NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #151  
Old 03-17-2017, 03:49 PM
Fred's Avatar
Fred Fred is offline
Fred
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,002
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I find the victim blaming hard to understand. If your child died because their driver was drunk I don't know how many people would say their child deserved it.
Hey Packs - if you're dumb enough to let your child go off with a drunk then I guess that's what happens.

You can call those grown men victims, they were, but victims at their own choice and circumstance. Oh please, let's not twist this and say my post indicates that they wanted to die... sheesh...
__________________
fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something
cool you're looking to find a new home for.
Reply With Quote
  #152  
Old 03-17-2017, 03:54 PM
packs packs is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 8,321
Default

What do you mean let, though? These men were adults, they were also someone's children. I think you're putting a lot of distance between what happened and what it means to a family. In my opinion a drunk driver is the only person responsible for the deaths of anyone in an accident. Passengers are victims, both inside of the vehicle and outside.

Last edited by packs; 03-17-2017 at 06:10 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #153  
Old 03-17-2017, 08:43 PM
Shoeless Moe Shoeless Moe is offline
Paul Gruszka aka P Diddy, Cambo, Fluke, Jagr, PG13, Bon Jokey, Paulie Walnuts
Pa.ul Grus.zka
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Over by there
Posts: 4,691
Default

Put yourself in how Jose's mom feels, his fiance's view, but also put yourself in the position of the mother of one of his friends who died, and their fiance. It all depends on who's position your in, the view will be different.

You can say he was an idiot, or you can say he was a just a young guy given millions at a age where we all did things we wouldn't do now. Or to a lot lesser degree.

Everyone will have a different view on this, no one is right no one is wrong, it is what is, and the Marlins are paying the price as is my fantasy team....c'mon lighten up!
Reply With Quote
  #154  
Old 03-17-2017, 09:39 PM
Gobucsmagic74
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

There's no definitive right or wrong answer here. If anything, I hope at the very least there's a lesson to be learned, to be passed down from one generation to the next, which simply put is that life is precious and that nothing (not one damn thing) is everlasting or guaranteed. My son just turned five and is very athletic and competitive and he's just recently started climbing on shit, and by shit I mean everything. I don't want to be this hovering parent (I'm recently divorced, so when he's with me he's mine) but when he gets up on the tabletop all I see is disaster. I mean literally all that would have to happen is loss of balance and a backward fall on tile and everything could change in an instant. I feel for everyone in this particular situation, it's unfathomable to me but maybe in the wider scope there's a lesson to be learned. I honestly just can't imagine, and the thought of putting myself in any of these parent's shoes is beyond heart wrenching, regardless of who's to blame

Last edited by Gobucsmagic74; 03-17-2017 at 09:51 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #155  
Old 03-18-2017, 06:25 AM
1952boyntoncollector 1952boyntoncollector is offline
ja.ke liebe.rman
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/mysetregistry/set/348387
Posts: 5,738
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe View Post
Put yourself in how Jose's mom feels, his fiance's view, but also put yourself in the position of the mother of one of his friends who died, and their fiance. It all depends on who's position your in, the view will be different.

You can say he was an idiot, or you can say he was a just a young guy given millions at a age where we all did things we wouldn't do now. Or to a lot lesser degree.

Everyone will have a different view on this, no one is right no one is wrong, it is what is, and the Marlins are paying the price as is my fantasy team....c'mon lighten up!
There is a right and wrong in what you can recover under the law though. People also vote to change what the law is so the opinions when translated to votes do matter. Thus, there has to be a policy on this and people cant just 'agree to disagree' The driver should be responsible and we need to stop victim shaming. If we prevent people from driving vehicles under the influence this all stops.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-cut-half.html

Is this girl to blame for being a passenger in a car where the driver had a .10 but said he had 'two beers' and is a police officer. She was 21, how is she supposed to know that he was drunk.

Last edited by 1952boyntoncollector; 03-18-2017 at 08:17 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #156  
Old 03-18-2017, 09:11 AM
orly57's Avatar
orly57 orly57 is offline
Orlando Rodriguez
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Miami
Posts: 979
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred View Post
Hey Packs - if you're dumb enough to let your child go off with a drunk then I guess that's what happens.

