T206 Reference / Reflections.....Tuesday Nite Trivia

[Ronnie73]

Incredible Sovereign story. I've known of your Sovereign set from past posts over the years but never knew it only took you 11 months and that's with trying to figure out what exactly existed. One word, impressive. I'm currently at 75% complete and it's looking like Cobb 460 will be my last one on the list too.

Originally Posted by tedzan

* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *


These six are samples of some of my nicer SOVEREIGN cards


I will borrow the last lines from the 1974 movie "The Sting"......when Paul Newman asks Robert Redford (after they pulled off their elaborate "Sting" on Robert Shaw)..........
"Was that as good as it gets ?"
Redford replies..... "It's not enough" .....then smiles, and says ....."but it's damn close".

That scene reflects my feelings regarding my completion of the T206 PIEDMONT set. So, I was motivated to put together the SOVEREIGN set. This adventure was significant,
as it resulted in providing us a greater understanding of American Lithographic's printing of the T206 cards. Why did I choose the SOVEREIGN cards ?
I always favored the GREEN colored T206 backs (also I've collected AMERICAN BEAUTY sub-sets). So, I figured a SOVEREIGN set would be relatively easy to complete, since
Lundgren, Magie, Plank, Wagner, Joe Doyle Nat'l, the 48 subjects in the Southern League series, and Demmitt & O'Hara (St Louis) were NOT printed with SOVEREIGN backs.

Well, I was very mistaken. This was quite a challenge in itself. Specifically because I had to determine which T206 cards were not printed with SOVEREIGN backs (No-Prints).
However, I am very happy to say that my list of No-Prints have withstood the test of time. It took me approx. 11 months to complete this set of 402 different subjects. Refer
to this thread...... Mission Accomplished....SOVEREIGN only set

Besides the 55 subjects mentioned above, the following T206 subjects are SOVEREIGN no-prints......

Abstein
Adkins
Arrellanes
Barbeau
Barger
Becker
Bliss
Brashear
Bresnahan (bat)
Burchell
Charles
Clark
Clymer
Collins (Minn.)
Cross
Davidson
Delehanty (Louisville)
Demmitt (New York American)
Dessau
Dorner

Downey (fielding)
Elberfeld (portrait-Washington)
Engle
Evans
Fletcher
Freeman
Ganzel
Graham (St Louis AL)
Gray
Groom
Hayden
Hoffman (St Louis AL)
Hunter
Jones (portrait Detroit)
Kleinow (Boston)
La Porte
Lattimore
Lord
Lundgren (Kansas City)
Maddox

Maloney
Marshall
Mattern
McAleese
McBride
McElveen
McLean
Milan
Miller (Pittsburg)
Mullen (portrait)
Murray (bat)
Myers (bat)
Nattress
Phillippe
Puttman
Rhodes
Ritter
Rudolph
Schirm
Schlafly

Schreck
Shannon
Sharpe
Frank Smith (Chicago & Boston)
Snodgrass (bat)
Starr
Willett


This SOVEREIGN set has proven to be a very timely and significant project in that it revealed to us the following important insights
into American Lithographic's printing of the various series in their T206 production. Refer to Posts #2 & 4 here for the details.


TED Z
.

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by Ronnie73

Incredible Sovereign story. I've known of your Sovereign set from past posts over the years but never knew it only took you 11 months and that's with trying to figure out what exactly existed. One word, impressive. I'm currently at 75% complete and it's looking like Cobb 460 will be my last one on the list too.

Thanks, Ron

I acquired 5 of the 6 super-prints with the rare SOVEREIGN 460 back pretty early in the game. It took me 2 more years to get the red Cobb with the SOVEREIGN 460 back.

Wish you good luck in finding one.



.


TED Z
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[tedzan]

Hi Carl

Thanks for posting your T206 story. I always advise collectors to acquire large lots of T206's when starting their sets. So, you were very smart to pick up the large lot of 200 cards.
So, don't have any regrets. These current "crazy" prices on Cobb's (and, other major T206 stars), in my opinion will not continue. Prices will eventually fall back to normal.

And, thanks for the kind words.


TED Z
.

[tedzan]

* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *


. .
........... Two Pennsylvania guys ........


In 2006, when I broke up my 2nd set to start up the PIEDMONT set, I also began setting aside the SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 cards from the 2nd set. These SWEET CAP
cards were a low priority then in my collection. Anyhow, I chose the SWEET CAP, Factory #30 cards because I was certain 469 different subjects would complete this set. At
that point I had approx. 150 different SWEET CAP/30 cards. This 469 number was easily determined by this equation......
524 - [Joe Doyle Nat'L, Kleinow (Boston), Lundgren (Cubs), Magie, Smith (Chi & Bos), Demmitt & O'Hara (St Louis vars.), Southern Leaguers (48)] = 469

Furthermore, lengthy research figuring out those tricky No-Prints (as I had to deal with in the SOVEREIGN set) was NOT necessary with this SWEET CAP/30 set. By Oct 2008,
I had 467 different SWEET CAP/30 cards (only missing Plank and Wagner). Check-out thread.... MISSION (99.5%) ACCOMPLISHED....all-Sweet Cap T206 set

I have no illusions of ever getting the Wagner card. But, I had hopes of eventually acquiring the Plank card. Eddie Plank is one of my all-time favorite pitchers in baseball.
My patience paid off last year, when an opportunity arose to acquire a T206 collection (81 cards), which included a SWEET CAPORAL 150, Factory #30 Plank. I worked an
interesting deal with my friend on this collection. Now, as far as I am concerned, this SWEET CAP set is "complete" with 468 cards.
For more info check-out this thread.... SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 set....includes Plank


Hey guys
How's about some show-n-tell regarding your T206 collections.....we've had some very interesting stories so far.....so, tell us all about your T206 experiences.


