Partially ripping a card opening the mail

[TheNightmanCometh]

Originally Posted by 7nohitter

Completely agree with Robert here. For many people, $800 is a great amount of money. I would be blind with rage if I received a card, unprotected, as the OP did.

I'd be enraged if I paid $10 for a card and it came like that.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by TheNightmanCometh

I'd be enraged if I paid $10 for a card and it came like that.

+1

[KingFisk]

Originally Posted by TheNightmanCometh

I'd be enraged if I paid $10 for a card and it came like that.

I bought a 1986 Fleer Update Doug Drabek rookie for a dollar and it came in a plain white envelope and was annoyed for a good half hour about it. Those blue borders can chip easily!

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[atx840]

After a month of waiting, $25 in shipping & $113 UPS brokerage/tax fee the Mantle ball finally arrived!

Inside, bent LOA and one loose PSA Ball Case in its original box wrapped in flimsy bubble wrapper and a smudged Mantle Signature.

[TheNightmanCometh]

Holy smokes! That's a return if I ever saw one.

[chaddurbin]

Originally Posted by TheNightmanCometh

Holy smokes! That's a return if I ever saw one.

judging by the pics, the process has begun.

as for OP i think pete bears some responsibility here, but i'm all for him sticking it to the seller for a lousy shipping job. the seller did contribute to the accident with the way he shipped the card, and it's on him to learn this expensive lesson. if he had any common sense to ship the way a $800+ card should be ship pete would certainly know where the card is situated within the package and open accordingly.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Jewish-collector

If I sold a card that expensive, I'd send it registered mail. Because sometimes you gotta say "WTF".

You would first need to own one to sell one. I tend to overnight and cross my fingers on higher dollar items. I have done registered on very expensive (5 figure) items. I would ask for at least a partial refund as I believe it was mostly the sellers fault this happened. No excuse for shipping that way. When I won 8.8k (8 qty) of E94 overprints, many years ago, all of them were stuffed into one 3 x 4 toploader. I guess it saved on weight or something. I thought it was crazy but none were hurt. Live and learn.

[bnorth]

It really saddens me to see how many people think the guy that ripped the card should get a refund.

[mrmopar]

I didn't read any of the replies yet, but I shared something similar to this on another board and the overwhelming response was that it was mostly my fault. Considering how the shipper packaged my item, I disagreed, but I was not fishing for excuses or sympathy, merely looking for how others felt.

That said, I think that any decent seller should package an item that should prevent damage in most normal circumstances during shipping and that includes stuffing something into the smallest possible envelope that it will fit in, taping the living crap out of it and then basically forcing the buyer to cut it open!

Anything shipped loose in a mailer w/o a semi rigid sleeve (at a MINIMUM) is negligent, especially when condition matters. It also doesn't cost much or anything to team bag a single card or tape the top of a holder to prevent an item from sliding out.

If anyone cares for comparison, my item was an 8x10 brochure type item that was mailed "loose" in a thin padded mailer. It had absolutely no room to move, because the mailer was just large enough to fit the item tightly. I think it may have even been slightly taller than the mailer inner edge, so that the flap needed to be folded oddly to close it, but I can't remember now. I tore across the upper 1/2 or so of corner of the envelope, not expecting my item to fill that area that is normally empty in 98% of the packages I receive. I tore a 1/4" x 1' strip off the corner of the item. It was low dollar, but was a Garvey item I needed.

I take partial responsibility for my actions, as I could have opened it up several different ways, but had the seller given any amount of thought into shipping this item "correctly", the damage I inflicted would never have had a chance to occur.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It really saddens me to see how many people think the guy that ripped the card should get a refund.

Are you serious? If so, are you the seller?

What if a card is shipped raw next to an open cup of coffee inside a big box. Is it the buyer's fault if the cup tips over?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

Are you serious? If so, are you the seller?

What if a card is shipped raw next to an open cup of coffee inside a big box. Is it the buyer's fault if the cup tips over?

Yes I am serious and no I am not the seller.

Plain and simple the card arrived as described then the OP ripped the card. How can this in any way be the sellers fault?

I have bought several 100 cards off this forum. I have gotten several of these in a PWE. Yes nothing but a raw card in a PWE. This really bothered me at first but then after reading a few threads on shipping I realized as long as it arrives without damage that is what really matters.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Yes I am serious and no I am not the seller.



Plain and simple the card arrived as described then the OP ripped the card. How can this in any way be the sellers fault?



