4th time. I have never seen another "163 hits, 4th time" card apart from the one you have listed. Do you have another that you compared yours to? If so, I would love to see it. The type 3 you linked to, is actually a "153 hits" variation. I believe I messaged the seller to confirm, as it is difficult to distinguish between a 5 and 6 in scans of these cards. Please don't take these comments as offensive or rude, just really trying to nail down what variations actually exist. Before your listing, I was not even 100% convinced a "163 hits, 4th time" variation actually existed.

[MW1]

Bestdj777,

I think you're correct -- it's probably the "c" variation (the eBay listing has been changed to reflect this). I find it curious, however, about the pricing structure in most price guides. The "c" variation, at least in the case of the card I have listed, has a back similar to the other short prints in the Canadian Post series (lighter vs. darker). In all the years I've attended conventions in Canada, it is also the only example I have seen.

[MW1]

Originally Posted by baldeaglefan

Yes, it does exist. I have one and I know of another collector who has one. According to Dan W. Mabey's Northern Exposure book it was printed on the back of Post Grape Nuts.

Can you post an image of your card?

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by MW1

Bestdj777,

I think you're correct -- it's probably the "c" variation (the eBay listing has been changed to reflect this). I find it curious, however, about the pricing structure in most price guides. The "c" variation, at least in the case of the card I have listed, has a back similar to the other short prints in the Canadian Post series (lighter vs. darker). In all the years I've attended conventions in Canada, it is also the only example I have seen.

It's amazing how difficult that card is to find. When I first started looking, I saw that it was comparably priced and always thought it was be just as easy as the others to locate.