You can call those grown men victims, they were, but victims at their own choice and circumstance. Oh please, let's not twist this and say my post indicates that they wanted to die... sheesh...
I took this horrible event as an opportunity to teach my three young sons. Yes, they were grown men, but they were also probably star-struck young men who felt privileged to be in the presence of a superstar. They probably felt that they would look "uncool" if they didn't go along with Jose's crazy request to go out on the boat at night or if they told him to slow down. I made much dumber decisions in my early 20's than I ever did as a child. Let's all take the time to sit our children down and remind them to have a mind of their own, be leaders, rather than followers, and to take a stance even when it is not popular or cool. I can't imagine how I would feel if I lost a son due to the stupidity and irresponsibility of another. That has to be exacerbated when that same irresponsible person is getting streets named after him and all of the pity and national attention. Just a horrible thing that happened. All we can do is teach our kids, so hopefully they don't make the same type of mistake.

Last edited by orly57; 03-18-2017 at 09:16 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #157  
Old 03-18-2017, 10:40 AM
hcv123 hcv123 is offline
Howard Chasser
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NY
Posts: 3,422
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector View Post
There is a right and wrong in what you can recover under the law though. People also vote to change what the law is so the opinions when translated to votes do matter. Thus, there has to be a policy on this and people cant just 'agree to disagree' The driver should be responsible and we need to stop victim shaming. If we prevent people from driving vehicles under the influence this all stops.
Good luck! I pray for that level of possibility. One basic tenet of human nature is self sabotage - it is THE lifetime battle of human being - the only thing that varies is method and extent of the sabotage. HUGE battle from teen age to 30 (and beyond).

Driver responsibility - YES! Passenger responsibility (excepting force or lack of knowledge of the drivers state) - YES!
Reply With Quote
  #158  
Old 03-18-2017, 02:00 PM
Fred's Avatar
Fred Fred is offline
Fred
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,002
Default

Orlando, that's it! You get it! Teach your kids the right thing and to make the best decisions.
__________________
fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something
cool you're looking to find a new home for.
Reply With Quote
  #159  
Old 03-18-2017, 03:57 PM
Snapolit1's Avatar
Snapolit1 Snapolit1 is offline
Ste.ve Na.polit.ano
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 5,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by orly57 View Post
I took this horrible event as an opportunity to teach my three young sons. Yes, they were grown men, but they were also probably star-struck young men who felt privileged to be in the presence of a superstar. They probably felt that they would look "uncool" if they didn't go along with Jose's crazy request to go out on the boat at night or if they told him to slow down. I made much dumber decisions in my early 20's than I ever did as a child. Let's all take the time to sit our children down and remind them to have a mind of their own, be leaders, rather than followers, and to take a stance even when it is not popular or cool. I can't imagine how I would feel if I lost a son due to the stupidity and irresponsibility of another. That has to be exacerbated when that same irresponsible person is getting streets named after him and all of the pity and national attention. Just a horrible thing that happened. All we can do is teach our kids, so hopefully they don't make the same type of mistake.
Probably the most important lesson my father taught me was to walk away from situations that made me uncomfortable for any reason, not giving a crap who maligned me or called me names. Think for yourself and don't go along for anything you don't want to do. Speak up and walk away. Be your own man as you say. I've more than a few times refused to get into a car of someone wasted. Tried to take their keys away and if they were insistent just tell them I wanted no part of it.

Last edited by Snapolit1; 03-18-2017 at 03:57 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #160  
Old 03-18-2017, 04:10 PM
clydepepper's Avatar
clydepepper clydepepper is offline
Raymond 'Robbie' Culpepper
Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Columbus, GA
Posts: 6,928
Default

delete
__________________
.
"A life is not important except in the impact it has on others lives" - Jackie Robinson

“If you have a chance to make life better for others and fail to do so, you are wasting your time on this earth.”- Roberto Clemente