I have bought several 100 cards off this forum. I have gotten several of these in a PWE. Yes nothing but a raw card in a PWE. This really bothered me at first but then after reading a few threads on shipping I realized as long as it arrives without damage that is what really matters.

I'll just repeat what I said earlier:

Originally Posted by 4815162342

There is absolutely no way on earth that card didn't suffer any damage in transit, even before Pete finished the job.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

I'll just repeat what I said earlier:

If it was damaged in transit that is completely different. Now please show me the post that the OP said it was damaged in transit and not by him.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by bnorth

If it was damaged in transit that is completely different. Now please show me the post that the OP said it was damaged in transit and not by him.

How would he know if a corner was dinged or if three was a bend before he ripped into it?

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Yes I am serious and no I am not the seller.

Plain and simple the card arrived as described then the OP ripped the card. How can this in any way be the sellers fault?

I have bought several 100 cards off this forum. I have gotten several of these in a PWE. Yes nothing but a raw card in a PWE. This really bothered me at first but then after reading a few threads on shipping I realized as long as it arrives without damage that is what really matters.

I could not disagree more. Shipping a raw card with no protection in a plain white envelope is not acceptable in my opinion. It is a seller's responsibility to package a card so it arrives safely. If a card is able to be torn in half simply by opening the envelope it was obviously not protected properly. If I received a card purchased from this site, or elsewhere packaged in this manner I would post pictures and the seller's ID and name to warn other members.

[irv]

Imo, this is a 50/50 or a "no fault" situation as both parties are wrong to assume it's the other guy's fault.

Seller should have shipped the card, (especially an expensive one!) much better and the buyer should have been more careful opening the envelope, especially knowing an expensive card was inside. Just my 2 cents for what it's worth?

[Eric72]

Question for the OP:

Was the envelope marked in such a way that you knew it contained something you purchased? Stated differently, did you know there was a sports card in the envelope before you opened it?

Just curious.

[markf31]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I could not disagree more. Shipping a raw card with no protection in a plain white envelope is not acceptable in my opinion. It is a seller's responsibility to package a card so it arrives safely. If a card is able to be torn in half simply by opening the envelope it was obviously not protected properly. If I received a card purchased from this site, or elsewhere packaged in this manner I would post pictures and the seller's ID and name to warn other members.

The item arrived safely into the hands of the buyer, did it not? The OP did not state there was any further or additional damage to the card as a result of the packaging other than the ripping that was a direct result of the physical action of the buyer. In my mind, the case ends there.

The OP has not posted any pictures showing the rip of the card, or the rip of the envelope which I think are important pieces of evidence in this situation. We have no knowledge of the degree of negligence that the OP had in the "ripping" of the envelope.

[Econteachert205]

Part of shipping an item safely is ensuring it won't be damaged in the process of normal opening. The envelope was opened normally. It was like setting the buyer up to ruin the card.

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by markf31

The item arrived safely into the hands of the buyer, did it not? The OP did not state there was any further or additional damage to the card as a result of the packaging other than the ripping that was a direct result of the physical action of the buyer. In my mind, the case ends there.

The OP has not posted any pictures showing the rip of the card, or the rip of the envelope which I think are important pieces of evidence in this situation. We have no knowledge of the degree of negligence that the OP had in the "ripping" of the envelope.

As is frequently the case in these buyer vs. seller threads important information is missing. Pictures would be nice to determine who is actually at fault.

With what the OP has said I stand behind my statement than if an $800 raw card was shipped in such a manner that simply opening the envelope could lead to the card being ripped in half, it was not packed properly and the buyer should be entitled to a refund through the ebay guarantee.

[irv]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

As is frequently the case in these buyer vs. seller threads important information is missing. Pictures would be nice to determine who is actually at fault.

With what the OP has said I stand behind my statement than if an $800 raw card was shipped in such a manner that simply opening the envelope could lead to the card being ripped in half, it was not packed properly and the buyer should be entitled to a refund through the ebay guarantee.

I purchased a cheap $3.00 dollar John Tavares hockey card this past spring and it came in nothing more than a regular envelope in a card saver.

I wrote the seller and told him I was none too pleased as I believe it could have been placed in a bubble wrapper, and/or wrapped in 2 pieces of cardboard, or anything better than what it was.

He replied, if I wanted a better shipping pkg, I should have requested it, which of course would have cost me more money he said.
I told him nowhere did I see this mentioned nor did it mention how this card was going to be shipped.

In hindsight, he is right. We, as buyers assume common sense will be used and a card(s) will be shipped properly, or as how we would ship them as collectors.

