The 2006 National

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Posted By: Bernardini Fan

thanks for sharing..

..wish it was more glory for ya'll that went that extra 3000 mile haul.

especially sad to hear no big bad D cards on the loose.

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Posted By: anthony

seen a lot of great cards...lots of crap...and not as many people as i thought...i heard someone say it was pretty slow campared to yesterday...lots of t206s like someone else mentioned...met leon, nicest guy at the show...prices were so-so, about 1/2 the vintage tables were high and the other 1/2 were fair with a little mark up...overall, i had a good time!

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Posted By: ErikV

Here's a few pics from the National.

Entrance and Corporate Booths



McNall/Gretsky Wagner and Ruth Jersey



Indy Find (far left) Scott and Leon's Table (right)



One table with quite a bit of vintage material



1911 Red Sox Jersey and BMW Table with 2 T206 Wagners

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Posted By: Cobby33

I had a great time, as it was my first one.
True, I didn't find anything "spectacular," as it seems those items don't even hit eBay - they're reserved for the Mastro, REA, etc. auctions.
I didn't find a whole lot of "great deals," but I did find a good deal of Vintage materials (about what I expected).
I hear dealer attendance was about 1/2 of previous Nationals, as well as a smaller crowd in general, which is fine, since I didn't have to fight many people to get a good look at the tables.
Enjoyed meeting Leon and Scott as well- thanks for the Tip-Top, Leon!

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Posted By: Rich M

Just back after 3 full days in Anaheim. I stopped by nearly every table. Leon, I apparently didn't see you. Didn't know you were there or I would have said hello. I met & interviewed Dave L about his Indy find and will have it at SportsCollectorsDaily.com within a couple of days as well as a few other pieces.

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Posted By: David McDonald

Just returned home to Honolulu from Anaheim. It was my first National so I can't compare it to others. Maybe with more experience in the hobby I might be more critical but I spent two days roaming around the Convention Center and I had a hell of a great time. First off, the place was about the size of Rhode Island and there were tables as far as you could see. Sure, you had to wade through a lot of disdainful ersatz memorabilia and, sure, everything was probably overpriced (and, sure, the skies over Anaheim were a weird carcinogenic grey and the whole area is sort-of psychosis inducing), but there were still more vintage cards than I'd ever seen by a factor of, say, a million. The auction houses, in particular, had stuff that was stunningly beautiful, all your high-end Jacksons and Cobbs and Ruths, cards I'll never see again outside of a catalogue. What a treat! If your goal at a card show is to find esoteric, niche cards, maybe this National would come up short. If you're a wide-eyed newbie like me, it was big fun to pinball from one tableful of old cards to another.
It was also big fun to meet so many folks that prior to Friday were for me only "virtual" people. Wow, you guys are really real! Pleasure to talk story with Max W. and Super Jennifer, Trevor Hocking, Ryan Christoff, Jack Goodman, Bill Cornell, Adam Warshaw, David Bryan, Hardeman and Son (God Bless you guys and your great magazine), Rockin' Leon Luckey. A knowledgeable and congenial bunch and sterling people all. And it was nice to be around people who ask me what I collect, not why. Anyway, biggest problem I had at the National was to stop motoring my mouth (my wife calls me "a man of few words" but I think she's being sarcastic) long enough to look at cards. There was a lot of territory to cover and two days wasn't near enough time. (I thought it was plain dumb to close the show at 6pm, especially on Friday). Paying for stuff was another problem. While some venders accepted VISA and even Paypal, most only would take cash or checks. Wished I had my checkbook because the ATM limited withdrawals to $400 a day and that didn't cut it. I was hoping primarily to find T3's but they were in short supply so did some impulsive shopping instead. Under the watchful eye of Mr. Warshaw I picked up a beautiful T227 Honest Long Cut boxer, Adolph Wolgast. Bought a Toleteros Moose Skowron (Yay!) from Ryan Christoff (Paypal bucks on the way; Thanks, brah). Found a cherry Joe Wood Sporting News supplement buried under a pile of stuff. Due to aforesaid lack of cash finances I will receive a couple more things in the mail once I pay for them, including a 1923 Paulins Candy card of hockey great, Newsy Lalonde. Will post everything in due course.
Also got a bunch of cards graded on site by both SGC and PSA. That was a very instructive experience, kind of like comparing having dinner at a great restaurant and at the Jack-in-the-Box Drive-thru. A special note of appreciation to the SGC crew: I needed to cross some D304's from PSA to SGC and my PSA2 Wagner came back as SGC20/1.5. Oh well, I thought, **** happens, they have a reputation for being right so tough break. But not ten yards away at the Lelands booth was another SGC20 D304 Wagner which was heavily creased. Side by side mine was way better looking, but same grade. I went back to SGC, grader said my card was borderline 20/30 and he had gone with the 20. Long story short. They cracked the card out and bumped it up to 30. I love these guys.
Another National in my future? Honolulu is a long way from anywhere and even further from Cleveland. Still I hope to go to another National someday. Next time I will plan to stay for the whole show and I will bring my checkbook. I will also do some homework and review my Goudey and Topps sets for cards that I'd like to upgrade so I can be more focused and less impulsive in my card hunting. Mostly I will look forward to re-aquainting with all you collectors.