Last edited by clydepepper; 03-18-2017 at 09:19 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #161  
Old 03-18-2017, 05:02 PM
JollyElm's Avatar
JollyElm JollyElm is offline
D@rrΣn Hu.ghΣs
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 7,331
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by orly57 View Post
I took this horrible event as an opportunity to teach my three young sons. Yes, they were grown men, but they were also probably star-struck young men who felt privileged to be in the presence of a superstar. They probably felt that they would look "uncool" if they didn't go along with Jose's crazy request to go out on the boat at night or if they told him to slow down. I made much dumber decisions in my early 20's than I ever did as a child. Let's all take the time to sit our children down and remind them to have a mind of their own, be leaders, rather than followers, and to take a stance even when it is not popular or cool. I can't imagine how I would feel if I lost a son due to the stupidity and irresponsibility of another. That has to be exacerbated when that same irresponsible person is getting streets named after him and all of the pity and national attention. Just a horrible thing that happened. All we can do is teach our kids, so hopefully they don't make the same type of mistake.
I'm old, but can you adopt me?
__________________
All the cool kids love my YouTube Channel:
Elm's Adventures in Cardboard Land

https://www.youtube.com/@TheJollyElm

Looking to trade? Here's my bucket:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/152396...57685904801706

“I was such a dangerous hitter I even got intentional walks during batting practice.”
Casey Stengel

Spelling "Yastrzemski" correctly without needing to look it up since the 1980s.

Overpaying yesterday is simply underpaying tomorrow.
Reply With Quote
  #162  
Old 03-18-2017, 05:06 PM
1952boyntoncollector 1952boyntoncollector is offline
ja.ke liebe.rman
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/mysetregistry/set/348387
Posts: 5,738
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by clydepepper View Post
Guys! I wish we could just drop what is quickly becoming an ugly fallout to a tragic occurrence.

Things like this happen every, single day...just with lesser-known folks involved.

Let's let those directly involved mourn and go forward with our lives as they should if we were the ones directly involved.


Everything else belongs - at least - in the water cooler area.


The New Season starts in TWO weeks!

Strap Yourself In and concentrate on the GAME!
I pretty sure the Marlins players arent just going to forget Jose this year. There will probably be patches and honors about him, which will bring all the other issues in the discussion as well. You cant have one without the other.

Last edited by 1952boyntoncollector; 03-18-2017 at 05:07 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #163  
Old 03-18-2017, 08:49 PM
Gary Dunaier's Avatar
Gary Dunaier Gary Dunaier is offline
"Thumbs Down Guy"
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 785
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CMIZ5290 View Post
While tragic as this incident is, the truth should be known as an example for our younger kids on what can happen when you think you have it all...
Agreed. This should be the "legacy," if that's the right word, of Fernandez' death.
__________________
The GIF of me making the gesture seen 'round the world has been viewed over 375 million times!
Reply With Quote
  #164  
Old 03-19-2017, 04:05 PM
Joshchisox08's Avatar
Joshchisox08 Joshchisox08 is offline
J0$H B^ck!ey
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: C0nn3cticu+
Posts: 1,943
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I don't think that's entirely true though. Getting on a boat with someone who was drinking isn't the same as signing your life away. I don't think it's right to blame a victim either. The two men aren't dead because they were drinking or doing drugs, they're dead because Jose Fernandez was drinking and doing drugs.
This sounds like what a lawyer would say. Sounds about as concrete as you can get about the situation as well.
__________________
429/524 Off of the monster 81%
49/76 HOF's 64%
18/20 Overlooked by Cooperstown 90%
22/39 Unique Backs 56%
80/86 Minors 93%
25/48 Southern Leaguers 52%
6/10 Billy Sullivan back run 60%

237PSA / 94 SGC / 98 RAW

Excel spreadsheets only $5
T3, T201, T202, T204, T205, T206, T207, 1914 CJ, 1915 CJ, Topps 1952-1979, and more!!!!

Checklists sold (20)

T205 8/208 3.8%
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Now Jose Fernandez is going to need Tommy John surgery the 'stache Watercooler Talk- ALL sports talk 18 05-15-2014 05:56 PM
Ivor-Campbell killed in an automobile accident FrankWakefield Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 13 08-04-2009 07:38 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:45 AM.


ebay GSB