Going forward, I now ask, or allude to how I want my card(s) shipped and wait to see what the seller says?

My only bad experience is the JT card I spoke of, (which I left negative feedback on) but when my card arrived, I knew right away it was a card due to the unfamiliar address and after holding the card up to the light, I knew where to tear it open.

I agree with the OP being pissed, he has a right to be, but I also believe some care or extra care should have been used when he opened the envelope as I would assume most do with any envelope that arrives in the mail?

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by markf31

The item arrived safely into the hands of the buyer, did it not? The OP did not state there was any further or additional damage to the card as a result of the packaging other than the ripping that was a direct result of the physical action of the buyer. In my mind, the case ends there.

The OP has not posted any pictures showing the rip of the card, or the rip of the envelope which I think are important pieces of evidence in this situation. We have no knowledge of the degree of negligence that the OP had in the "ripping" of the envelope.

If the card would have been packaged properly (top loader or card saver sandwiched between two pieces of cardboard), do you think the card would have ripped?

[LuckyLarry]

Yesterdays mail included an eBay win for me. An off center 1961 Fleer basketball card #66 Jerry West In Action, the last card in the set. Well the seller must be an attorney because he used an envelope embossed with his firms name as the return address

Before I opened the envelope of course I thought "uh-oh" what the heck is this?

Seller only charged me $1 to ship, and the card arrived safely, and snugged in a Card Saver I. So I left positive feedback with this comment:

"I thought I was being "sued" when I got the envelope"

He just replied:

", that ensures priority delivery"

Larry

[TNP777]

Originally Posted by irv

I purchased a cheap $3.00 dollar John Tavares hockey card this past spring and it came in nothing more than a regular envelope in a card saver.

When you say "card saver", are you talking about one of those semi-rigid sleeves that people send cards when submitting to PSA, or a penny sleeve? If just a penny sleeve, then I agree with you. If in a CS1/2, then I don't see a problem with how your seller shipped your $3 card. Is a rigid holder preferred? Absolutely. A CS1/2 is far better than nothing at all, though.

In the case of the Pete's card, I 100% think the seller was negligent in how he shipped a card of that value, but I also think the Pete bears at least some responsibility in how the package was opened. Of course there is was no way he could have known the card was shipped bare, but any package, no matter how much tape or glue was used to secure it, can still be carefully opened without ripping the package. I use a either a knife to cut open boxes, or one of those letter openers (the ones you can fit a business card in) to open bubble mailers that have packing tape on them - slice right across the top, easy peasy lemon squeezy.

[sbfinley]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It really saddens me to see how many people think the guy that ripped the card should get a refund.

This is 100% on the seller. It doesn't matter if it ripped in Pete's hands. If you purchase something of value you have to be able to assume that if you open it in a reasonable manner you won't damage it. Ripping an envelope is a reasonable way to open an envelope. As a matter of fact, unless new envelopes are also transformers, it is the only way. If the card is in a toploader or cs1 it's fine, if it's between cardboard it would have been fine. Pete ripped an envelope, because envelopes have three purposes:

1) Put something in envelope.
2) Close envelope.
3) Open envelope.

They way I have been taught the steps is:

1) Insert item or document with hands.
2) Sealed with adhesive (primarily with hands.)
3) Opened with hands or sharp object.

I'm sorry it saddens you that this is the only way I've been taught to interact with envelopes.

[irv]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

If the card would have been packaged properly (top loader or card saver sandwiched between two pieces of cardboard), do you think the card would have ripped?

Originally Posted by TNP777

When you say "card saver", are you talking about one of those semi-rigid sleeves that people send cards when submitting to PSA, or a penny sleeve? If just a penny sleeve, then I agree with you. If in a CS1/2, then I don't see a problem with how your seller shipped your $3 card. Is a rigid holder preferred? Absolutely. A CS1/2 is far better than nothing at all, though.

In the case of the Pete's card, I 100% think the seller was negligent in how he shipped a card of that value, but I also think the Pete bears at least some responsibility in how the package was opened. Of course there is was no way he could have known the card was shipped bare, but any package, no matter how much tape or glue was used to secure it, can still be carefully opened without ripping the package. I use a either a knife to cut open boxes, or one of those letter openers (the ones you can fit a business card in) to open bubble mailers that have packing tape on them - slice right across the top, easy peasy lemon squeezy.

It was a rigid card saver, and maybe you're right, but it was my first card I had ever received in a regular envelope with no other protection provided.

I forget what shipping was (It was in Canada) but it more than covered what a bubble wrapper would have cost.

