SGC no longer grading t206s?

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

I think this is much less true with vintage, especially prewar. Very few people are buying 100+ year old cards purely for profit, just like I dont think anyone buys a Monet or Picasso solely for profit. They may be investing in the art, but I bet every Monet-owner proudly displays their painting and looks at it often with pride and awe. Once you get to the cards we discuss here, you likely have an appreciation for them, their scarcity and history, their relevance, etc. I think those people who progress from modern to vintage are investors who learn to really appreciate what they are investing in, and thus, take on attributes of a collector. And I do think people (perhaps many), of all ages, will walk backwards down the number line from modern to vintage; this is exactly what happened to me 30+ years ago

I would put vintage baseball cards into the same general group with vintage art, coins, stamps, toys, comic books, and antiques in general. If these other collectibles continue to experience heavy interest, and appreciation (which is a positive gauge of interest) then the future of vintage baseball cards will be fine.

Nobody collects 1878 Carson City silver dollars for the sake of nostalgia, and same for tobacco cards. Nobody alive today saw Rube Waddell pitch.

[obcbobd]

Originally Posted by Mark17

I would put vintage baseball cards into the same general group with vintage art, coins, stamps, toys, comic books, and antiques in general. If these other collectibles continue to experience heavy interest, and appreciation (which is a positive gauge of interest) then the future of vintage baseball cards will be fine.

Nobody collects 1878 Carson City silver dollars for the sake of nostalgia, and same for tobacco cards. Nobody alive today saw Rube Waddell pitch.

Is the market for stamps strong? I found a book full of stamps from around the world, 1940 or so. Put it on eBay for $25. No interest.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by obcbobd

Is the market for stamps strong? I found a book full of stamps from around the world, 1940 or so. Put it on eBay for $25. No interest.

I would imagine even if old, they have to be the right stamps. I know nothing about stamps. But like that, it's hard to explain to people who know nothing about baseball cards that even if certain junk wax cards are "old", that alone doesn't make them worth something.

[Lobo Aullando]

The top end is somewhat stable, yet I think overall it's in long-term decline. And while there are so many century-old stamps available on the market, coin dealers are having trouble keeping inventories up. (Just try finding decent condition Barbers for a reasonable price.)

I do have this theory that all the psychic energy that's so OCD about centering has migrated from stamps to sports cards. Being off 0.1 mm shouldn't matter, but it seems like those of us that feel that way are getting out-voted.

Originally Posted by obcbobd

Is the market for stamps strong? I found a book full of stamps from around the world, 1940 or so. Put it on eBay for $25. No interest.

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I would imagine even if old, they have to be the right stamps. I know nothing about stamps. But like that, it's hard to explain to people who know nothing about baseball cards that even if certain junk wax cards are "old", that alone doesn't make them worth something.

I think Steve B is a better authority on stamps. I believe the common stamps and foreign have little interest. However the inverted Jenny's, rare variations and United states issues do hold value. At least the paper its printed on! Aka the currency

[cammb]

Originally Posted by nineunder71

Further, what I find funny, is that if Tony would have seen the same video of graders, but it would have been a room full of 60 and 70 year olds at the grading tables, I think there is a good chance he would have just assumed those older graders had experience.

However, the chance or % of the older graders being just as ignorant of vintage cards as the young ones, and just being there for the job, would probably be similar

Haha

Just my two cents

No. You missed the whole point. I have been subbing to SGC for years. I sub only vintage. They were pretty consistent with their grades. What I said was their quality of grading has subsided due to the hiring of graders right off the street. In the video I saw, the initial graders looked pretty young. The grading for vintage has declined while modern remains high. I know an ex/mt or NM when I see one but to constantly get or see grades at vg/ex is suspect. My theory is quality control is lacking in an effort to push the product out.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by obcbobd

Is the market for stamps strong? I found a book full of stamps from around the world, 1940 or so. Put it on eBay for $25. No interest.

It's strong but polarized.

The good stuff is doing really well, although it depends on what it is.

The vast majority of stamps made between 1930 ish and now are very common, possibly because it was such a popular hobby during the depression.

There are exceptions both ways, some areas like most of South America are not popular, and were very common beginning in the 1890's and sometimes before.
The salespeople for the banknote companies they hired to print their stamps often had the country buy 50,000, and bought another 50,000 for themselves.

