Pujols 600 Home runs!

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by bn2cardz

You came back from 3 years of inactivity to bump a 2 month old thread for no other reason than to make an adversarial assertion that you can't backup?

That is the problem with PED use, there is no way of knowing for sure no matter how many signs are there. I know I am propably on a short list but to me there is no way Tony Gwynn was not a PED user. Seriously who has their best by far top 5 years in their mid 30's?

[rats60]

Originally Posted by bnorth

That is the problem with PED use, there is no way of knowing for sure no matter how many signs are there. I know I am propably on a short list but to me there is no way Tony Gwynn was not a PED user. Seriously who has their best by far top 5 years in their mid 30's?

Roberto Clemente's best years were from 31 to 36 and probably would have continued had he not died in a plane crash.

[ALR-bishop]

Welcome back, Davino

[bravos4evr]

Originally Posted by rats60

Roberto Clemente's best years were from 31 to 36 and probably would have continued had he not died in a plane crash.

yeah, but that coincided with lowering the mound and everyone's offensive stats went up after that!


"That is the problem with PED use, there is no way of knowing for sure no matter how many signs are there. I know I am propably on a short list but to me there is no way Tony Gwynn was not a PED user. Seriously who has their best by far top 5 years in their mid 30's?"


well, Gwynn's best 6 year peak is between ages 23-29......

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by bravos4evr

"


well, Gwynn's best 6 year peak is between ages 23-29......

I would say his best 6 years was between 33 and 38 with his best year at age 37. Just my opinion using old time stats as I don't know squat about the metrics stuff.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I would say his best 6 years was between 33 and 38 with his best year at age 37. Just my opinion using old time stats as I don't know squat about the metrics stuff.

The newer metrics give you a better idea how a player did against other players playing at the same time.

For instance between 1984-1987 Gwynn had 29 more hits than the highest ranked guys combined in the span. Between 1994-1997 he had 38 less than the highest ranked guys combined in the span. In 1997

You stated his age 37 year was his best year. Metrics show it was his age 27 year. Dig deeper and you would see that in 1997 (age 37) he had a BA of .372, impressive, but only .006 higher than the next guy behind him. Yet in 1987 (age 27) when he had a lower average of .370 this out ranked the next guy behind him by 0.032.
Here are other comparisons of the two years:
1987 - 2nd OBP, 5th OPS, 3rd Adjusted OPS+
1997 - 9th OBP, 7th OPS, 6th in OPS+
So in comparison in the league in Batting he actually wasn't quite as good. WAR just gives us a quick glimpse of this without having to dig into it all.

So knowing this, of the top 5 WAR seasons only one is from when he was older than 30 and that is age 31 for his 3rd highest ranked WAR season. Yet of the top 5 WAR years for Willie Mays 4 of them are after the age of 30 (31-34). So there is certainly a case for players getting better in their 30s.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by bravos4evr

yeah, but that coincided with lowering the mound and everyone's offensive stats went up after that!
.

Incorrect. Half those seasons were before the mound was lowered. The mound was lowered in 1969 not 1966.