Like I wrote above, we as buyers are silly to "ASSUME" anything and as I once heard, the only problem with common sense is, it's not very common.

For everyone reading/posting in this thread, I think we will all be wise, going forward, to ask how our card(s) will all be shipped in the future. I assume, (there we go with that word again) that the OP certainly will be.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by sbfinley

This is 100% on the seller. It doesn't matter if it ripped in Pete's hands. If you purchase something of value you have to be able to assume that if you open it in a reasonable manner you won't damage it. Ripping an envelope is a reasonable way to open an envelope. As a matter of fact, unless new envelopes are also transformers, it is the only way. If the card is in a toploader or cs1 it's fine, if it's between cardboard it would have been fine. Pete ripped an envelope, because envelopes have three purposes:

1) Put something in envelope.
2) Close envelope.
3) Open envelope.

They way I have been taught the steps is:

1) Insert item or document with hands.
2) Sealed with adhesive (primarily with hands.)
3) Opened with hands or sharp object.

I'm sorry it saddens you that this is the only way I've been taught to interact with envelopes.

I usually have some inkling that there might be a card within regardless of the packaging.

So if the card was packed in a block of ice, I might choose to let the ice melt, rather than use an ice pick or sledge hammer.

If the card was distributed in boxes of cereal, I might choose to pour the cereal out of box until I could see and easily remove the card, rather than dive into the box with my grimy paw to search and destroy.

Or if the card was contained in one of those molded hard plastic packages that are difficult to open by any technique, I might choose not to open it at all.

And if I received 100 envelopes that day and knew there was a card in only one, I would look at the return addresses to determine which envelopes could safely opened by the "grip it and rip it" methodology, if that was the only way I had been taught to interact with an envelope.

[ALR-bishop]

Everyone seems to agree the method of shipping was completely unreasonable. Most, but not all, think the seller is responsible for the damage that occurred after the item arrived. The question I raised earlier is assuming the seller tells ebay the item arrived undamaged but that it was damaged in opening the package because the method of packing was unreasonable, what is ebay likely to do in that situation ? I guess we will find out.

I have personally come closer to damaging cards I received because they were entombed in tape and bubble wrap to protect them Patience in opening is a true virtue.

I have to say Frank, I have not yet experienced the block of ice shipping method

[steve B]

It can be debated whose fault it is.

What I can say is that had it been insured the USPS wouldn't pay out because it was packed poorly. I've seen this firsthand with a damaged phonograph that wasn't packed with enough packing material. Oddly the USPS people themselves recommended adding packing material to the package before bringing it in for inspection. "Make sure there's enough packing material in the box or we won't cover it" They did cover repairs done by someone in the business based on a quote. The reduced amount probably made it easier.

Funny story.
A friend used to sell needles for the old Victrolas. One day he gets home to find a message on the machine from the FBI. One of the buyers forgot he'd bought them and called the police about the "suspicious package" he'd just received. What was pretty cool was that by the time he'd come home the package had been "neutralized " and the agents were only wondering if they were correct in thinking the contents were Victrola needles. A quick explanation and the number of the Ebay listing cleared it all up. The guy left positive feedback and never asked for replacements for the ones that got blown up.


Steve B

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by steve B

It can be debated whose fault it is.

What I can say is that had it been insured the USPS wouldn't pay out because it was packed poorly....

No, USPS wouldn't pay out because it was delivered safely and they don't consider it their responsibility to stand by and assist the recipient in opening his envelope.

[Bridwell]

Ebay and PayPal tend to support the buyer. I agree that Pete deserves a full refund and I expect he will get it from Ebay or PayPal. It amazes me how sellers can be so careless in their packaging. Careless packaging is clearly the sellers fault, IMO.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Mark17

No, USPS wouldn't pay out because it was delivered safely and they don't consider it their responsibility to stand by and assist the recipient in opening his envelope.

The item I saw firsthand was also delivered "safely" - No apparent damage to the box on delivery. The damage was entirely due to poor packing.

A card simply placed in an envelope with nothing else is poorly packed, and proper packing is the shippers responsibility.

Steve B

[Mdmtx]

I feel badly for the op and I agree that the seller failed. But I also believe the op failed to exercise caution and the liability should be shared by each. Neither party is 100% liable or 100% clear. Maybe the best outcome would be a 50/50 deal. Just my .02.

Mark Medlin

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by steve B

The item I saw firsthand was also delivered "safely" - No apparent damage to the box on delivery. The damage was entirely due to poor packing.

