New allegations on BO

[Peter_Spaeth]

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1297351

The title of the thread there is
Brent Huigens & PWCC Used pwcc_auctions ID to Buy Cards for Gary Moser to Trim/Alter

[ullmandds]

No doubt they are engaged in a menage a trois of sorts...imho that is.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

No doubt they are engaged in a menage a trois of sorts...imho that is.

Looks more like a pas de deux to me.

[swarmee]

My latest email to Steve Sloan (Cc: Betsy):

Steve, you should really cut all ties with PWCC: no more advertising, no more submissions, no more radio show call-ins, no more nothing. Go cold turkey.

If they buy back the fraudulent cards sold through their service and eliminate the sales, how much does your grade guarantee really come into play?

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1297351

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=269654

The FBI can't be far behind. Please don't shred any "evidence"; Brent doesn't even know the definition of that word.
Thanks!

[swarmee]

Remember the two things that went missing on the internet this week: pre-2015 back scans and obfuscated buyer ids...

[CobbSpikedMe]

This doesn't even surprise me at this point. That's sad.

[chalupacollects]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Remember the two things that went missing on the internet this week: pre-2015 back scans and obfuscated buyer ids...

And I'm sure any official investigators would find that tidbit most interesting...you might say the evidence you can't see may be the most damning...

[cubman1941]

Originally Posted by swarmee

My latest email to Steve Sloan (Cc: Betsy):

Don't disagree but then what about our site which has PWCC ad in banner?

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by cubman1941

Don't disagree but then what about our site which has PWCC ad in banner?

that's leon's preference to continue to associate with a crook!

[MULLINS5]

"I really do not get it why people are slamming him. must be jealousy simply because he is successful at what he does and has a big following of buyers and sellers. All I see is he is trying hard to make the hobby a better place for everyone. What other seller out there is trying to do something for the good of it instead of trying to rip everyone off?" - Bobby Binder VCP (April, 2017).

[Republicaninmass]

Could be a similar response

" As (insert whatever helps here) is a federal offense, it is common that the FBI becomes involved to achieve restitution from the suspected party. In this particular case, there may be an open FBI investigation, and we recommend that any parties involved reach out to that organization directly"

Paraphrased from a TPG, until my grades ship next werk

[aloondilana]

Originally Posted by swarmee

My latest email to Steve Sloan (Cc: Betsy):

How do you write Steve Sloan an email blaming Brent?

I'm not saying Brent is innocent or guilty, but my god.
PSA is much more at fault than anyone who messed with these cards.

PSA is paid for their service to accurately grade cards.
PSA graded these "trainwrecks" I place all the blame on PSA!

PSA is who put these cards back on the street with a much higher value.

Again, The complete blame is PSA
Either there is a very crooked grader on PSA's payroll or PSA is deeply involved.
Either way, an email to Steve Sloan is kind of laughable.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by aloondilana

How do you write Steve Sloan an email blaming Brent?

I'm not saying Brent is innocent or guilty, but my god.
PSA is much more at fault than anyone who messed with these cards.

PSA is paid for their service to accurately grade cards.
PSA graded these "trainwrecks" I place all the blame on PSA!

PSA is who put these cards back on the street with a much higher value.

Again, The complete blame is PSA
Either there is a very crooked grader on PSA's payroll or PSA is deeply involved.
Either way, an email to Steve Sloan is kind of laughable.

Agreed. Watch the 30-for-30 short, "Holy Grail." As Keith O. says, "the expertise is the fraud." What expertise? At best if you don't believe they were knowingly complicit in this type of thing - it's sloppy and careless. Joe Blow grader (who we know nothing about, have no qualifications on...) looks at X card for 37 seconds and decides it's a PSA 6 because he cannot see the subtle work that was done to get rid of marks or fix corners from when the card was a PSA 3 or a 4. What is professional or expert about that? Nothing.

[slidekellyslide]

I personally don't believe PSA is involved in anything other than being negligent in their grading. Do I think they have knowledge that PWCC, Moser and the rest of the bums were sending in doctored cards? Nope. I think they have a bunch of overworked graders whose eyes glaze over after an hour or so of work.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by aloondilana

How do you write Steve Sloan an email blaming Brent?