[toledo_mudhen]

Just received the following response from Brent at SGC regarding the grading of T206s:


Hi Lonnie,

I can confirm with 100% certainty that we are still grading T-206 cards. There was just a simple misunderstanding in regards to a specific card on a customer's order that caused some confusion.

Brent Martin
Collector Support
800.742.9212
www.gosgc.com

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Nice post G1911. Thank you

Regarding this statement "Not to be dark, but I think it is reality that an influx of young collectors is needed or as the aging vintage collector base dies out they will get pennys for the dollar on their stuff."

Here is what I know, why I disagree, and why I have put a good deal of money into very old and rare vintage cards over the past 6+ years: I started collecting in 1983 and lived through the junk wax era, eventually getting out bc things made no sense (like now). I got back into cards in 2000, sold out in 2003, and got back into cards in 2015 (and still actively collecting). That is almost 40 years in and out of the hobby. The one thing that is true over those 40 years is that the good cards are worth more today than were in the 1980s, many by multiples and multiples, and each time I got back into collecting the good cards were worth more than the last time I collected. By "good cards", I mean HOFers and rookie cards of retired stars and HOFers.

40 years spans is a pretty long time. And Ruths, Cobbs, T206s, as well as Nolan Ryans and Frank Robinsons are more expensive now then ever. If history is an indicator of the future, and it often is, the "good cards" will continue to retain value, and likely increase, over the next 40 years. Well, that's what I am betting on.

All that said, sometimes I find it very hard to look at what cards are selling for and not think "man, I should just sell everything." Especially when I consider your thesis may end up being correct. However, there are two reasons I do not (i) l I would rather have the cardboard than the paper, right now and (ii) I fear if I sell something I will never be able to get ot back (or it ma cost me triple to get it back).

From 1980 until now, there have still been endless people in the age 40+ range who treat baseball as America's pasttime. But given the significant changes in major sports' popularity here (especially with kids) since around the '90s began, you can't assume that the next 40 years will be the same.

Basketball and football rule the roost in this country now. Little kids care as much about playing soccer as they do little league.

I wish this wasn't the case, as no one else loves the ol' diamond more than I do. But it could make the future of baseball collectibles somewhat shaky, especially once my age group (47) starts to thin out

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

From 1980 until now, there have still been endless people in the age 40+ range who treat baseball as America's pasttime. But given the significant changes in major sports' popularity here (especially with kids) since around the '90s began, you can't assume that the next 40 years will be the same.

Basketball and football rule the roost in this country now. Little kids care as much about playing soccer as they do little league.

I wish this wasn't the case, as no one else loves the ol' diamond more than I do. But it could make the future of baseball collectibles somewhat shaky, especially once my age group (47) starts to thin out

I guess time will tell.

[kaddyshack]

I can concur with Lonnie. Brent Martin emailed me and said SGC is grading T206s, but not the blank back ones. I plan to submit soon.

Roy Z.

[profholt82]

Originally Posted by obcbobd

Is there a huge influx of younger collectors. Leon's recent poll does not seem to show that. I don't run into too many under 30's when looking through vintage at shows

While I'm sure the numbers are still overwhelmingly older collectors for vintage, I doubt that poll accurately reflects the current collector scene because most younger (under 30) collectors do not use traditional collector forums such as this one. They would most likely be using social media platforms such as Facebook and Instachat (and probably some other thing I dont even know about, ha) as their internet collecting meeting places of choice. I think net54 is probably off the radar of most younger collectors. And through the covid boom, we've seen a massive surge in young people entering the hobby, it only makes sense that some of them would gravitate toward vintage.

[FrozenInferno]

I keep seeing the SGC video referenced earlier in the thread, are we talking about the Sports Card Investor tour of the office?

Because they never actually showed the grading room. They showed basically every department BUT the grading room.

The rooms full of college age looking people were the research and assembly departments. Identifying cards, prepping them for slabbing, shipping, etc. Nobody in that video was actually grading a card.

In a follow-up video where the SCI guy had some cards graded they actually brought out one of the senior graders (who was not present in any of the other rooms they visited) to explain why his cards got the grades they did and he was a middle aged guy who had been grading with the company for years and years. That’s not to say there aren’t 20-30 year olds in the grading department but I would almost bet anything that they’re not handling the higher profile or vintage stuff. They’re probably cutting their teeth looking at 200 of the same 2019 Topps base card and grading ultra modern stuff all day.

If you need to see 50+ year old people prepping and slabbing cards to be satisfied with the grading process well, I don’t know what to tell you.