Burdick, Buck Barker and Corson letters

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Posted By: leon

Since there are a lot of new board members lately I feel some might like to see these letters I acquired. They are from the Walt Corson collection (who sold his collection to Frank Nagy) and was one of the hobby pioneers....they are large so can be read easier...enjoy...

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Posted By: barrysloate

Besides the obvious error under T206 citing the Cobb with Hustler back, also note that there appears to be an addendum just above T205 which notes missing Blair and Wood, neither of whom are in the set but are end panels in T202. Could he have thought at that time that because of the shared design, T202 and T205 contained the same checklist of players?

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Posted By: Dan Koteles

coulds you imagine what they would give to the chatboard. Some of it looks similar in conversation here at times.

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Posted By: anthony

i didnt notice before but i like how "buck" refers to the pitcher in the "cincinnati reds uniform"...pretty neat

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Posted By: robert a

Perhaps the t206 portion refers to the uncertainty of whether or not the ty cobb and hustler backs belong to the set.

Or is it a checklist of what he has...and he's stating that he hasn't found those two yet, but has found a carolina brights?

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Posted By: Larry

This was a great and productive post, these historical letters are fabulous, anymore of them Leon????

Here is the entire hobby evolving in front of us again...

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Posted By: paulstratton

Cool stuff. Any idea how much of this correspondence is still floating around out there?

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Posted By: leon

Mr.Corson passed away in about 1960. The index card is a small part of his checklists but one I feel is most relevent to this board. I will probably put the rest on my website soon....under the personal collection at

http://www.luckeycards.com

Since I got this a year or so ago I have wondered if this might be the source of where the "Hustler" T206 originated?...It probably went back to at least Mr.Burdick (just a guess) though....glad ya'll like them as much as I do.
One thing that was interesting too was the way they were acquired. I had won the N167 Ewing on ebay and became friendly with the Lowe's (ebay sellers). The ebay gentleman is Jeff (a valued board member) and his esteemed dad, Mr. James Lowe, who has authored many books on Postcards. (google him and you will see) He is about 78 years young and has been doing this for somewhere around 50-60 yrs. He was the actual friend of Walt. Walt it seems, was friendly with the forefathers mentioned. Mr.James Lowe and I eventually spoke after corresponding with Jeff several times (btw, hi Jeff). He asked me if I was interested in attaining these? This is one of the really great gentlemen I have ever spoken with. When you speak with him you get that feeling you are speaking with an elder. Very "old guard" and honorable. The way things should, and used, to be. I feel it's a great priviledge to converse with these type of folks. At any rate I digress. We had to figure out what the letters and checklists were worth. Kind of tough since they are unique. Included was, a well used, The American Book of Checklists, Charles Bray, 1950. This is what Mr.Corson used to do his own checklists in. He also used many loose leaf pages which I was trying to acquire also. I believe I spoke with Barry Sloate and Rob Lifson and maybe Kevin Struss, about these, trying to get a value. There could have been a few others too so I apologize for leaving your name out. I think I ended up paying about $400 for everything and we felt that might be a tad below market. He said whatever I felt would be fair was fine with him and he just wanted to help the hobby....what a great man. I feel fortunate to have met him. Jeff, please say hi to your Dad for me if you read this...

best regards

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Posted By: JimB

Barry,
Slight correction: I don't think he was claiming a Cobb card with Hustler back, but was adding two backs to the known T206 back list: Ty Cobb and Hustler. Of course he was wrong about Hustler since no baseball players were ever found with with the Hustler back.
JimB

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Posted By: mark macrae

Great post Leon. The way I interpret the file card is that it looks like a combination want-list / have-list. Many collectors from the pre-computer age carried around similar notecards. In the earlier checklists (prior to the 1970's) , Hustler was listed among the T-206 backs. Since no modern collector can support the existance of a Hustler backed T-206, it's probably a safe assumption that this was either an innocent typo from many years ago, or that a 'paste-over' was discovered at some point (perhaps in the 30's), similar to the T-206 Wagner batting pose which was discovered by Frank Nagy & Dick Reuss in the mid 1970's. Initial close examination (i.e professional opinion of the time) determined that it was authentic, until Nagy or Reuss decided to toss it in a tub of water and voila, 2 seperate pieces soaked apart.... How many people would have the 'guts' to try THAT today if an authentic looking T-206 Hall of Famer with a Hustler back turned up.....

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Posted By: barrysloate

You are correct Jim, he was listing two backs. I read through it too quickly.

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Posted By: John S

I recently acquired this 1928 Anonymous (possibly Star) Candy issue of Rube Wagner. On the reverse is Burdick's short description "first I ever saw probably unlisted candy card". The card was purchased from an individual who bought the card from Burdick in the early 60's.

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Posted By: Dylan

Ive always wondered if a T206 ever was discovered with a hustler back what kind of excitement and price it would generate on the market, any guesses?

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Posted By: Joann

Hey Leon - know what would be kind of a cool companion piece to the first letter? A set of the 10 K134 Columbus cards. From their titles they sound like they could be cool cards, and only 10 needed to match the list in the letter.

