Earliest Collectibles of Baseball Hall of Famers

[oldjudge]

Phil-On page 184 of the Old Judge book we have an image of a cabinet of the 1879 Dubuque Rabbits, league champions of the North West League. On that team were Hoss Radbourn and Charles Comiskey. There is some debate as to whether this piece is period but I have a copy that I have brought to a paper conservator who said that she believes that it is period.

[WillowGrove]

Originally Posted by Baseball Rarities

Any way that you could post the photo here? I would love to see it. If not, can you send me a copy to baseballrarities@cox.net?

I would imagine that since the Baltimore News cards were issued with the upcoming season's schedule on the back, that they were also initially issued sometime during spring training. It is probably impossible to know which was made first.

Here's the photo of Ruth with Baltimore. Both combined make up the complete shot. FYI - The HOF did not have this photo in their archives so they accepted a copy of it back in 1990.

Wish I had the time to research the date it was taken! Hope this helps. (Phil: Don't mean to make this a thread on Ruth)

thanks

[frohme]

Originally Posted by bcbgcbrcb

If anyone would like to work on that project and feed me the info, I would be happy to add that information to my listing at any time.

Sent you a PM, Phil.

[bcbgcbrcb]

I have just updated my listing with the 2011 inductees, Roberto Alomar, Pat Gillick & Bert Blyleven. Also, updated Ruth, Comiskey & Radbourne as per recommendations of fellow board members.

Thanks again guys and keep the updates coming!

[bcbgcbrcb]

It's been a while since I posted this list so I just thought I would try again and see if anyone can come up with any new updates?

[novakjr]

I'd suggest maybe adding a second tier for players that are currently listed on team cards or photos, to include their first collectible as an individual as well.

[fkw]

Hi, great list, this is the first time I read through it.

One correction...

Frank Frisch is found in the 1920 W519, 1920 W519-2-1, 1920 W519-2-2,
no Frisch is in the W520.


Also was curious on why you would include a picture of Berra as a 13 year old kid non-pro player, yet no other players have kids pics included???

I would think the cutoff should be as a PRO, otherwise the list would be dominated with family pics showing the players as babies or kid.

[bcbgcbrcb]

Thanks for the input, Frank. Corrections have been made on Frisch and Berra.

David:

Basically, the individual player list already exists on the webpage that Lyman and I designed on OldCardboard. Here is a link to it:

http://www.oldcardboard.com/ref/rookies/RookiesList.asp

[GaryPassamonte]

Phil,
There is an 1885 Cincinnati team image with McPhee in Lipset's current auction - Lot 15.
Also, there is an individual CdV of Spalding in REA 6/1996 auction Lot 52. The description lists 1866-68 as its date.

[bcbgcbrcb]

Thanks, Gary. I received Lew's catalogue yesterday in th email and saw the McPhee photo but did not get a chance to update my list yet, it has now been updated.

Would you happen to have a scan of the Spalding CDV? The REA website does not maintain archives that far back or do you have a copy of that catalogue with the lot description?

Thanks for your help!

[GaryPassamonte]

This isn't my forte, but here's a try.

[ElCabron]

So, wait, you're including photos even when they have cards or premiums? I thought you only used photos when there were no cards or premiums known to exist for a player. And broadsides, too? Not sure I understand the criteria. If photos count, nearly all of the Negro Leaguers have earlier items than what you have listed.

-Ryan

[bcbgcbrcb]

Very interesting, Gary, thank you so much for your efforts. I will go ahead and update the Albert Spalding collectible.

Ryan:

For this "Earliest Collectible" list, I have included both individual as well as team photos, with the only real limitation is that the item must coincide closely with the beginning of their professional career (ie - no baby, little league photos, etc.) The HOF Rookies list on OldCardboard sticks to the more "traditional cards".

[slidekellyslide]

Phil, do you happen to have a photo of the 1915 Dazzy Vance Pittsburgh Post Green Sheet? I don't see that one listed on the OC website list. Thanks!

[bcbgcbrcb]

Here you go, Dan...........

[slidekellyslide]

Thanks Phil...I'm guessing it's a newspaper supplement?

[bcbgcbrcb]

More like a mini-booklet, the scan shows it open-faced with each page around 5" X 7"

[bcbgcbrcb]

Much thanks to Jodi B. for the latest update on Pat Gillick, a whopping 35 years earlier than his previously listed collectible!!!

[h2oya311]

I haven't been on this forum in a while, but I have a 1909 Lancaster Red Roses (Tri-State - Minor League) Team Postcard with Mr. Stan Coveleski on it. It was his first year of professional baseball.

I assume this would trump the 1914 Team PC you have listed at the beginning of this thread. I'd be happy to post a picture when I get home from work tonight, if anyone is interested.

Probably not too many of these floating around out there...

[E93]

There is always the 1910 E93 Standard Caramel.

[bcbgcbrcb]

I believe that the E93 is another Coveleski other than Stan.

The 1909 Lancaster P/C is the earliest Coveleski piece, I am going to update my listing right now. Thanks you for the info.

[benchod]

Harry

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by bcbgcbrcb

I believe that the E93 is another Coveleski other than Stan.