Investigative technique to see who will flip on who first. I wanted him to put pressure on PWCC to END ALL THEIR CURRENT AUCTIONS before PSA's liability continues to increase by more sales of altered cards in PSA slabs.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Looks more like a pas de deux to me.

You’re forgetting betsy.

[frankbmd]

Brent just needs to post another "calming" video for his investors on youtube. Problem solved. Where's Martin?

[swarmee]

1994 SkyBox Bongo Comics Simpsons Series 2 - Characters #S 23 - Martin Prince
Courtesy of COMC.com

Ivy League edumacated.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Brent just needs to post another "calming" video for his investors on youtube. Problem solved. Where's Martin?

PaulMaul is doing a pretty good impression:
https://forums.collectors.com/discus...ned-by-pwcc/p4

[Rookiemonster]

If this is true. RIP any card bought and sold through PWCC. All the cards they ever handled are pretty much deemed suspect from this moment on. Also a big blow for “High End” this backs what collectors have been saying for years. As to the idea that high grade card should not exist.

If true we all know this is not the first time someone has tried this and not the last. I also would that a lot of others scammers are out in the world doing this.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by Rookiemonster

If true we all know this is not the first time someone has tried this and not the last. I also would that a lot of others scammers are out in the world doing this.

Oh, Blowout has already identified 10 other scammers in the last couple of months. Hot and heavy trimming with BGS, mostly: Kevin Burge, SSI (Sliheets). Just spend a few days there in their member feedback section and it's like you've taken the red pill from The Matrix.

[topcat61]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

You’re forgetting betsy.

Looking at her profile on Linked In, she's not a stupid woman, and she has to know nearly everything this Auction House is doing. I haven't seen PWCC's financial statements but they claim $50 million in annual sales, so there are 2 things that can occur: 1. Since there appears to be more than enough evidence against PWCC in the form of Shill The only problem

[topcat61]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

You’re forgetting betsy.

First there's a lot of talk about Fraud and Shill Bidding without the words "alleged". My gut is telling me that all the investigating at Blowout Cards and what people here are saying is accurate, but I'd still go with the wording "alleged". Certainly people are angry with PWCC and Brent Huigens hasn't done himself any favors during that interview, but he isn't apart of a criminal investigation that I'm aware of.

I haven't seen PWCC's financial statements but they claim $50 million in annual sales which is a clear motive for an alleged fraud, but people have to be careful with these accusations from a legal standpoint at this point.

It's somewhat ambiguous to me that card doctoring is illegal but there is precedent for a potential indictment in the Bill Mastro and Doug Allen cases. These two cases could debunk Brent's assertion that "before and after" photos aren't evidence, but I suppose it isn't a crime unless the card is sold or the company knowingly sells items which have been altered and doesn't inform the purchaser. In order for someone to conclude that is the case -Before and after photos are just half of what's needed to build a case. There are 2 things which immediately come to mind: 1) If Shill Bidding is evident, (which is illegal) a forensic computer analyst should be involved with that. 2) Follow the money and emails and flip certain key people within. I don't think you can flip Betsy Huigens since she's married to Brent but the CFO, IT guys and low to mid level auction. operations guys can be much easier.

I wouldn't just look into PWCC but also PSA and see if there's a grader or two on the take looking the other way. Personally, I don't trust the grading companies and wouldn't submit a card with one.

Lastly, everyone is entitled to a defense -even Brent and Betsy Huigens and if there is any wrong doing, it should be settled in a courtroom, not a court of opinion. I'd say that if anyone truly feels that they have case against PWCC, that they should make it with the AG or their state, the Oregon AG or FBI for further investigation.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by topcat61

I wouldn't just look into PWCC but also PSA and see if there's a grader or two on the take looking the other way.

I haven't even posted this 50-page thread on blowout that was started like two days ago about BGS giving impossibly favorable grades to a former employee who is still friends with their graders:
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1297069

BGS is in on the scam. That I have no doubt. PSA I can still be convinced is just COMPLETELY INCOMPETENT. Also, I am not a lawyer. If someone wants to sue me or send me a C&D, maybe I can get one of you awesome barristers to represent me pro bono. Oddly enough, I have received zero emails/messages asking me to stop posting. As they say, "Sunlight is the best disinfectant."