Casey Stengel.....the original "Mr October"....TRIVIA

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

On the eve of October......it's a good time to talk about BB players, who wear the title of "Mr October" for their clutch hitting
in World Series play. I nominate Casey as the very 1st player. He played in the 1916, 1922, and 1923 WS and batted .393 for
his 28 at bats.
As his 1940 Play Ball card tells us, he hit two game-winning HR's to beat the Yankees in the 1923 WS. What this card doesn't
tell us, is his first HR was in 9th inning of the 1st game and it was an inside-the-park HR. It also was the very 1st HR in World
Series play at Yankee Stadium.

Stengel's .393 in WS play is impressive, as his regular season career BA = .284. However, it is by no means the highest WS BA.


Who can name the player with the highest WS BA (for 25 to 50 At Bats) ?

Then, the highest WS BA for 51 to 100 AB's ?

And, the highest WS BA for 100+ WS AB's ?

I framed this TRIVIA quiz into 3 segments....since obviously the real "Mr October" (while not having the highest BA stat.) will be
evident by his consistent hitting over many World Series games.





TED Z

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Posted By: Anonymous

51-100 ABs...Pepper Martin?

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Posted By: Fred C

Molitor (50-99)
Gehrig (100+)

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Posted By: Anonymous

I just looked it up...Molitor and Martin both had at bats in two World Series and both went 12 for 24 once and 11 for 31 once for a cumulative .418 BA.

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Posted By: Fred C

Ok, I'll admit I cheated on this one - BB (are the initials of the 25-50 AB player).

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Posted By: Fred C

There is no way in heck I'd have guesse who BB was. Talk about obscure...

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Posted By: PAS

I always thought Pepper Martin had the career record?

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Most BB encyclopedias require a minimum of 50 AB's, and therefore, Pepper Martin is the guy with the high BA of .418 (55 AB).

However, you really want to look at the guys who have over 100 AB's in WS play; in order to define the real "Mr October".

TED Z

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Gee, I was hoping for more responses....don't we all love BB trivia ?

Oh well....here are the .400+ hitters, who have at least 24 AB's in World Series play.


BAvg.....AB........Player

.458......24......Max Carey

.439......41......Bobby Brown

.423......26......Rusty Staub

.418......55......Pepper Martin

.414......29......Robin Yount

.409......44......Hal McRae


OK guys and gals....I leave it up to you to tell us at least 5 - "Mr October's", who have the best STATS with the highest # of AB's
in World Series play ?


TED Z

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Posted By: Ralph

Hank Gowdy as in 1914 they Braves swept the Philadelphia Athletics 4 games to none.Gowdy only had 11 at bats compiling 6 hits,3 doubles 1 triple & a Homerun & was walked 11 times meaning he was on base 11 times & had a batting average of .545 & a slugging pct. of 1.273,I understand the miniumum of at bats being 24 but it sure was no fault he only got 11 plate appearances.His Career overall W.S. Batting avg. was .310 with 42 plate appearances & 13 hits.I think Gowdy was actually the first to be given the nick ,"Mr. October".Just my two cents

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

I think I have an Exhibit card of Hank Gowdy... I might try to dig that out in a few days.

Here's a letter Hank wrote to a kid, along with the envelope. A good Gowdy autograph.

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

Ted, someone guessed Gehrig, that's not right?

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Dusty Rhodes had a pretty good WS in 1954...

Game 1, pinch hit HR in the bottom of the 10th off of HOFer Bob Lemon.

Game 2, game tying pinch hit single in 5th, HR in the 7th off of HOFer Early Wynn.

Game 3, pinch hit 2 run single in 3rd inning.

Game 4, celebrate championship...

Dusty was 4 for 6 with 7 RBIs, 2 HRs, and a walk. A pretty good 3 days, September 29th through October 1st. They could get those games played back in the good old days.

This photo was my grandfather's. He lived in a small rural town in the country, but he could see baseball in the big city of Hopkinsville, KY, a few miles away. Dusty played for the Hopkinsville Hoppers of the KITTY League before making the major leagues. I think Dusty was a representative for a distillery and would make calls on liquor stores in the off season. My grandfather got this from Dusty. The photo is a PMT that is the image used for Dusty's 1955 Topps card, card #1. A few years ago I had a photographer copy the photo, omitting the blue ink signature. I then sent a few prints to Mr. Rhodes, told him about how my grandfather... asked him to sign one of the new ones for me and for him to keep the rest. So I now have one signed for me, plus this one.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Yogi Berra has 71 WS hits, I think that is still tops.