A card simply placed in an envelope with nothing else is poorly packed, and proper packing is the shippers responsibility.

Steve B

Totally different situation. You're right, your item was damaged in transit. You didn't contribute to the damage (let alone cause it) because the damage occurred before it was in your possession.

The OP damaged his own card after it had been successfully shipped and delivered without damage. The seller didn't damage it, neither did the carrier. It arrived safely.

Here's a question: Suppose the OP brought the envelope with the card in it over to a coffee table and before opening it, spilled something liquid on it. Would he claim that to be the fault/responsibility of the seller, too, since had it been packaged better, it wouldn't have sustained damage?

[K-Nole]

I receive cards almost on a daily basis and never ripped or cut a card yet.
Know why?
Cause I dont manhandle the package while opening it.
You can take scissors and barely, cut just the tip of the envelope or the tip of the vanilla package.
Should it have been packaged better? Yes.
Do we live in a perfect world where it shouldn't happen, NO.
Should you rip open a package with an +$800 card in it? NO.
Should you be more careful, and not trust somebody else's packaging, YES.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by K-Nole

I receive cards almost on a daily basis and never ripped or cut a card yet.
Know why?
Cause I dont manhandle the package while opening it.
You can take scissors and barely, cut just the tip of the envelope or the tip of the vanilla package.
Should it have been packaged better? Yes.
Do we live in a perfect world where it shouldn't happen, NO.
Should you rip open a package with an +$800 card in it? NO.
Should you be more careful, and not trust somebody else's packaging, YES.

Perfectly said!

Also, I tap the bottom of the envelope on a countertop a couple times before I carefully open the opposite (top) end, to make sure the contents of the envelope are at the far (bottom) end. Isn't that just common sense?

Should the card have been packaged better? Of course, but as it turned out, that wasn't a problem. The card arrived safely. The problem occurred after the responsibility of the seller and carrier had ended.

[steve B]

I suppose my time doing shipping/receiving of heavy stuff skews my views a bit. By heavy, I mean stuff that would be around 35lbs in a box around 9x9x9.

The coffee spill example is a good one, except that a toploader between cardboard inside a bubble envelope will easily survive that and more. Postmen sometimes leave packages out, and sometimes it's not rainy when they do, but pours a bit later. Should whatever it is be packed to have a chance at getting through that? Or is a simple envelope just fine?

You should see how I pack stuff that's both fragile and expensive. The plate that sold for 600+ could have probably been driven over and been fine. Did it take a few minutes extra? Yes, it did. But lots of time less than it would have taken to go through filing an insurance claim.

Steve B

[frankbmd]

I guess that I am accustomed to receiving checks more frequently than cards in plain white envelopes, but often the checks are for funds in excess of $800.
I do not recall ever receiving a check in a top loader between two pieces of cardboard.

I also don't recall ever ripping a check while opening an envelope that contained a check. In fact I received two such checks today from board members, who will be relieved to know that both envelopes were successfully opened despite the abysmal packaging of the checks in plain white envelopes.

Absolving Pete of any responsibility in this instance is like blaming the baby on the sperm rather than the delivery vehicle. Now if the sperm was in a top loader between two pieces of cardboard, that would be a different story, I think.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Totally different situation. You're right, your item was damaged in transit. You didn't contribute to the damage (let alone cause it) because the damage occurred before it was in your possession.

The OP damaged his own card after it had been successfully shipped and delivered without damage. The seller didn't damage it, neither did the carrier. It arrived safely.

Here's a question: Suppose the OP brought the envelope with the card in it over to a coffee table and before opening it, spilled something liquid on it. Would he claim that to be the fault/responsibility of the seller, too, since had it been packaged better, it wouldn't have sustained damage?

Your argument that the card arrived safely so it's the buyer's fault is just plain ridiculous! It was the seller's negligence that caused the card to get ripped. Had the card been packaged properly, it wouldn't have ripped.

Let's say you take your car to the quick lube place for an oil change. They drain the old oil, replace the oil filter, fill the engine with new oil, but forget to replace the oil cap. A week later you blow the engine because all the oil came out through the oil fill and the engine had no lubrication. You expect the quick lube place to do something about it, but they tell you, "Well, it was full of oil when it left".

That's basically what you're telling the OP. No, the quick lube place would be responsible. It doesn't matter that it was full of oil when it left or that you drove it and blew all the oil out, it was their negligence that caused it to happen. Same case with the card. It was the sellers negligence that caused it to happen.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

I guess that I am accustomed to receiving checks more frequently than cards in plain white envelopes, but often the checks are for funds in excess of $800.