TED Z
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[Pat R]

When I started collecting T206's I never had intentions of completing the
set and I still don't. As a matter of fact I recently sold over 100 from
my collection. I still have well over 500 T206's but nowhere near a complete
set.

I do have a fascination with print oddities/flaws though. When Steve B
started the PD150 plate scratch thread and explained how someday
they might be able to establish some sheet or partial sheet layouts I was
hooked.

I currently have 243 different PD150 plate scratches, 307 total with
the duplicates.
1.jpg
2.jpg

I also like to collect front print oddities like this Willett.
img248.jpg

Tenney with a broken Y in the NY on his shirt.
img252.jpg

Back oddities like the Fact 30's on the bottom.
img249.jpg

or a reoccurring flaws like the one found on the back of certain Brain, Ganzel and Dygert.
img250.jpg
img251.jpg

[tedzan]


Pat R.

You do have a different approach to collecting T206's than most, and it's quite interesting.

Thanks for posting,

TED Z
.

[tedzan]

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * *


Hey guys, anyone here interested in smoking a 107 year old American Beauty cigarette
.
.................. Some of the really tough to find AB 460 cards in this sub-set ...................


Since 2005, my AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 project has been a work in progress to complete this 74 subject run....... AMERICAN BEAUTY's....T205's and/or T206's

Prior posts here tell of my 3 "completed" T206 sets since 2005. But to date, I have 70 of the 74 subjects** needed to complete this AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 sub-set.
This run is tougher than most T206 experts rate it. After 12 years, I still need Camnitz (arms above head)....L Doyle (portrait)....McGraw (portrait-cap), and
Tinker (bat off shoulder)

The Exclusive 12 guys are the easiest AB 460 cards to find. But, certain cards are extremely rare. Besides the 6 examples shown above and these 3 here....there are
Lajoie (bat), Lake (ball), McQuillan (bat), Murray (portrait), Payne, etc......







AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 check-list........74 subjects

350/460 Series.....................28 subjects

Berger
Bradley (bat)
Burch (fielding)
Cobb (bat off shoulder)
Conroy (bat)
Crawford (bat)
Jennings (one hand)
Jennings (two hands)
Jordan (bat)
Lajoie (bat)
Lake (no ball)
Leach (cap)
Leifield (bat)
Manning (pitching)
McQuillan (bat)
Mullin (bat)
Overall (yellow sky)
Pelty (vertical)
Pfeister (throwing)
F. Smith (Chicago & Boston)

Steinfeldt (bat)
Tinker (bat off shoulder)
Wagner (bat on right)
Doc White (pitching)
Wilhelm (bat)
Willetts
Willis (bat)
Wiltse (pitching)


460-only Series.....................46 subjects

Abbaticcio (blue sleeves)
Ball (Cleveland)
Bell (pitching)
Bergen (catching)
Bescher (hands in air)
Bridwell (portrait-cap)
Camnitz (arms at side)
Camnitz (arms above head)
Chance (bat)
Chase (trophy)
Crandall (portrait-cap)
Devore
Doyle (portrait)
Duffy
Ford
Frill
Gandil
Geyer
Herzog (Boston)
Howell (hand on waist)

Hummell
Lake (with ball)
Latham
Marquard (follow thru)
McGraw (portrait-cap)
McGraw (glove at hip)
Merkle (throwing)
Meyers (portrait)
Murray (portrait)
Needham
Oldring (bat)
Overall (blue sky)
Payne
Pfeffer
Schaefer (Washington)
Schulte (back view)
Schlei (portrait)
Schlei (bat)
Seymour (portrait)
Sheckard (glove)

H. Smith (Brooklyn)
Stovall (bat)
Tannehill (Chicago)
Tinker (bat on shoulder)
Wheat
Wiltse (portrait-cap)



Note **
Other sources claim there are 75 subjects in the AB 460 sub-set. However, my research indicates that 74 subjects were printed with the AB 460 backs.
The subject of contention is Ames (hands over head). I am confident in my research. So, I will reward anyone in this forum $200, if they can show me
this AMES card with a legitimate AB 460 back.


TED Z
.

[KingFisk]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Hi Carl

Thanks for posting your T206 story. I always advise collectors to acquire large lots of T206's when starting their sets. So, you were very smart to pick up the large lot of 200 cards.
So, don't have any regrets. These current "crazy" prices on Cobb's (and, other major T206 stars), in my opinion will not continue. Prices will eventually fall back to normal.

And, thanks for the kind words.


TED Z
.

Thanks, Ted! That was a reassuring post. Much appreciated.

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