Berra and Frankie Frisch have 10 doubles, is that still tops?

Mantle's 18 WS HRs I think are tops (it annoys me when folks want to add in the DS and CS stats, WS is WS!!). I saw Mantle's last one in 1964, game 7. A happy day for me!!

Lou Brock's .391 average is pretty good, 14 stolen bases, .655 slugging... (difficult to steal much with that kind of slugging, not many bases left ahead of you...).

I think Reggie Jackson probably still is tops in slugging, when Reggie was done he was first, .767; then Ruth, .744; Gehrig, .731; All Simmons, .658; then Brock in 5th place.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Hank Gowdy was a pretty good player and indeed he was one of the first to have a great WS; as, you well noted.

But, I hope you appreciate that I'm trying to consider career STATS over the player's entire career WS performance.

Otherwise, I could have singled out Ruth's 1928 WS performance where he hit an amazing .625....with 3 HR's in 16 official AB's.

I will defer to you, though, as far as one WS performance goes....Gowdy preceded Stengel as "Mr October".

Thanks,

TED Z

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

You have identified two of the more recent Mr October's....

Lou Brock .391 in 87 At Bats

Reg Jackson .357 in 98 At Bats

And, I agree we should add Mantle to the mix, although in his case, BA doesn't do it for him. His
leading WS records of 18 HR's, 40 RUNS, and 40 RBI's certainly qualify him for Mr October status.

TED Z

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Posted By: Howard

How about Home Run Baker as the original "Mr. October"? Didn't he get his nickname for hitting World Series HRs?

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Posted By: Fred C

Peter,

I guessed Gehrig as one of the answers to the three part question. Gehrig had the highest BA for players with over 100 WS AtBats.

Pretty amazing what some players did in the few at bats they might have had. I'd have to figure to accumulate 100ABs you'd have to play in a few different WS. Lets say the average WS is 6 games and that a player averaged 4AB per game. That would take 4 full series and he'd still not have reached 100ABs and that doesn't account for any walks.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

FRED C

You are absolutely correct....Gehrig is on my list and indeed his BA = .361 (for 119 At Bats) with 10 HR's.

HOWARD

Baker is also on my list....his BA = .363 (for 91 At Bats) with 3 HR's.

TED Z

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

FRANK W

You are correct, Yogi Berra leads all with 71 hits....also, most World Series played (14) and most AB's (259).

Yogi also has the most World Series Rings as an active player (14).


Speaking about Yankee catchers, lets not forget Thurman Munson.......

He batted .373 with 67 AB's....

.520 in 1976 WS

.320 in 1977 WS

.320 in 1978 WS

TED Z

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

At last....George Herman Ruth....the ultimate "Mr October"

OK, he's not up there with these others in terms of BA, but none can compare with Ruth in the October classic.

1st....Ruth pitched in 3 WS games (3-0 record); and, amazingly he pitched 29 consecutive scoreless innings.


2nd....his Stats are certainly impressive......

AB = 129 (41 games)

BA = .326 (would be .350 if the years he pitched with Boston are discounted)

HR = 15 (twice hit 3 HR's in a WS game....1926 and 1928)

Slug. Avg = .744


Also, let's consider Ruth's cousin....one of my all-time favorites....Johnny Mize....as a 13-year old, I will never
forget the 1952 WS and how Johnny Mize single-handedly beat the Dodgers.

AB = 15 (5 games)

BA = .400

HR = 3 (Furillo reached into the RF stands of Yankee Stadium and stole a 4th HR off Mize's bat).

RBI = 6

Slug. Avg. = 1.067

Needless to say, Mize was the World Series MVP


TED Z

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Posted By: Gilbert Maines

As a 9 year old, I will never forget what Vic Wertz did in the '54 World Series. Yeah, there was Dusty with all the heroics and Willie with the catch (off of Wertz). And while the Cleveland renouned pitching staff was in hiding, Wertz single handedly took on the Giants and put on a great show. Come on, tell me he didn't hit five hundred.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

You're correct....Vic Wertz batted .500 in the 1954 WS....8 hits for 16 AB's (2-dbls, a triple, and a HR).
But, all everyone remembers Wertz for, was his 450 ft. drive to CF that Mays caught.