Mastro Booth


A few consigned Mastro goodies


'61 Yankees: not a card, not vintage, but I liked it


Ryan Christoff: In spite of his deathglare Cuban avatar, Ryan is a true gent.


Smokey Jen Ettinger and Cool Papa Weder: Jennifer should be cloned (there is no higher compliment). Max is from Saskatoon. How cool is that!


Wonder what the Wagner Gretsky would be worth.


The Ultra-Rare '52 Topps Mantle


The Katella Deli Pastrami Reuben Find. Washed down with a killer vanilla malt. Might not be kosher but it was AWESOME !! Guy next to me at the counter asked if I was going to the Chair.

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Posted By: Griffin's

Looks like there won't be Anaheim to bitch about in '09- word is it has been moved to Houston.
Wednesday was definitely the big day for buying and selling. Thursday and Friday looked fairly sparse, other than in the corporate and autograph areas. I don't think it has to do as much with venue as it has to do with ebay and auction houses offering a better alternative.

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Posted By: jay behrens

I think the National would be better served if they picked just one venue and stayed there. ComicCon, GenCon and other hobby's biggest shows are held in the same location year after year. Then again, maybe if the National is made totally irrelavent, then the Ft Washington/Willow Grove show could take over as the hobby's premiere show.

Jay

Growing old is not optional, growing up is.

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Posted By: jackgoodman

Was at the National Wednesday during setup, and all day Friday and Saturday. Legs are gone so Sunday is not going to happen. Besides have to do real world work to play catch-up.

Had the opportunity to finally meet our fearless moderator dude and his table partner Scott,John Billingsley, Dave McDonald, Bob Binder and several others. Would be proud to call all of them "friend." Probably passed several other Net54'ers in the aisles but alas, there were no Net54 bumper stickers to wear this year. Unfortunately didn't make the dinner.

Crowds did seem sparse compared to my memories of past Nationals - good for the attendees, not so good for the dealers. Someone above mentioned and I agree, the National has evolved (devolved?) into a corporate sponsor, auction house, grading company and autograph venue with the dealers thrown in as an aside. (The autograph area was one of the few areas of the convention that was crowded.)

With several tables unmanned, I felt sorry for the dealers in the far back corners of the room. Could have driven a tractor thru the aisles in back and not hit anyone.

But did I have a good time? Yes I did. Will I go out of my way to travel next year or the year after to go to a National out-of-state? - No.

And on a grading note, had several cards graded by SGC. Always nice people and great service mentality. They indicate that their Santa Monica on-site visit was successful and they plan to repeat again in a few months. They will probably post something on the board. Jim Spence mentioned that he may consider joining them in their visits.

And finally, I have a set of T212-3 that were obtained from the original collector that have about a quarter of the cards with a stamp on the back (factory stamp?). SGC indicated that they would no longer grade down for the stamp as a "MK" but would instead indicate on the flip that the card had a "stamped back" or something of the sort - but not grade down for it. I thought that was good news, at least for me.

Anyway, gotta go do some real work now. Will post scans of some of the cards I got graded in the other thread later, just to be able to participate in that thread too.

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Posted By: Josh K.

Hey Jack - with regard to sgc grading down for marked cards, does that include any type of stamp or only cards that have a stamp recognized in the hobby - such as the toy town stamp?

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Posted By: jackgoodman

Josh,

We were specifically talking about the blue or purple stamp that is often found on the Obak issue. Appears to be some sort of factory id stamp. But I agree that the toy town type stamps should be considered the same way. I didn't bring up the toy town stamp nor did they mention it. So I don't know their thinking on that issue. Jack

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Posted By: DJ

Nice photos David and thanks for sharing! That pastrami sandwich looks like heaven!

