Brutal PSA Poppage

[MattyC]

In my humble opinion, a card is the same card no matter what the sticker of some TPG says. Our eyes are the final judge-- and the one that counts.

If I think a 2 looks like a 4 to me, then I will pay "4 money" for it.
If I think a 9 looks like a 7 to me, I will only pay "7 money" for it.

As long as the buyer essentially "grades the graders," then it all works out.

When dudes buy overgraded cards, dudes play themselves. When dudes buy undergraded cards, they get steals and can potentially make loot off bumps.

[j_cook]

Of course graders will be inconsistent at time, but I still think it helps to give you an idea of what you are buying, even if they are a grade off. Buying a PSA 6 that should really be a 5, or vice versa, is still better than buying an ungraded and trusting the SELLER to give you an accurate description. At least with graded cards you have a ballpark idea.

[Leon]

I haven't (I don't think) ever bought a card based on the grade, especially for my collection. I buy them on the way they look to me. But if people want to play the game, more power to them. I will watch and have fun with them, while they pay for resubmitting over and over again. My only concern is for alterations.....and that in itself is a bag of worms. To each their own.....

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

It has been going on since people started getting paid for their opinions, and the people paying them began collecting the opinions connected to each card, instead of the card.

If anybody finds it fun to collect those opinions, and keep paying for different (hopefully better) ones, that's good for them, and I'm glad that they are having fun.

But it's stupid.

There I said it, and I feel good about it. That's what's fun for me.

Doug

Good man, Doug.

[Mrvintage]

A lot of good posts on this topic. There are some that I agree with and others I don't necessarily agree with, but they made me think about things from others perspective. For me trying to understand others views and learn from them are important aspects of being a member here so thanks everyone for your input.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

No, it has not been going on "since the hobby was a hobby".

It has been going on since people started getting paid for their opinions, and the people paying them began collecting the opinions connected to each card, instead of the card.

If anybody finds it fun to collect those opinions, and keep paying for different (hopefully better) ones, that's good for them, and I'm glad that they are having fun.

But it's stupid.

There I said it, and I feel good about it. That's what's fun for me.

Doug

I suppose it depends on when you figure the transition away from it being a hobby happened. I could pick a few dates from my time collecting that might be debatable, but the change isn't 100% finished and probably won't be. As long as some collectors don't care about condition I figure it's still a hobby to someone.

Overstating the condition of something has been with us a LONG time. At least since 1978 when I went to my first show. "It's mint for its age" "What about the two big creases?" " Like I said, mint for its age" That guy didn't last long, but like medusas hair there were more taking his place.
When they started being the majority there was an opportunity for TPG. Coins already had it, and stamps had authentication since at least the 30's, probably much earlier.

Likewise, there's always been a few collectors that care a whole lot about condition. And as long as I've been collecting the more damaged cards have sold for less. (48 Musial with paperloss on the front was only 25 cents at the second show I went to )

I don't have the budget to play the registry game. Even on a good special a whole 1981 set would run almost 3700 in grading But I have had a few cards graded and do have them in the registry. Mostly for fun.
But I must admit a certain happy feeling when one comes back as being the highest graded of its type. And a bit of remorse when the Blankbacks dropped my T206 average into the 40's.
I'm still not sure why, since I'm also not all that into condition. I don't think I'd crack out a 9 or 9.5, but maybe a really nice 2 or 3 like a couple I'll probably cross over. (I have a few PSA cards, but don't do their registry. )

I do also agree that after a certain point the extra money just doesn't make much sense. The $1000 difference between a 9 and 10 mentioned would let me fill in a lot of holes in my collection.

Steve B

[Runscott]

I hate hearing 'mint for its age'. Grades have nothing to do with age; otherwise, I have a whole pile of Indian Head cents that are 'mint for their age', plus one that is actually 'mint'.

Hell, I'm mint for my age.

[Runscott]

I think the crux of it is 'hidden agendas'. If you are an honest seller with experience in assigning grades to your raw cards, according to industry standards, then you will always do a better job on average than the TPG's. They have hidden agendas that are well-known (favoritism to certain customers) and not-hidden issues (they have to grade too fast in order to make a profit, they can't afford to hire the skill-level we would like to see).

I don't know if I can grade cards better than the TPG's, but I am certain that, on average, I WILL assign more accurate grades. I'm not in anyone's pocket and I assume that when you look at my scans of raw cards, you are smart enough to tell if I'm grading accurately. If I'm not, then hopefully I'm at least consistent and you can still make wise decisions.

Because of the agendas and issues I mentioned above, you can't do that with TPG's. Plus, the cards are hidden in plastic slabs, so you can't even get the look at them that you really need. I'll throw out the T206 Wagner as an example, ONLY because there were so many of you who couldn't tell by looking at hi-res images while it was in a slab;i.e-I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that if you had it raw in hand, you'd have a better chance.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by Runscott

I hate hearing 'mint for its age'. Grades have nothing to do with age; otherwise, I have a whole pile of Indian Head cents that are 'mint for their age', plus one that is actually 'mint'.

Hell, I'm mint for my age.

How about "Book Value"? A card in VG condition that has a listed NM value of $1000 does NOT have a BV of $1000 (with the "but I'm selling it for $200, so you're getting a deal" implication).

Sadly, I think this "book value" listing method for cards NOT in NM (or EXMT, for pre-war cards) is the accepted norm now.

[deucetwins]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I'm not sure I follow your logic. If you felt that PSA has got it wrong 3 times now, why do you keep trusting them to do it again?

If you took your car to the shop for a repair and they didn't get it right the first time, would you pay them again to fix it a second time? Third time? Fourth time? Maybe it's just me, but I'm funny about paying for the same service over and over if I felt it wasn't done right to begin with.

Are you talking about TPG's, Strip clubs, or marriage?

[MattyC]

Oh now that's brilliant. Bravo, man. Postathaday.