Otherwise, Cleveland's offense was AWOL and their great pitching staff was AWOL.

TED Z

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

And after Willie caught it, Mr. Durocher came out to change pitchers...

The outgoing Giant pitcher, Don Liddle, told the one entering, "I got my man, you get yours." Or words to that effect. He kindly signed a 3x5 for me when I wrote him about 10 years ago. He passed away in 2000, at the town of his birth, Mount Carmel, IL.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Everyone raves over Willie's great catch of Wertz's long drive....but, not much is said of his great throw back
into the infield. My recollection is that his throw doubled-off a runner. Do you recall the details of that play ?

TED Z

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Posted By: ItsOnlyGil

Ted - doubled the runner? It was an amazing throw, moreso than the catch to me. But I believe that the throw simply prevented the runner from advancing two bases on the catch. It would have doubled the runner if he tried to score from second.

But you are right. The throw was amazing. To turn and throw with authority from a dead run in the opposite direction is an example of one of the best ever. We are lucky to have watched him. And Williams. And Spahn, and more.

There are very few who could have caught that ball. I wonder if any of them could have then held the runner to a single base tag up. Or maybe I am wrong - did he double the runner? Nah. Impossible.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Lary Doby was first up for Cleveland in the 8th inning of game 1 of the 1954 World Series, he drew a walk off of Sal Maglie. Al Rosen was next up, he singled off of shortstop Al Dark's hand, Doby stopped at second. Don Liddle and Marv Grissom were warming up, it was a 2-2 game at this point. Mr. Durocher waved in Liddle. Vic Wertz hit the drive to center over Mays and past him, but he went back and made the catch, then wheeled around and made that throw... Doby tagged and went to third on that, Rosen returned to first. Majeski was announced as a pinch hitter, Durocher waved in Marv Grissom. "I got my man, you get yours."

In the tenth, for the Giants, Mueller struck out and was tagged by the catcher. Mays walked and stole second. Thompson was intentionally walked. Then Dusty Rhodes hit that home run down the right field stands, down the line.

As the Ol' Professer would say, "you could look it up!"

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Posted By: ItsOnlyGil

Even tho they just witnessed The Catch, The Shot Heard Round the World was still echoing in their minds. You can't pitch to Thomson, in this situation. But this was Dusty's Series. All choices were wrong.

The Giants were on a mission. They alone had to maintain the NYC streak of never letting an outsider win even one World Series game. And that streak lasted for over 40 consecutive World Series games.

Look it up.


But wait - Gil has the players wrong. It was Hank Thompson, not Bobby Thomson who preceeded Dusty to the plate.

It always seemed to jumble, these names - Bobby Thomson, Bobby Hofman, Hank Thompson.

So Hank was given a pass, because it was good baseball (not because anyone other than Gil can not tell Hank from Bobby - particularly since Bobby was with the Braves for the '54 Series). With Willie on second, first base open and one out, you set up the DP. That is, except in 1954 with Dusty on deck.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Thanks for clarifying the evemts on that October day in the Polo Grounds.

Frank.....I forgot that Sal "the Barber" Maglie was pitching that day. Sal was always in the midst of big events. Of course he was the
opposing pitcher that glorious day I played hooky and saw Don Larsen pitch his perfect WS game. Maglie pitched a great game for the
Dodgers that day....but, it wasn't perfect.

What is the Trivia quiz regarding Maglie ?


TED Z

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Posted By: Howard

Ted, wasn't he the only guy to play for all of the New York teams before expansion?

Howard

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

You are correct.....Maglie pitched for all three NY teams in the 1950's.

OK, who wore all four NY teams' uniforms ?

TED Z

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Posted By: ItsOnlyGil

Ye Ol' Perfesser is my guess.

But ain't this where the thread started?

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

I think Casey Stengel wore all 4 uniforms while the teams were in New York... It get's a bit more complicated when you follow the Dodgers and Giants west.

Durocher got into the Yankee's, Brooklyn Dodgers, and New York Giants uniforms... I don't think he made it into a Mets' one though...

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

You are the TRIVIA KINGS for the day.

TED Z

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Posted By: Pennsylvania Ted

Good point about Durocher. Many don't recall that Leo started with the Yankees in 1925.

TED Z