DJ

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Posted By: Bob

Great, since I had SGC slab my entire 1910 Obak Series of 150 set a year ago and they were brutal if the cards had the tiny factory blue stamp on the back, the timing is awful for me. At least for others they will get the benefit of this new policy which only makes good sense.

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Posted By: BcD

I'll post em later on when I can. lots of fun after show hours as well!

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Posted By: warshawlaw

I would also prefer a single site for the show; San Diego sounds good to me!

For all the criticism of the show, there was a ton of great stuff there, provided you could ferret it out of the piles of shiny crap.

The vintage dealers I spoke to nearly all said that they were having great shows. Some even left early because they'd sold so much already.

The best part of the show was the socializing, turning virtual relationships into face to face ones. For that reason alone the National is worth attending. There were times at dinner I laughed so hard I nearly passed out.

I acquired a bunch of interesting items, many of which will go onto my web site and BST once my scanner is back up.

I had one really funny incident on Saturday. I was looking at a major dealer's big booth of autographed manufactured memorabilia (crap) for the umpteenth time while passing by and I saw what I instantly recognized as a very rare and very valuable 19th century silk (real silk) of a boxer. The item had been removed from its vintage mount; they were mounted like cabinet cards originally. I asked to see it and the lady (who I learned was the dealer's wife) showed it to me. I asked "where's the rest of it?" She glowered and said that her husband pulled it out of the mount and, as she understands it, left $2000 on the table that way. I agreed and said more, which made her even madder. She said "Make us an offer; maybe he'll take it to get this out of my sight". I offered $200. She went to him and started chewing him out; I got it for $250.

The L.A. Times ran a very unflattering article on the hobby on Saturday, focusing on the difference between 100,000 at the show in 1991 and 35,000 today (a difference they completely misunderstood) and the 75% decline in the new card market (which as we all know merely represents rational decisionmaking). Vintage was given only a passing reference as still popular. It is probably on line.

Edited to Add: I also had a nice last-minute buy. I was on the way out Sunday and found a smallish group of T206's at a nondescript table. I picked up a Steinfeldt orange bg (really orange), an EPDG common in vg-ex, a Piedmont common with the red Sweet Caporal back design printed over the front sort of sideways, an Evers blue BG (Cubs; finally the last Evers I needed) and a front miscut. Must've been the last unpicked T206 lot in the place.

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Posted By: Bob

Just heard Keith Olberman on ESPN and he really dogged the National. Said the enthusiasm and card selection were poor and the show was a disaster. Of course he hated all the shiney stuff but said the older stuff was disappointing.
Don't kill the messenger, that's what I heard.

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Posted By: Dean H

My first National was very positive for me. It was a pleasure meeting Leon, Scott, Bill, Quan and even BcD!! I did have SGC cross a few of my cards. I know this is no shock to most here but SGC exceeded every expectation I had. I was very impressed and now understand why they have the reputation they have earned. Thanks SGC.

I did pick up a nice 39 Play Ball DiMaggio SGC 4. My budget was not what I hoped it to be but I had a great time anyway. Thanks again to all.

Dean

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Posted By: jay behrens

I would have a gone bu a bunch of people took a vote and decided to ban me

Jay

Growing old is not optional, growing up is.

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Posted By: BruceBabcock

Taking nominations for weirdest booth at the National.

I can understand the "Buy Yourself a Fireproof Safe" booth. Also, the "Collectibles Insurance" booth. But the "Dried Fruit" in bags booth? The autograph removal booth? The "Take Car of Your Spine booth? The "benchwarmers International" booth (where you could get your picture taken with a scantily clad young female)? The "Sharpie" booth? I guess Sharpies are now the autograph pen of choice but how many pens can you sell?

At one of the mystifying corprate booths a guy was entrancing the young crowd with the story of how Wagner hated tobacco and that's why the T206 Wagner is so rare - while holding a T206 Walter Johnson in his hand. One of the dealers I know questioned the wisdom of selling ice cream cones on the floor, as ten-year olds with triple scoops leaned over his display cases.

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Posted By: Anson

I was genuinely surprised at the number of tables that didn't have enough material to cover the cost of their tables. Seeing that most of these were from back East, it makes you scratch your head. I don't think you can sell enough Sammy Sosa 90 Leaf rookies!

