Old Vintage Antique Baseball Cabinet Photo Kansas City Blues Team 1898 Champions

[Fred]

Did anyone else see this auction? Was the price realized about where it should have been? I'm not a big "photo" person but I was contemplating bidding on this. Now that the auction is over I figured I'd "out it". How much does the damaged mount affect the price of the photo?

Thanks!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140913153734...84.m1423.l2649

What I liked about it was that a few of these players were part of the N172 offering.

[Jacklitsch]

I may be off base here but it doesn't look 19th century to me.

Uniforms and lack of any facial hair looks later.

If Count Campau is in that picture, then it's likely 1898. (That doesn't mean the photo itself is definitely from that period, but that's when the original image would've been taken). Campau played for the Kansas City Blues of the Western League in 1896 and 1898.

Just checked out Baseball-reference.com and it appears that most of the players in this photo match the roster for the 1898 team.

[slidekellyslide]

I think that's a great price for that photo even with the damage. Someone got a great deal.

[Fred]

The seller indicated it came from the Klopf family. I asked if there was any paperwork/provenance that could be provided, but there wasn't. The seller also sold a glove that was supposed to have been used by Klopf. The person that won the photo also picked up the glove. Again, no paperwork proveance, but a really cool pick up if the glove was really from Klopf.

I'm fairly certain the photo is real and period. I was hoping to find out from any photo collectors/experts that could tell me what something like that would typically sell for and how much the price is affected by the damage (broken off bottom right corner of the mount).

Thanks for the responses so far.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Jacklitsch

I may be off base here but it doesn't look 19th century to me.

Uniforms and lack of any facial hair looks later.

I agree with Steve that it doesn't look like an 1898 mount - nor does the design of the photo (player names, etc.). I actually have two photos of early 1900's KC Blues teams (one mounted) that both look older than this one.

I'll go out on a limb and say that it's an early 1900's item (1905-1915) that uses an image of the 1898 team. It's definitely the 1898 KC Blues.

[bcbgcbrcb]

My guess would be teens to twenties as far as when that photo was actually produced.

[drc]

I know nothing about the team, but if it's a famous team and rare it would still have value even if it was from the early 1900s. If the player provenance is correct, that would raise the value.

The damage to the corner is a significant value problem, but if everything is on the up and up about the photo (including the provenance) and the photo is rare to unique, the buyer probably got a fair deal. The caveat being that I haven't seen the photo in person and haven't given here an opinion about age or authenticity, and am just musing about value. Player provenance, if it can be shown, and it it's unique or, say, one of three known examples, that would be a big thing towards the value.

I have seen where old but later reproductions (by old I mean, for example, Civil War image made in 1895, rather than made in 1965) have sold for good money, but it's when the subject is famous and the overall photo is well done and looks good (display value) and usually when it was made by an 'official' or otherwise known professional photography studio. If a reproduction is old enough, it in and of itself is an antique.

From my personal collecting sentiment I'm not a fan of later made photographs, but I know there are collectors who will pay good money for quality examples.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by bcbgcbrcb

My guess would be teens to twenties as far as when that photo was actually produced.

Yeah, you're probably closer to the actual age.

1915 photos of the 1915 team on 1915 mounts wouldn't bring that much, even if in good condition, so I don't see a later image of the 1898 team, in poor condition, being worth that much.

But if you are buying it for your collection, and can't find a good image of the 1898 team, then you could do worse.

[oldjudge]

Probably not period but I like it and would probably pay close to the realized price for it. Campau was the only player ever to lead two leagues in HRs in the same season.

[Runscott]

Okay, I'm going to eat crow.

I have in my possession a cabinet photo from just prior to the Spanish-American War, with almost exactly the same mount design. It's a photo of a bunch of guys clowning around in an Alabama photography studio, just before heading off to Cuba.

I remember thinking when I received it, that the mount looked more like something from the 1900's, but since then I've never actually seen this mount in a positive-date 20th century cabinet.

I'll post mine when I can get it scanned.

[drc]

Never dismiss the possibility that the photographer was a visionary, ahead of his time mount-wise. Or had a time machine.

Oh wait, he was from Alabama. Never mind.

(I allow myself to joke about other states, as I'm from Wisconsin which itself is the butt of jokes)

Mounts were generally factory made and bought not made by the photography studio, and one can look back at sport, non sport and even your family photo mounts to get an idea of the era of a mount.