Very interesting reading

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Oh Oh Ryan--shouldn't have said that--it seems about the time that the great dealer apologist--Colt McClelland--weighs in on this issue.

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Posted By: James Feagin

Charlie or anyone who personally knows JP Cohen, is he around 35-36 years old?

James

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Posted By: Cobby33

So does this mean we should throw away all the cards we've purchased from Memory Lane auctions? What's the point?

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Posted By: JimCrandell

James,

I do--that is his approximate age.

Cobby,

You have got to be kidding.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Yes, that is exactly the point. Throw away all the cards won from Memory Lane auctions. Oops wait, here's a different point: don't buy from them in the future. Can't decide which one makes more sense or which more obviously follows the above posts. I'll have to think about this for a while.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Here's a photo of the Memory lane JP:

edited to remove huge photo.

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Posted By: Jay

Who is Ryan?

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Charlie,

I had assumed since you and Andrew had bought things from me on several occasions and asked me to ship them directly to JP Cohen of Memory Lane Inc, that you were doing business with him. In addition when I had noticed you list this card only to have JP list the same exact card immediately after you ended your listing, I just assumed that you were doing business with him.

Well it is at least good news to hear that you are not Pai Gow partners.

Greg

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Posted By: E, Daniel

simply that you can choose to not fatten his bank account further?
So many places you can buy material from, if the scuttlebutt thus far is true - wouldn't you rather direct your monies somewhere else? I mean, telemarketing money out of people for good causes, and then keeping the vast majority yourself is kinda slimy, no?


Daniel

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Posted By: JimB

Jim Crandall,
While we are crucifying Colt McCelland and Brian Drent, why don't we crucify everybody that ever bought or sold a card through Memory Lane since they all must be equally guilty. Jim, your crusade is verging into the realm of slander.
JimB

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Posted By: leon

Agreed...this isn't about everybody that knows this dispicable person. It's about the person that did terrible things....Also, for the record, had I known everything I know now I certainly would have posted this myself. No way would I cover for this or ask it not to be posted. best regards

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Posted By: Charlie Barokas

Greg,

Let me say again. I am in total shock. J.P. has been nothing but a great guy to me personally and I have no reason to believe he is involved in any of this.

However, the information provided seems to indicate it is the same guy. He may have been involved but to a much lesser degree.

Personally, I hope these allegations are false for many reasons.

But if he was involved in scamming charities, I will have to reevalute my position.

Charlie

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I hate to show sympathy for anyone who would scam people out of money but 15 years old and mentored by a con artist is probably going to leave an impression hard to shake.

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Posted By: leon

I am very empathetic to situations but did I miss something? Didn't some of this happen in the last 5 yrs or so?

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Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Peter,

You're right. It isn't fair to lump Brian Drent in with JP Cohen, especially with what we now know about JP Cohen. I won't go back and edit my post, but only because I don't believe posts should be edited. I do regret posting it in this thread. The implication that it leads to isn't fair to Brian.

It was JP that said they were friends, not Brian. Maybe they just knew each other because they both had similar sized auction houses. When I dropped the cards off, Brian wasn't even there and I'm not sure he ever even saw them.

I disagree with you a bit about the "guilt by association" part, though. If some guy I know is a scumbag and you say you're friends with him, it doesn't necessarily mean you're a scumbag, but you have less credibility than someone else. Once I know you more, I can decide for myself, but until then, you're that guy that's friends with a scumbag.

The problem here is that it was the scumbag that said he was friends with the other person, not the person who said he was friends with the scumbag.

I'd like to apologize to Brian for what conclusions could be drawn from my post. I'd have no problem with it being deleted, either.

Also, to clear it up, the JP Cohen I know is a scumbag whether it's the guy in these stories or not.

-Ryan

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

I think Dan's point is that 15 yr. olds are very impressionable and if they are led into this type of activity by a father figure mentor (his mother's boyfriend apparently), it arguably is understandable how a person could go astray.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

If it is the same JP and we don't know if it is, but judging from the information in the article JP was only 15 when he was hired by a con artist to work for him. He evidently was in business with him for the next 14+ years. I know that I got my morals from my mother and father. It sounds like JP may not have had a father in his life since this con artist was his mother's boyfriend. I don't excuse any wrongdoing, but I can feel some sympathy for someone who was brought up in a life of crime.

We should also state that there is ZERO evidence that Memory Lane's auctions haven't all been on the up and up.