I also had the joy of a PSA dingus chasing me away in a not-so-pleasant tone. Apparently I was in the field of view (30 ft behind) while they were taping an Orlando interview. Needless to say, I had a few choice words with him.

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Posted By: Gary Nuchereno

Jay that was really funny. Thanks for the laugh

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Posted By: Sean

hey guys is the national ever going into illinois???? because i live in illinois and i really want to go 1 and get some cards like all of you did probalby a couple of old judge does anybody know the price for 1 old judge thanks!????



Jordan & CO.

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Posted By: Turner

The 2008 National will be in Chicago I do believe.

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Posted By: Sean

okay thanks! and next year its going to be in cleveland right??


does naybody know what there going to show at the 2008 national

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Posted By: Josh K.

"does naybody know what there going to show at the 2008 national"

Allow me to take a stab at this one . . . umm, baseball cards.

Sorry, couldnt resist.

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Posted By: Sean

well i knew that but what KIND of baseball cards are thay gonna show like the ULTRA RARE ones OR SUPER RARE you know the goodies

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Posted By: barrysloate

How would anybody know what's going to be at the 2008 National? It's only 2006 right now. Maybe by 2008 the world will be inhabited by androids and they will only collect virtual cards. You never know.

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Posted By: George H. Counter

Sean, unless you are Bill Gates son, you better start with the small and cheap stuff.

You haven't even touched a single T206 and you are already asking about ULTRA RARE cards.

Ask your dad to buy a vintage card for you on ebay and start from there.

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Posted By: Turner

Sean,

George has a good point.

I started out with a Fergie Jenkins 1970's card a few years ago and started working backwards to pre war items as I've gotten older .


Now that I'm 14, I am just trying to pick up some pre war items that I enjoy and I love to see in my collection each day.

For me collecting is not all about the "Ultra rare" cards that I obtain.

(Although that would be nice, getting one at a cheap price of course)



Turner Engle

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Posted By: Sean

actually i have touched a T206 i have 4 of them from ted and brian they gave me them dan kravitz ssaid he would give me some and then i gave him my address and he never gave them me yet and i gave him the address like on june 27th a long time ago

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Posted By: warshawlaw

No one wants to read a post that runs on.

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Posted By: Bob

Sean- How come you aren't playing baseball somewhere? When I was 14 I played ball every day, all day long when I wasn't doing chores for my allowance. I played in a Babe Ruth league at night, practiced a couple of times a week but other times played sand lot ball with the neighborhood kids, many of whom were either on different teams or no organized teams at all. I quit collecting baseball cards at 13, having discovered sports of all kinds, girls, and other fun things to do. You are too young to become obsessed with cardboard.

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Posted By: Sean

my baseball season is over for this year and now and then i play baseball with mmy friends next year i will be playing another season of baseball making it my 8th year of baseball playing

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Posted By: joe brennan

Sounds like some of you had a fun time at the Nationals. As for the last few posts. Sigh.........

People said it was a million dollar wound. But the government must keep that money, cause I ain't seen one red sent of it.

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Posted By: George H. Counter

Sean, Ok.
You have 4 T206s which is a great start.
I'm sure most of us here didn't have the luck to start with 4 of these little treasures.
Why not stick to them and try to learn more about the players pictured instead of posting about Harry Wright cdv's and massive old judge collections?

And by the way, if you are going to bitch about some guys that didn't send you cards (GIFTS) in an overnight envelope, you are going to lose a lot of hobby friends.

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Posted By: Sean

oh ok............................................

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Posted By: NickM

I didn't pick up any pre-WWII cards or memorabilia there (the oldest thing I got was a graded 1953 Bowman FB card), but I had a blast, and picked up a mix of post-war vintage, modern, memorabilia, and giveaways.

There is little reason to come to the National looking for the things you can find every day on eBay. They will probably be a lot cheaper on eBay. It's where you come to network, have fun, and look at (and hopefully buy or sell) things you can't get readily on eBay.

Even if you look down on modern cards, recognize that the manufacturer giveaways (VIP admission package freebies and booth distributions) are saleable/tradeable and have (sometimes very significant) value to other collectors. The autograph tickets from the VIP package also had value to a large group of other collectors.

Nobody knows every area of sports collectibles thoroughly, so there are always items that you might find really interesting but never knew about until you see them in person. The National has far more such items than any other show. Looking at tables that have items outside your collecting area (at least once you're done going through those tables in your collecting area) can prove very fruitful and enjoyable.

Nick