The 1909 Lancaster P/C is the earliest Coveleski piece, I am going to update my listing right now. Thanks you for the info.

You need to update that Dazzy Vance listing too.

[benchod]

Harry Coveleski played for Lancaster in 1908
Are you sure the postcard depicts Stan?

[bcbgcbrcb]

Craig:

Actually both Coveleskis are pictured and named on the postcard.

Dan:

Vance is now updated, thanks for your input.

[benchod]

Thanks
Would like to see a scan of the pc, Phil
The e93 is Harry "the Giant killer"

[bcbgcbrcb]

Here's a scan of the Lancaster postcard, the other Coveleski pictured is J. Coveleski.

[benchod]

Thanks Phil
No wonder they were champions with Harry and Stan pitching!

[ls7plus]

Boy, am I glad that I'm not a completionist with regard to my collection of HOF'ers--pure unobtainium!

Larry

[bcbgcbrcb]

Larry:

With a lot of wit and a great deal of patience (some money doesn't hurt either), a complete set of Hall of Famers, even with all career contemporary cards, seems possible, maybe not Rookie Cards but upgrades can always be made later on.

[pro9]

Regarding Stan Coveleski, I believe his earliest collectible would be the May 16, 1909 North American Supplement, which depicts him on the Lancaster team.

[bcbgcbrcb]

If you could post a scan of that North American Supplement, I will add it to the list for Coveleski.

[ksfarmboy]

Phil, here's a pic of Sam Crawford with the 1899 Chathams of the Canadian League. It was sold in the same auction as the Beckley Lincoln cabinet. Another update for your list. Sorry for the poor picture but it's the best I can do. Crawford is far left in the top row.

[bcbgcbrcb]

Thanks for the pics, Clint. Beckley & Crawford have now been updated.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by ksfarmboy

Phil, here's a pic of Sam Crawford with the 1899 Chathams of the Canadian League. It was sold in the same auction as the Beckley Lincoln cabinet. Another update for your list. Sorry for the poor picture but it's the best I can do. Crawford is far left in the top row.

Both of those in the same lot?? Where was I at when that auction was going on??

[bcbgcbrcb]

Dan:

My guess is that they were both sold during the same event but not as one lot.

[ksfarmboy]

Dan, you may not have been collecting Nebraska baseball then. It was Christies 1995 auction and they were two different lots. Misplaced my bid sheet so I don't know how much they went for.

[slidekellyslide]

I was collecting Lincoln minor league stuff, but I was woefully ignorant of the large auction houses in 1995...I think the only baseball memorabilia auction that I was aware of around that time was the Jerry Smolin/Barry Sloate auctions and that's because the catalogs came tucked inside the SCD magazine.

[ksfarmboy]

Dan, Yeah the same for me. This was about the time I started getting into the big auctions. The estimates were $800-$1000 on both of them. I still can't find my prices realized on them.

[383astro]

Do you have a pic of the 1950 Atlanta Crackers team picture (Mathews)? I would like to see this. Thanks

[bcbgcbrcb]

The Atlanta Crackers team photo was in a MEARS auction several months ago. If they have an auction archive, it would be in there.

[383astro]

awesome, thanks. Have you ever thought about adding in some of the baseball greats that arent in the HOF? Like Maris, Marion, Hodges, Kluszewski, Santo, Munson, Kaat, Cash, etc.

[bcbgcbrcb]

If you go beyond HOF'ers, which is a relatively small and well-defined group, where would you draw the line to stop?

I recently posted a similar thought about researching non-HOF'ers rookie cards for pre-war players but no one responded that they wanted to get involved.

[bcbgcbrcb]

Just made a few more updates today. Does anyone else have anything to add at this point?

[Andy Sandler]

Hi! Some things I collect are high school and college yearbooks with hall of fame players and other famous athletes pictured. I would love to find a Bucknell University yearbook with Christy Mathewson in it as well as a Sandy Koufax high school yearbook. I currently have over a hundred others such as Cum Posey, Miller Huggins, John Wayne, Jerry West, Bill Russell, Jim Brown, Tiger Woods, Tom Seaver, Robert Zuppke, Ray Berry, Ollie Matson, Red Grange, Bob Lilly, Bob Cousy, Adolph Rupp, Willis Reed, etc. In these, you see them as teenagers and more than just statistics!!
Thanks, Andy Sandler alwysyakn@aol.com (845) 331-8610 NY

[triwak]

Andy, have you ever encountered any photos/memorabilia/cards of Negro Leaguer and HOFer Bill (Willie) Foster? After his playing days, he coached baseball at his alma mater, Alcorn State College, from 1960-77. I've always wondered if there were any team issues picturing him. Thanks ~ Ken

[Kenny Cole]

Ken,

Here's a circa 1927 photo of Willie Foster from the Foster Estate.

Kenny Cole

[DanP]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

Ken,

Here's a circa 1927 photo of Willie Foster from the Foster Estate.

Kenny Cole

WOW! What a great piece...

[bcbgcbrcb]

Kenny:

Very nice, that's not the one from the recent Hake's Auction, is it?

[Kenny Cole]

Phil,

No, I bought it about 6 years ago.

Kenny