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

Ryan you have always seemed a fair-minded person and your follow-up post confirms that impression. Just on the theoretical subject though, bear in mind that we don't always know everything about our friends, so one might well be friends with someone who is a "scumbag" but have no idea about their past, or their secret activities, or whatever. Another reason not to presume people are guilty by association.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

JimB,

Oh Oh--hit a nerve--have not said anything bad about anyone here.

I have asked a number of dealers to explain their policies---sorry if that was too much for you and Colt.

Jim

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Posted By: JimB

Jim Crandall,
Personally I like to have some evidence before I presume guilt. You go on doing things your way and I'll do mine my way. I would appreciate it if you could refrain from snide remarks, but of course that is up to you.
JimB

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Posted By: leon

I understand a 15 yr old can be impressionable. No doubt about that. When you are in your mid-late 20's and represent that you are collecting money for these worthwhile charities, and bankrolling it yourself, it's still very wrong. I can't imagine saying I am collecting money for disabled firefighters and kids in wheelchairs and then keeping the money myself.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I can't either Leon, but you and I were not mentored by a con artist.

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Posted By: Cobby33

Using the logic herein, we shouldn't buy from any auction house and forget eBay. I think we're talking ourselves out of a hobby while in search of (1) a nonexistent conspiracy theory; or (2) making much ado about nothing.

Where there are clear shams, they are brought to everyone's attention and dealt with. There are plenty of those. Why hunt for ones that likely don't exist? This is almost as bad as those morons on the Beckett boards, making false statements about the authenticity of cards, except that the overall IQ on here is considerably higher. What a shame.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

JimB,

Who am I saying is guilty and where did I say it?

I asked dealers to explain their policies. I don't think because they refused to means that they alter cards.

Colt has come in like a bull in a china shop and been very aggressive and obnoxious in his comments. Then he got in an argument with another poster and deleted everything he said.

Besides that have no idea what you are talking about?

Would you like to join us in NYC in a couple weeks in our discussions to clean up the hobby or are you happy with the way things are?

Jim

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Posted By: Sean C

From the first linked article:

===========================
According to the FTC, the defendants raised more than $24 million between 1995 and early 1999, but contrary to their representations, they provided only a small amount to the nonprofits. Steven Chinarian, another defendant, has agreed to refrain from fundraising and must post a bond before engaging in telemarketing activities, as part of this settlement

In November 1998, the FTC filed a complaint against the above-named defendants, J.P. Cohen (a defendant not part of the settlement package), and the corporate entities through which they did business, U.S. Marketing and North American Charitable Services, Inc.

============================

If he's about 35 or so now as people are mentioning, he would have been about 23 in 1995 and about 26 when charged by the FTC, not 15.

Interesting reading: http://www.bullyonline.org/workbully/serial.htm

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

Cobby what are you saying, that you don't think it's the same person, or that you think even if it is it is irrelevant to his activities as a dealer/auctioneer? Not challenging you at all, just trying to understand your point.

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

According to this link that Greg posted, he was hired in 1987 when he was 15. That squares up pretty well.
http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/news/atoz/article_1031486.php>

Edited to add:


"December 1987: Gold hires 15-year-old J.P. Cohen, the son of a girlfriend, as a telemarketer. Cohen quickly becomes Gold's top employee."

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Sean,

One of the articles said he was 15 when he began working for Gold.

Jim

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Posted By: Sean C

Not that it makes the allegations any better.

Interesting reading: http://www.bullyonline.org/workbully/serial.htm

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Posted By: Cobby33

Peter-

Don't know whether it is the same person or not, but if it is, I ask:

(a) Do we no longer purchase from Memory Lane?;
(b) What do we do with cards (graded and raw) already purchased from Memory Lane?; and
(c) Do we likewise blackball all auction houses subject to these allegations (this isn't the only one), because of the potential for some questionable cards?

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

Cobby -- damned if I know. But as I stated in a prior post, I agree that at this point there is no evidence that any wrongdoing happened with respect to cards.

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Posted By: Cobby33

Agreed!

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Posted By: barrysloate

Most of the posts here are knee jerk reactions, so I wouldn't be throwing out any cards or boycotting anyone quite yet. I don't think running a telemarketing scam correlates to selling trimmed cards, but it might be fair to say the auction house could be financed with dirty money. It's easy to stock up on nice cards when the money used to buy them was stolen from old ladies and the disabled.

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Posted By: Brad

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Posted By: rob

Guess I will throw out the wagner I just won in his auction.