J

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Posted By: Randy Trierweiler

I had the honor of knowing Mr. Barker. I started collecting in 1968 and by the mid 1970s, the St. Louis Sports Collectors group was in its infancy. We would meet a couple times a year at the Holiday Inn in Edwardsville, IL. Later the group moved to the St. Louis side as interest really grew in Sports Collectibles. Mr. Barker was a legend back then. He was the answer man when cards surfaced that nobody could identify. I was only 15 years old at the time and quite nervous about striking up a conversation with him. He put me at ease right away. I told him I was working on a 1963 Fleer Baseball set and couldn't find the checklist. I told him I've never even seen one. He said he thought he had an extra one laying around and would send it to me. A week later I got the checklist in the mail. No note or anything, just a free 1963 Fleer checklist. I probably saw him 10 more times before he died. He always remembered my name and would ask what sets I was working on. Whatever the set was, he gave me tons of information on the set. He was a virtual walking baseball card encyclopedia. In the mid to late 1970s, he would walk in to the St. Louis shows a couple hours after they opened with a shoebox or two of cards. The entire floor would flock over to his table to see what he had. Hunter Weiners, T206s, T202s, caramels, regionals, you name it. Some things you may not know about Mr. Barker: He died on November 24, 1982 from complications of gall bladder surgery and a removal of a tumor. He rode his bike for 37 years to his job as an Engineering Supervisor at the National Lead-Titanium Pigment Division in St. Louis. He was a dog lover and often gave them dog biscuits when riding his bike to work. He was a great man. Randy Trierweiler

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Posted By: barrysloate

Randy- that's a great story and I am sure those are memories you will keep forever. When you described the work he did and that he died of a tumor I couldn't help but make a connection between the two. But what a way to grow up in the baseball card hobby.

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Posted By: Randy Trierweiler

Hi Barry, it really was a great way to "grow up" in the hobby. I was fortunate to have a role model like Buck Barker. He was respected by everybody, kind of like you are, around here. The 1970s were a fun time for me. I had a column in "Sports Collectors News" an SCD type newspaper before SCD was born. It was called "Randy's Ramblings". I wrote an article in 1976 on-get this-TOO MANY SETS BEING ISSUED!. I lost those back issues in a move many years ago. I haven't been able to find them since. Any other veterans here remember "Sports Collectors News"? Mike Bondarenko was the publisher, from Wisconsin.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Thanks for sharing that letter. It is like looking at the stone tablet version of the Ten Commandments.

I have some Barker stamped cards somewhere, I need to dig them out.

Frank.

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Posted By: Rich Klein

And I hate to use this a BST trade (sorry Leon) -- but one of the few things in my life I regret selling was a Post Cereal card from the Barker collection which he had written his name on it. If you have any of those cards reasonably priced (after you find them); I'd love to purchase one

Rich

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Posted By: leon

Great story. I really wish I could have met some of these hobby pioneers. I am sure they did it for the love of the game and because they loved collecting with friends.

Mark M.- Funny how things get verified as we talk about them. This morning I was reading a Trader Speaks from April 1976. The T206 Wagner batting, Piedmont back, was mentioned as a new discovery and was touted as real. It had been looked at by 2 paper conservators, and a few hobbyists, and deemed authentic. I guess they hadn't done the tub test yet .

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Posted By: Randy Trierweiler

Hi Leon, "For love of the Game" is right. I tried to follow Buck Barkers lead. When setting up as a dealer in St. Louis in the early 1980s, I always tried to spend some time with the younger collectors and answer their questions, just as Buck treated me.

For anybody interested in knowing more about Mr. Barker the January 1983 issue of Baseball Hobby News has 3 stories on him, shortly after his death.

Mark Macrae: Thanks in advance for sending me 2 of my articles in Sports Collectors News from 1976 that I've been looking for.

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Posted By: Harry Wallace (HW)

Wow. What a great post you guys. Thanks for sharing the scans and the stories.

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Posted By: Ed Ford

The Buck Barker legacy lives on. Randy is modern day role model for hobbyists. Many years ago he tracked me down as I was his chief rival for much of the oddball Cardinal material at various shows, ads etc. Long story short, I now consider him my best friend both inside the hobby and out. We have shared so many wonderful experiences cheering on and collecting cards of our favorite team. Point is that there are currently many wonderful people/friends in this hobby that may even rival the legends.

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Posted By: jay wolt

RANDY - since you're an old school St Louis card guy.
Do you remember a collector/dealer Jerome "Mimi" Alongi?
I had many a dealing and conversation with him 25 or so
years ago.
He use to advertise in SCD now & then.
Thats how I found him.
A true gentleman and a knowledgeable passionate collector.
I haven't thought about him in years.

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Posted By: Randy Trierweiler

Ed, thanks for the warm comments. My feelings are the same as yours.

Jay Wolt, I did know Mimi Alongi. When the St. Louis Collectors Group got started he was the Secretary or Treasurer of the group. Very nice guy, always dressed up and lots of jewelry. Really stood out in a crowd. Never heard a bad thing about him. I haven't seen him for a very long time. I'm not sure he is still with us. Randy

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Posted By: Rich Klein

Shows that Mimi passed on (not sure of exactly when)

http://www.southernillinoisan.com/articles/2006/05/31/local/16493672.txt