I do not recall ever receiving a check in a top loader between two pieces of cardboard.



I also don't recall ever ripping a check while opening an envelope that contained a check. In fact I received two such checks today from board members, who will be relieved to know that both envelopes were successfully opened despite the abysmal packaging of the checks in plain white envelopes.

But those checks wouldn't have lost their value if they were dinged on a corner or creased in transit.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

But those checks wouldn't have lost their value if they were dinged on a corner or creased in transit.

That's true, but to suggest that either the seller or the buyer is 100% responsible in this scenario is a stretch in my opinion.

If only Judge Judy would chime in, ..................

[packs]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Your argument that the card arrived safely so it's the buyer's fault is just plain ridiculous! It was the seller's negligence that caused the card to get ripped. Had the card been packaged properly, it wouldn't have ripped.

Let's say you take your car to the quick lube place for an oil change. They drain the old oil, replace the oil filter, fill the engine with new oil, but forget to replace the oil cap. A week later you blow the engine because all the oil came out through the oil fill and the engine had no lubrication. You expect the quick lube place to do something about it, but they tell you, "Well, it was full of oil when it left".

That's basically what you're telling the OP. No, the quick lube place would be responsible. It doesn't matter that it was full of oil when it left or that you drove it and blew all the oil out, it was their negligence that caused it to happen. Same case with the card. It was the sellers negligence that caused it to happen.

I think it's more like I handed you something that was wet and you then took a step and dropped it. You're pointing your finger at me because it was wet but I'm saying it was right in your hand.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by packs

I think it's more like I handed you something that was wet and you then took a step and dropped it. You're pointing your finger at me because it was wet but I'm saying it was right in your hand.

But in reality, if you were handing me something wet, wouldn't you say something like, "Be careful. It's wet"? You're giving me a warning. Then if I drop it, it's on me.

If the seller would have wrote on the package, "I'm a dumb ass and I don't know how to ship properly. Be careful when opening" then that would be on the buyer. In this case, the buyer didn't know the seller didn't package it properly.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

But in reality, if you were handing me something wet, wouldn't you say something like, "Be careful. It's wet"? You're giving me a warning. Then if I drop it, it's on me.

If the seller would have wrote on the package, "I'm a dumb ass and I don't know how to ship properly. Be careful when opening" then that would be on the buyer. In this case, the buyer didn't know the seller didn't package it properly.

David,

Can you differentiate between a bubble mailer reinforced with industrial cardboard and a white envelope? If not, send me pics and I will suggest a strategy to open it safely.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

David,

Can you differentiate between a bubble mailer reinforced with industrial cardboard and a white envelope? If not, send me pics and I will suggest a strategy to open it safely.

Frank, I really don't get what you're saying. The OPs card wasn't in a plain white envelope. It was shipped loose in a bubble mailer...at least that's the way I understood it.

[Jewish-collector]

If you hold the package up to a light, can you see where the card is ?

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Jewish-collector

If you hold the package up to a light, can you see where the card is ?

Either see it or feel it, I would guess.

I think most of us, over 50% that is, could figure out how to open a package containing an $800 card, without destroying it.

Those who couldn't, I am surmising, would blame someone else.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

If the seller would have wrote on the package, "I'm a dumb ass and I don't know how to ship properly. Be careful when opening" then that would be on the buyer. In this case, the buyer didn't know the seller didn't package it properly.

So now a seller needs to not only get the item into the buyer's hands undamaged, but also give instructions as to how to open the envelope?

This is why there are so many warning labels on everything - somebody buys coffee and wasn't told explicitly that it was hot, or someone falls off a ladder and didn't realize it had to be set on firm ground.

Someone opens an envelope with an $800 card and didn't realize he should handle it with care... Always somebody else's fault.

[midmo]

Originally Posted by Mark17

So now a seller needs to not only get the item into the buyer's hands undamaged, but also give instructions as to how to open the envelope?

If you are a seller that ships cards this way please tell me your ebay id so I can be sure to not purchase from you. Thanks.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by midmo

If you are a seller that ships cards this way please tell me your ebay id so I can be sure to not purchase from you. Thanks.

Every single poster here, including me, as I've stated, agrees the card should've been much better packaged. It sounds like the seller agrees too, and that he had intended to do so. So, I think your comment is misguided.

Now, if you are someone who, once your card is safely in your hands, would then rip it and blame the seller, please tell me YOUR ebay ID so I can be sure not to sell to you.