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Posted By: Colt McClelland

Jim Crandall,

You are what you are, and you continue to reinforce it through posts like those. I hope you keep it up so that you get kicked out of here.

Peace be with you.

Your friend,

Colt McClelland


edited to add Jim Crandall's last name so as not to be confused with JimB, one of the truly great guys in this hobby.

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Posted By: cmoking

everyone decides for themselves. There is no "we" when you are spending your own money. Nobody is going to decide how I spend mine, nor am I going to decide how someone spends their's. With that said, here are my personal thoughts for my money:

(a) Do we no longer purchase from Memory Lane?;
I won't say no, but I will be very careful. I'll probably only bid on cards that I know are consigned and that I know the consignor. In the latest auction, I won a card which I knew who the consignor was, and that made me more comfortable bidding on it. It really limits my choices, but I'm comfortable with that decision.

(b) What do we do with cards (graded and raw) already purchased from Memory Lane?
I personally will look through my records and review all the ones that I bought from them very very very very carefully. I'll have a friend of mine who is really good at spotting altered cards and ask him to please check them out for me.

(c) Do we likewise blackball all auction houses subject to these allegations (this isn't the only one), because of the potential for some questionable cards?
Every auction house is different since they are run by different people. I'll try to judge them individually and see how comfortable I am bidding on their stuff. I know there are some auction houses that I will be very comfortable with and others that I won't bother to bid at all. But for me personally, I'll make a case-by-case decision for myself.

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Posted By: Cobby33

Very thoughtful answers. Thank you.

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Posted By: Scot Reader

DELETE

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Posted By: E, Daniel

If you do as the Dalai Lama would do whilst wading through all this doo-doo predicament, I'll do it too - and I'll take your word on it!

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Posted By: Hal Lewis

Just so everyone knows...

I have been told by someone I trust very much that it is DEFINITELY the SAME guy.

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Posted By: Dan Koteles

what the eff is a Pai gow ?

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Dan,


I'm not sure but I know I would not ask JP as he does not seem to know either.

Greg

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Posted By: Paul Moss

It's a game of poker where you make the best two hands, one two card, one five card, that both must beat the dealer's in order to win.

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Posted By: Griffin's

<<what the eff is a Pai gow ?>>

Type of poker played at the Hollywood Park casino (where the card shows were until this year) that used dice along with cards.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Wow--Paul Moss posting--Hey Paul--long time no see.

Got any 1970 Kellogg psa 10s for me(ha ha).

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Posted By: Frank Evanov

"(a) Do we no longer purchase from Memory Lane?;
I won't say no, but I will be very careful. I'll probably only bid on cards that I know are consigned and that I know the consignor. In the latest auction, I won a card which I knew who the consignor was, and that made me more comfortable bidding on it. It really limits my choices, but I'm comfortable with that decision"

King, I can't see myself doing any business with a convicted felon who scammed charitable causes. I wouldn't buy a candy bar from him, much less a valuable collectible.

Frank

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Posted By: MikeU

MemoryLane is the only auction company that does not list a single employee profile on their website. Even further, not one single individuals name or e-mail address is noted on the website.

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Posted By: David Vargha

I believe JP's e-mail addy is MemoryLaneInc@aol.com

DavidVargha@hotmail.com

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Posted By: brian

I've been a high end PSA set builder since 1996. I have easily spent over a million dollars on PSA cards(8 grade only)in an attempt to build my sets from the 40's and early 50's. I've easily consigned over a million dollars in vintage cards with Mastro, Goodwin, Memory Lane and all the top PSA dealers over the past 10 years. I've personally worked with J.P. Cohen of Memory Lane for the past ten years. J.P. Cohen is as respected within the hobby by the top collectors as much as any other dealer. How do I know this? Because the legends of our hobby like Charlie and Marshall have worked with J.P. Cohen for years and have trusted him with their personal collections. I have consigned hundreds of thousands with Memory Lane over the years and I have never ever come close to having one negative experince with J.P. Cohen. Over the years I have built a relationship with J.P. based on trust. I've certainly never spent one cent with Greg which is not to say that he's dishonest, just not close to being held in the regard that the top collectors regard J.P. Cohen and Memory Lane. Most collectors would be stunned to know some of the dealers still in the hobby that had reputations for carving up cards prior to PSA. That's the only reason I remained in the hobby, PSA at least gave me a sense of comfort versus some self serving dealer. I suggest every collector base their opinion on their personal experience, not someone's alledged background from years ago. As I mentioned, send Charlie or Marshall an email sometime.